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View Poll Results: Does your M3 see track time?
No way 29 10.86%
Not yet, but maybe in the future 93 34.83%
1-2 days per year 31 11.61%
3-5 days per year 47 17.60%
6-12 days per year 41 15.36%
Greater than 12 days a year 26 9.74%
Voters: 267. You may not vote on this poll

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      11-12-2012, 09:33 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorfast View Post
With that logic why even buy a 335i or 328i when you can just buy a Honda civic and save a load of $$. The M3 is a fantastic daily driver for someone who likes performance as well. It has all the comforts of a luxury car while having the performance of a sports car. Not everyone has the capabilities, money, tolerance for risk, desire, etc to track their cars.

M3's that see track time are by far in the minority. I'm not knocking tracking your car at all. I think it's awesome. But you sound very naive thinking the M3 is strictly a track car and not a daily driver for 99% of people out there.
but what's the point of the car having the performance if you don't use it? it's somewhat like buying an iphone 5 or galaxy s3 and only using it to make phone calls.
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      11-12-2012, 09:40 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Amri215 View Post
1) Yes I tend to look at my car so not sure what you mean here

2) Please tell me you are joking, the rates at which they are consumed between the street and track; are day and night, so again not sure what you mean here?

3) Maybe but not mine
paint damage can happen anywhere. in fact i get a lot more paint damage on the road with all those tiny rocks kicked up by transport trucks than on the track. besides, you're not driving a hand-made italian exotic. you're driving a souped up glorified dime-a-dozen 3 series. 10 years from now, your car will be worth nothing, and its resale value won't hold up just because the paint is pristine.

and yes brake pads and tires are consumables. and yes they wear out much more quickly on the track than on the street. what's your point? are you telling me you can afford to buy an expensive car like the M3 but are too poor to drop $1000 a year or so on pads and tires? no one said tracking is cheap, but unless you will be competing in 24h of nurburgring, or you really make minimum wage, going to the track will not break your budget.
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      11-12-2012, 09:50 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by RudyP View Post
There are lots of cars that can do this... Just about any Porsche for starters.
not in my budget ... the new 991 usually ends up at a 100k with the options I'm looking at.. Cayman was interesting but I don't like to looks so much.. I did not want to buy used.

what else? .. audi .. don't want AWD.. Merc - yuck.. and not good track cars.. Don't want to go back to the Japanese cars .. American.. Ford Mustang... hate the styling..

for the price point, nothing beats the M3.
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      11-12-2012, 09:55 PM   #48
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Spent wayyyyy to many years in a past life at the track racing/trackdays on two wheels. Want nothing to do with the track anymore. Purely a Starbucks coffee poser with my M!

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      11-12-2012, 10:01 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by canadian stig View Post
paint damage can happen anywhere. in fact i get a lot more paint damage on the road with all those tiny rocks kicked up by transport trucks than on the track. besides, you're not driving a hand-made italian exotic. you're driving a souped up glorified dime-a-dozen 3 series. 10 years from now, your car will be worth nothing, and its resale value won't hold up just because the paint is pristine.

and yes brake pads and tires are consumables. and yes they wear out much more quickly on the track than on the street. what's your point? are you telling me you can afford to buy an expensive car like the M3 but are too poor to drop $1000 a year or so on pads and tires? no one said tracking is cheap, but unless you will be competing in 24h of nurburgring, or you really make minimum wage, going to the track will not break your budget.
Your car is 4 yrs older than mine and your talking what I can and can't afford? it doesnt matter to me if its not a hand built exotic..its new

If my car was 5yrs old maybe I wouldnt give a crap about tracking it, but for now I prefer to use it spiritedly on the street, I in no way baby my car when driving it.. but I just dont want to accept the risks associated with going to the track
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      11-12-2012, 10:15 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by jphughan View Post
1)Paint issues would show up when you looked at the cars.

2) And brakes and tires are consumables anyway, so I don't see why increased wear would worry you there.

3) these cars were DESIGNED to be on the track
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amri215

1) Yes I tend to look at my car so not sure what you mean here

2) Please tell me you are joking, the rates at which they are consumed between the street and track; are day and night, so again not sure what you mean here?

3) Maybe but not mine
I made those points since you said you avoided buying cars that had been tracked because tracking cars causes those issues. If those are the reasons YOU don't track, I guess that's understandable -- but you're missing out. What's the point of paying to play by buying an M3 if you're not actually going to play? And I'd rather have a car with a few paint issues that has shown me an amazing time than an immaculate car that I never really enjoy to its potential. But since I track AND my paint is just fine thanks to clear bra, I win on both fronts. If you're really worried about paint, just put a bunch of painter's tape on the high-risk areas of the body for the track event. Lots of people do that, and no it doesn't mess up your paint when you remove it.

