DIY: S65 M3 Rod Bearing

[Assimilator1]

It's not cheap either, isn't it a few hundred $?

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

A dipstick can be added, but the time to do it would have been when the pan was off since it must be off to weld the bung. I did not do it first rod bearing change but might do it during the next one. I think Bimmerworld sells the kit but maybe it is another vendor.

Yup, BW has the kit

[Davisca455]

Originally Posted by Davisca455

Thanks to SYT_Shadow for creating the Rod Bearing DIY!
The car:
2008 E92 DCT, Northern California car, Sacramento area all its life.
65,253 miles on original rod bearings.
Supercharged for approximately 59,000 miles.
The car has always been very well maintained, always garaged, always warmed up (unless a borrower didn't?), but not babied.
4 HPDE events.

Started installation of BE Bearings and Bolts on 2/4/21
20 mile test drive on 2/5/21

I read the original post and Theodores notes 3 times.
Bought all my parts and borrowed an engine brace from SAMM3Y.
Watched the video twice, then went for it.

I did this on a friend's (cars original owner) 2 post lift.

Wednesday evening 2/3/21:
Put the car on the lift and opened up both oil drains. After watching the video I was hoping to keep the dripping to a minimum.

Thursday 11:00am 2/4/21:
Disassembled the car and pulled the pan.
I thought I might go home after pulling the pan to let it drip some more, but it really wasn't bad at all, so I kept after it until I had all the new bearings and bolts installed.
I decided it would be a good thing to install the oil piping before heading home for the night, since all those fasteners use blue Loctite (242) and I wanted the Loctite to have a chance to fully cure before adding oil. So I flushed out all of the threaded holes with alcohol and cleaned all of the fasteners with alcohol as well.
Installed all the piping and called it a night, after something like 9.5 hours.

Friday 8:00am 2/5/21:
Reassembled the car minus all the undertrays and front tires, installed the two new drain plugs, removed the old oil filter, suctioned the filter housing dry, added the new filter kit, filled up the filter housing with oil, filled the crank case, reassembled all my supercharger intake piping, crossed my fingers and pushed the starter button. The car fired instantly, no knocking, no weird noises, no alarms. Got out of the car after about 3 minutes of run time, and while it was still running, I looked and listened all around the engine, above, below, stuck my head in each wheelwell to listen from there as well. The car ran for a total of 5 minutes.
I shut off the engine and raised the car to inspect for leaks and to install all of the undertray bits.
Took the car for a test drive.
It took me about 15 hours to do the entire job. That includes setting up and cleaning up.
Not a good pace to make a living at changing rod bearings for sure, but it was a good pace for me to be comfortable and do high quality work.

Crank Rod Journal Examples:
Attachment 2522439

Attachment 2522440

Starting at the front of the engine and progressing toward the transmission in order. All pictures have the Rod Shell on the left, or the bottom depending on how the pictures decided to upload.

#1
Attachment 2522444

#2
Attachment 2522445

#3 (Rod shell was relaxed and sitting gently on the crank)
Attachment 2522446

#4
Attachment 2522447

#5
Attachment 2522448

#6 (Rod shell was relaxed and sitting gently on the crank)
Attachment 2522449

#7 (Rod shell and cap shell were relaxed and sitting gently on the crank)
Attachment 2522450

#8
Attachment 2522451

One more piece of info for anyone that cares...here's my two oil reports just prior to the rod bearing upgrade.
At least in my case, the oil reports should not have been part of the decision of whether or not to upgrade the rod bearings.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Davisca455

One more piece of info for anyone that cares...here's my two oil reports just prior to the rod bearing upgrade.
At least in my case, the oil reports should not have been part of the decision of whether or not to upgrade the rod bearings.

Attachment 2525179
Attachment 2525180

Thank you for sharing. Unfortunately this is not the first time someone pulls out horrible bearings after getting good reports. Or the first time someone blows the engine after getting good reports.

[Flea7]

Ordered my bearings and bolts!
Thank you all the great info!
I'll keep you guys updated on my install.

[TX]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

Thank you for sharing. Unfortunately this is not the first time someone pulls out horrible bearings after getting good reports. Or the first time someone blows the engine after getting good reports.

I must say that really adds a kink in the whole test your oil samples routine. His bearings looked crummy along with a clean oil report. Problem is it is just one report, without any track record. The damage could have been done and possibly caught with better history, but who really knows...
I'll repost my reports from ~7 years and the bearings that went along with them.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by TX

That's interesting. When i picked up my car I was told it had 10.5L and was showing >Max, but wasn't showing it during their test drive. I opted to fix it at home. I drained 1/2L from the front plug and it was happy after that.
10L might be the sweet spot after an overnight drain and pan removal.

Seems about right, believe I filled with 9.7-9.8L after new rod shells (to end up at Max). The sensor did play some tricks which it never done before so filled and drained for a bit. Seems it takes a number of days before stabilizing after the sump has been empty.