As for increased wear, 3-4 track days per year isn't going to make an appreciable difference in how long your brakes and tires last, especially with a novice driver on stock equipment. Once you get better and/or if you run a track that's especially hard on brakes, MAYBE increased brake wear will be noticeable even at that frequency, but by then you'll be going more often anyway and thus might be looking at dedicated track pads. And the tires that wear quickly on the track are the extreme summer tires (AD08, RE-11, Ecsta XS), and especially R compounds (NT01, PS Cup), not the just-short-of-extreme summer tires like PS2, PSS, or ExtremeContact DW.

Do yourself a favor and go attend a local track event as a spectator; it should only cost like $20, which is worth the price of admission just for the car porn and to talk to fellow enthusiasts. But your real goal for that $20 will be to catch a ride with an instructor or advanced run group student (if they're allowed to take passengers at that event) who rocks an E9x M3 -- then try to come back here and say that you don't feel you're missing out. Hell, it doesn't even have to be an E9x. My instructor has an E36 M3 with nothing but upgraded pads, a square tire setup, and modest suspension mods to achieve neutral handling, and he still blows me away with how fast he can go in that thing.
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      11-12-2012, 10:28 PM   #51
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Only 1-2 track days a year at this point. I haven't had the chance to take the latest configuration to the track...
im surprised! thought you were a junkie. ive been about a dozen times in the last year and the frequency seems to keep increasing. i will probably average at least once a month over the next year.
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      11-12-2012, 11:07 PM   #52
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Been once in the M3, about dozen times on 2 wheels. Planning on going once/month.
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      11-12-2012, 11:29 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amri215 View Post
Your car is 4 yrs older than mine and your talking what I can and can't afford? it doesnt matter to me if its not a hand built exotic..its new

If my car was 5yrs old maybe I wouldnt give a crap about tracking it, but for now I prefer to use it spiritedly on the street, I in no way baby my car when driving it.. but I just dont want to accept the risks associated with going to the track
Wow, didn't take long for the stereotypical bmw-driver douchebaggery to show up. Your car is newer than mine and you paid way more money than me. Hurray to you. Pat yourself on the back. You're so damn rich and successful. Good for you. Would you like a cookie for that? I'm glad that after paying half what you did, I still ended up with the exact same car, that gets the exact same recognition on the street, and that is just as fast as your car, with a whole lot of extra $$$ on my hand to use for future performance upgrades for even more speed, starting with paying the fees for trackdays to upgrade the loose nut behind the wheel
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      11-13-2012, 12:20 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Team Plutonium View Post
BTW, I always love when people come here (especially on these threads) and tell other people how they should drive their M3. That they wasted their money when they don't track it, or they should've bought a different car. Give me a fucking break. I'd love to meet folks like these on the track and see what they got... probably just a big mouth, little balls and no skill.

Everybody is enjoying their car differently, so just shut the fuck up and let folks drive their car how they want to.
+1. If the M3 was designed for the track it would have came with better brakes and more supportive seats from the factory (not to mention be a few hundred lbs lighter).

With that said, it's totally true that you can't understand the capabilities of this car without driving it properly on a race track.
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      11-13-2012, 12:33 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Team Plutonium
BTW, I always love when people come here (especially on these threads) and tell other people how they should drive their M3. That they wasted their money when they don't track it, or they should've bought a different car. Give me a fucking break. I'd love to meet folks like these on the track and see what they got... probably just a big mouth, little balls and no skill.

Everybody is enjoying their car differently, so just shut the fuck up and let folks drive their car how they want to.
This. It's not for me to tell you how should enjoy your car.

I track 4-6 a year in my m3. I'd like to do more but in all honesty I'd get a dedicated track car and not track the m3 if i did a lot of track days. You don't need an expensive car to enjoy tracking.
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      11-13-2012, 12:38 AM   #56
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This. It's not for me to tell you how should enjoy your car.

I track 4-6 a year in my m3. I'd like to do more but in all honesty I'd get a dedicated track car and not track the m3 if i did a lot of track days. You don't need an expensive car to enjoy tracking.
I've done 12 track days this year. I'd love to get a dedicated car, but some of us have wives that are nice enough to allow us to have at least one "fun" car. My wife said I can get a dedicated track car, but I'll have to sell the M3 and this "track car" needs to have a baby seat in the back when needed. So E9X M3 it is!
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      11-13-2012, 12:44 AM   #57
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Only 1 trip to Ring this year unfortunately...time issues like a bunch of others here.
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      11-13-2012, 12:48 AM   #58
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Well you're all convincing me. I tracked my prior modded WRX but I've been hesitant with the M due to costs and risks.
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      11-13-2012, 12:56 AM   #59
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The risk is what makes the track enjoyable. Your relying on your skills and balls to keep from turning your car into a pile of junk. This car cost a lot more than 1000 a year to campaign whoever said that is high. More like 1000 a weekend.
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      11-13-2012, 01:01 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by canadian stig View Post
Wow, didn't take long for the stereotypical bmw-driver douchebaggery to show up. Your car is newer than mine and you paid way more money than me. Hurray to you. Pat yourself on the back. You're so damn rich and successful. Good for you. Would you like a cookie for that? I'm glad that after paying half what you did, I still ended up with the exact same car, that gets the exact same recognition on the street, and that is just as fast as your car, with a whole lot of extra $$$ on my hand to use for future performance upgrades for even more speed, starting with paying the fees for trackdays to upgrade the loose nut behind the wheel
And this is the sterotypical bmw d-bag response by a butt hurt, older car owner trying to justify to themseleves their cars are the same as newer models

If I want to track, I will get a dedicated track car and mod it to be only that a "track car"..just not a priority for me right now.

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      11-13-2012, 01:05 AM   #61
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The risk is what makes the track enjoyable. Your relying on your skills and balls to keep from turning your car into a pile of junk. This car cost a lot more than 1000 a year to campaign whoever said that is high. More like 1000 a weekend.
I find driving in rush hour traffic in California far more risky than my time at the track. I'm actually tense driving in traffic because of other drivers around me while I'm completely calm and relaxed at the track.

I'll take a controlled environment with generally decent drivers over uncontrolled surrounded by people who should have never gotten a driver's license in the first place.
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      11-13-2012, 01:11 AM   #62
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I find driving in rush hour traffic in California far more risky than my time at the track. I'm actually tense driving in traffic because of other drivers around me while I'm completely calm and relaxed at the track.

I'll take a controlled environment with generally decent drivers over uncontrolled surrounded by people who should have never gotten a driver's license in the first place.
+1
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      11-13-2012, 08:20 AM   #63
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but what's the point of the car having the performance if you don't use it? it's somewhat like buying an iphone 5 or galaxy s3 and only using it to make phone calls.
Who says I dont use the performance? I dont need to go to a track to have some fun blasting a highway onramp or taking some tight curves. The braking power also comes in handy when the highway comes to a sudden stop in rush hour

I think you are confused about what the M3 was designed for. Its a street car that can be taken to the track, not the other way around.
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      11-13-2012, 09:08 AM   #64
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Who says I dont use the performance? I dont need to go to a track to have some fun blasting a highway onramp or taking some tight curves. The braking power also comes in handy when the highway comes to a sudden stop in rush hour

I think you are confused about what the M3 was designed for. Its a street car that can be taken to the track, not the other way around.
Like I said above, go to a local track event as a spectator and catch a ride in an M3, then try to come back and say that the accelerating, braking, and cornering you do on the street is just as fun. I think you'll be amazed at how much faster you can get through corners than you are right now (or at least how much more safely, smoothly, and confidently you can get through corners at your current speed).
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      11-13-2012, 09:26 AM   #65
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Why do the general M3 forum threads get so hostile? I don't give a shit how you drive your car, but it is kinda low class to insult each other because someone doesn't track it or because you have a brand new M3 or whatever. FWIW, anyone in the 12+ days a year category is likely spending enough on fees, hotels, and tires to buy a second M3 anyway.
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      11-13-2012, 09:34 AM   #66
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Houston MSR (in Angleton), Texas World Speedway in College Station, and coming in March, Circuit of the Americas in Austin!

Just go to www.thedriversedge.net and sign up. Great HPDE organizers that run several Texas tracks, so you get a consistent experience wherever you go, and their 2-day events are far better from a fun, value, travel justification, and long-term learning perspective than the normal 1-day offerings. Lots of members here including myself run with them and love it.

Paint worries are exaggerated IMHO, especially if you have clear bra. Not really any worse than road hazards. As for feeling not ready, that's the perfect mindset. People who think they'll impress everyone their first time and go out with something to prove are the ones who risk learning a hard lesson. Approaching it with excited trepidation is the way to go.

The one thing to check is your insurance coverage. If your normal carrier doesn't cover HPDEs (most don't anymore, sadly), Lockton has HPDE insurance on a stated-value basis.
Thanks for the tips! I'll be sure to check those out. I might try M-school first to get me warmed up. It's really expensive but it looks like a blast.
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