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by TX

I must say that really adds a kink in the whole test your oil samples routine. His bearings looked crummy along with a clean oil report. Problem is it is just one report, without any track record. The damage could have been done and possibly caught with better history, but who really knows...
I'll repost my reports from ~7 years and the bearings that went along with them.

Those reports are not reassuring. Intermittently high lead levels. And who knows how much wear there was in the much greater mileage of the previous owner. I would rely on oil reports only if I bough the car new and tested from the start, which I doubt I will ever do. In my 50 years of driving, I have bought 2 cars new and one of those was this year. I think I did one oil analysis back in the 80s.

[Scharbag]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

Those reports are not reassuring. Intermittently high lead levels. And who knows how much wear there was in the much greater mileage of the previous owner. I would rely on oil reports only if I bough the car new and tested from the start, which I doubt I will ever do. In my 50 years of driving, I have bought 2 cars new and one of those was this year. I think I did one oil analysis back in the 80s.

I have done oil samples in the past. The only value I have received is it was able to detect an intake hose failure due to high silicon levels in my old turbo VW. Shure as sh!t, the hose was cracked.

In theory, oil sampling should be able to detect lots of issues but I am unconvinced it is really worth it given that some very rotten bearings come out after a clean sample result.

Cheers,

[Davisca455]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

Those reports are not reassuring. Intermittently high lead levels. And who knows how much wear there was in the much greater mileage of the previous owner. I would rely on oil reports only if I bough the car new and tested from the start, which I doubt I will ever do. In my 50 years of driving, I have bought 2 cars new and one of those was this year. I think I did one oil analysis back in the 80s.

Ya, previous owners!
I bought the car at 41,000 miles from the original (previous) owner, and I changed the rod bearings at his house 2 years later with 65,000 miles.

The prior discussion we had about the condition of this M3's rod bearings went something like...

PO:
I really doubt there is anything wrong with the rod bearings. I always garaged the car, always warmed it up, always serviced it.

Me:
And I always garage it, always warm it up, and I change the oil every 4000-5000 miles.
But dude, every picture I see of rod bearings, they just don't look normal to me. I'm gonna change them so I don't have to wonder anymore. I don't care if they look normal and I'm mad at myself for changing them.

So I have the pan off and I have 3 or 4 sets of old rod bearings sitting on top of the toolbox.
The PO walks over to check on my progress and begins to look at the bearings.
He says "Umm, these don't look very good. Good call on changing them."
Then as he turns to leave he shakes his head from side to side and says "Fuckin previous owner!"

[Assimilator1]

Lol

Might actually be doing mine in the next few weeks!

[Theodore]

Just came across this video and thought readers of this thread might be interested.

[Assimilator1]

Just reposting this in case anyone else's PAS pipe mount shears off instead of undoing! The mount isn't available from BMW for the M3.
Also wondered if anyone here would be able to answer my pulley question (nobody has at the other thread).

Oh, and yea oil analysis is not reliable for tracking rod bearing wear (see my sig), unless, like phonsalb said, it's done right from the start, i.e the very 1st engine oil change, even then there is some question as to whether it would pick up all cases.

Originally Posted by Assimilator1

Has anyone found a replacement for the double studded rubber mount (aka bobbin) that holds the PAS pipe to the bracket? (which bolts to the subframe).

It's the part that nut, item no 15 screws to in the diagram below the PS pump in the op at this thread.

I ended up using a mount intended for VW engine covers, turned out to be a perfect fit, and slightly thicker so stronger!
You can get Febi ones (part no 23304).
And apparently the VW part no is 059 103 658A (which appears to be Febi anyway).
This shows the original BMW one vs the VW/Febi one (the original BMW one had sheared off through the rubber, I'd glued it with silicone, but it wouldn't have held for long).


If anyone wants an exact match and not one slightly stronger (why? lol), then this one seems to be the job VW 037 133 567F, air pump rubber mount apparently.

Also, has anyone ordered the INA tensioner pulleys lately?
I bought 2 today from GSF, the INA 5320557100 AC tensioner pulley and the alternator tensioner pulley INA 5320342100.

The alternator tensioner pulley was exactly the same size, although it did have a bolt with a large washer crimped to the bolt, it was easily screwed off. Much cheaper at about £20 , vs BMWs pulley and arm at ~£150!!

The AC tensioner was however a slightly smaller diameter (~4mm), that said, the pulley I had on there wasn't genuine anyway (although it was INA) so maybe that was wrong in the 1st place? (interestingly it was exactly the same size as the alternator tensioner pulley).
My car's build is 4/2008, which annoyingly is right at the change over point between 2 different PAS/AC tensioner pulley and belt config's. The belt on my car is a PK 1067.
Anyone know which size pulley it should have?

Oh and yea, I finally did my rod bearings ~1mth ago

[Davisca455]

Originally Posted by Assimilator1

Also, has anyone ordered the INA tensioner pulleys lately?
I bought 2 today from GSF, the INA 5320557100 AC tensioner pulley and the alternator tensioner pulley INA 5320342100.

The alternator tensioner pulley was exactly the same size, although it did have a bolt with a large washer crimped to the bolt, it was easily screwed off. Much cheaper at about £20 , vs BMWs pulley and arm at ~£150!!

The AC tensioner was however a slightly smaller diameter (~4mm), that said, the pulley I had on there wasn't genuine anyway (although it was INA) so maybe that was wrong in the 1st place? (interestingly it was exactly the same size as the alternator tensioner pulley).
My car's build is 4/2008, which annoyingly is right at the change over point between 2 different PAS/AC tensioner pulley and belt config's. The belt on my car is a PK 1067.
Anyone know which size pulley it should have?

This link shows everything I found out on pulley rollers.

https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=26791901

[0100]

Need to pick up a few more items before I start this.

What blue loctite are you guys using?

What assembly lube do you recommend?

Any advice on Tq wrench, debating on just getting a 3/8" or a 1/4" and 1/2"...

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by 0100

Need to pick up a few more items before I start this.

What blue loctite are you guys using?

What assembly lube do you recommend?

Any advice on Tq wrench, debating on just getting a 3/8" or a 1/4" and 1/2"...

I use regular blue loctite, what you find in Autozone

You can either not use assembly lube and rock oil or get the lucasoil one, or the redline version.

For the torque wrench, it had to hit 50ftlb, I use a 1/2 for that

[0100]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I use regular blue loctite, what you find in Autozone

You can either not use assembly lube and rock oil or get the lucasoil one, or the redline version.

For the torque wrench, it had to hit 50ftlb, I use a 1/2 for that

Looks like 243 blue loctite is the new version that is suppose to be more oil tolerant. I think I will grab that.

Still debating on Red Line 80319 lube or motor oil. Probably going to try the redline lube.

The Tq wrench is going to keep me up at night. I can't pull the trigger on one.

Yes I over think everything too much...

[Assimilator1]

If it helps, chose the one that has 50lbft not at the lower or upper end of its range.

I used engine oil for mine, if you do that though I'd pull the fuel pump fuse before you start the job, then start the engine and let it die. I forgot the latter part, and after I did the bearings I got a rattle on startup before the fuel ran out , even though it was only a second or 2.
When you've done the bearings, leave the fuse out and crank it until the oil pressure light goes out, then stop, put the fuse back in and fire her up .

[0100]

Originally Posted by Assimilator1

If it helps, chose the one that has 50lbft not at the lower or upper end of its range.

I used engine oil for mine, if you do that though I'd pull the fuel pump fuse before you start the job, then start the engine and let it die. I forgot the latter part, and after I did the bearings I got a rattle on startup before the fuel ran out , even though it was only a second or 2.
When you've done the bearings, leave the fuse out and crank it until the oil pressure light goes out, then stop, put the fuse back in and fire her up .

Yeah I think I am going to go with redline lube.

I am thinking a 3/8 torque wrench is the perfect one for this job. 10-100 ft lbs.

I am down to the 3/8" CDI $367 (2%), Quinn $160 (3%), or Icon $100 (4%).

From the YT test the Icon looks to be very accurate, much better then the published 4%.

[Davisca455]

Originally Posted by 0100

Yeah I think I am going to go with redline lube.

I am thinking a 3/8 torque wrench is the perfect one for this job. 10-100 ft lbs.

I am down to the 3/8" CDI $367 (2%), Quinn $160 (3%), or Icon $100 (4%).

From the YT test the Icon looks to be very accurate, much better then the published 4%.

I used LM assembly lube.
I didn't even know they made it, but when I was on FCP's site ordering gaskets and such, this popped up.
I was all "Hey, I use LM oil, so yes, add to cart."
I used a Snap-On 3/8" drive torque wrench that I borrowed from work.
Our torque wrenches are on 6 month calibration cycles, so I felt better knowing the thing had been checked recently.
You can send in a torque wrench to be calibrated for a nominal cost, if helps you sleep at night.

[0100]

Originally Posted by Davisca455

I used LM assembly lube.
I didn't even know they made it, but when I was on FCP's site ordering gaskets and such, this popped up.
I was all "Hey, I use LM oil, so yes, add to cart."
I used a Snap-On 3/8" drive torque wrench that I borrowed from work.
Our torque wrenches are on 6 month calibration cycles, so I felt better knowing the thing had been checked recently.
You can send in a torque wrench to be calibrated for a nominal cost, if helps you sleep at night.

Oh nice, will have to look into this assembly lube. Good advice on the tq wrench. Thanks!

[pbonsalb]

You can buy Permatex Ultra Slick assembly lube at Advance Auto and other chain and local auto parts stores.