How can I explain M-DCT is not same as automatic padal shift?

[shksman]

Friend, who drives hyundai gen. coupe 2.0 turbo, piss me off. He says it does same thing as his automatic padal shift.

[Cyrax91]

Ask him if when he downshifts his car rev matches for him.

[doc19]

Originally Posted by shksman

Friend, who drives hyundai gen. coupe 2.0 turbo, piss me off. He says it does same thing as his automatic padal shift.

I mean, this may be semantics, but they do the same thing in a sense, in that they allow you to shift via paddle or let you put the car in "automatic" mode. But how they do it is very different and I would rather have a DCT than a "Manumatic."

So...

The ZF 6HP26 transmission that the Hyundai uses is pretty cool, its a 6 speed automatic and was actually used in the e65 7 series... but in the end it still has a slush box and a torque converter. It's closer to an automatic than anything.

The DCT is closer to a manual. It actually can be looked at as having two separate manual drives for even/odd gears, each with their own clutch, hence "dual clutch." No torque converter here.

And besides, he drives a Hyundai Genesis, what are you worried about? (j/k)

[disapr]

Like this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_clutch_transmission

A dual clutch transmission, commonly abbreviated to DCT[1] (sometimes informally referred to as a twin-clutch gearbox, double clutch transmission, or similar variations thereof), is a differing type of semi-automatic or automated manual automotive transmission. It utilises two separate clutches[2] for odd and even gear sets. It can fundamentally be described as two separate manual transmissions (with their respective clutches) contained within one housing, and working as one unit.[1][3] They are usually operated in a fully automatic mode, and many also have the ability to allow the driver to manually shift gears,[2] albeit still carried out by the transmission's electro-hydraulics.

This type of transmission was invented by Frenchman Adolphe Kégresse just prior to World War II,[4] but he never developed a working model. The first actual DCTs arrived from a joint Porsche-Audi in-house development, for Audi and Porsche racing cars in the 1980s,[1] when computers to control the transmission became compact enough: the Porsche Doppelkupplungsgetriebe (English: dual clutch gearbox) (PDK)[1] used in the Porsche 956[1] and 962[1] Le Mans race cars from 1983,[1] and the Audi Sport Quattro S1 rally car.[4][5]

A dual clutch transmission eliminates the torque converter as used in conventional epicyclic-geared automatic transmissions.[2] Instead, dual clutch transmissions that are currently on the market primarily use two oil-bathed wet multi-plate clutches, similar to the clutches used in most motorcycles, though dry clutch versions are also available.[6]

The first series production road car to be fitted with a DCT was the 2003 Volkswagen Golf Mk4 R32.[1][7][8]

As of 2009, the largest number of sales of DCTs in Western Europe are by various marques of the German Volkswagen Group,[9] though this is anticipated to lessen as other transmission makers and vehicle manufacturers make DCTs available in series production automobiles.[1][10] In 2010, on BMW Canada's website for the 3 Series Coupe, it is described both as a 7-speed double clutch transmission and as a 7-speed automatic transmission. It is actually a dual clutch semi-automatic.[11][12]

[shksman]

Originally Posted by 4G63

Just tell him the friendship is over because you're too embarrassed to hang out with someone who drives a hyundai.

HAHA! That's what I am saying. How is it possible to compare bmw and hyundai.
I am not saying m3 is best car in the world, still compare to hyundai is cruel.

[Edward]

What do you have to prove? People always ask me "oh you're using paddles? cool bro, my clk 320/Audi A3/ML350/IS300/insert any car also has shifter buttons, but I never use em." Going on to describe what a dual clutch is versus an automatic with shifter paddles or buttons is a pointless exercise that will leave them wondering wtf you just said.

DCT is an automated manual that uses a very different technology to achieve the fast as hell shifts. To a typical person, it is the same damn thing as an automatic.

[shksman]

Originally Posted by Edward

What do you have to prove? People always ask me "oh you're using paddles? cool bro, my clk 320/Audi A3/ML350/IS300/insert any car also has shifter buttons, but I never use em." Going on to describe what a dual clutch is versus an automatic with shifter paddles or buttons is a pointless exercise that will leave them wondering wtf you just said.

DCT is an automated manual that uses a very different technology to achieve the fast as hell shifts. To a typical person, it is the same damn thing as an automatic.

I tried explain how does dct works and it shift faster....He responses like that too.... He is that typical person. I just want to prove it's much better transmission then his...lol I think I will just let him drive my car, it will be easier and faster.

[Silvertige]

It is an automatic... lol. No, no, no, but try explaining that to a non-enthusiast. Which is what your friend is, by the way.

[Mookster]

LOL, sorry to break the news to ya but it is an autotragic...

[CoCr]

Originally Posted by Edward

What do you have to prove? People always ask me "oh you're using paddles? cool bro, my clk 320/Audi A3/ML350/IS300/insert any car also has shifter buttons, but I never use em." Going on to describe what a dual clutch is versus an automatic with shifter paddles or buttons is a pointless exercise that will leave them wondering wtf you just said.

DCT is an automated manual that uses a very different technology to achieve the fast as hell shifts. To a typical person, it is the same damn thing as an automatic.

The Audi a3 does have a dual clutch transmission.

[luis_m3]

Honestly, I just give up. Unless the person is an enthusiast, I just say; "yeah it's automatic"... Because they really don't get it.

Originally Posted by Silvertige

It is an automatic... lol. No, no, no, but try explaining that to a non-enthusiast. Which is what your friend is, by the way.

[jrlee53]

Take him for a ride on an empty road at night and then ask him, do you still think it does the same thing?

[gatorfast]

Your friend is right - your car will padle shift the same as his. One is a dual clutch and one is a traditional torque converter but in the end the result is the same - shifting with padles.

[Poofyo101]

buy a 6MT
Problem Solved.

[ChrisK]

OP - Just tell him its the same type of trans that's in the Ferrari 458 Italia

[shksman]

Originally Posted by Poofyo101

buy a 6MT
Problem Solved.

I just love dct so much~ I rather punch my friend's face....lol

[F82_SID]

Originally Posted by Poofyo101

buy a 6MT
Problem Solved.

This is exactly word for word what I was about to type!

DCT may have two clutchs but the fact that you CAN drive it in automatic mode means that it is an automatic in my eyes. (Although a very good and unique automatic). When people want to "play" and pretend to be a pro driver then they can choose to shift on thier own (myself included). If I wanted the fastest car possible then I will admit DCT is the way to go.

I feel like this is the Dodge Neon SRT4 driver who gets mad when people call his car a Neon. He then quickly responds "its not a Neon! Its an SRT4". Whatever, its a Neon. I dont get mad when people call my M3 a 3 series.

[LarThaL]

A dual clutch transmission is most definitely an automatic transmission. The mechanism may be different from a torque converter automatic, but it is still an automatic because it is capable of shifting gears automatically. I don't think this could be any clearer.

If it is capable of non-driver controlled shifting, then it is an automatic. Now, if they made a DCT that had to be shifted manually, then that would not be an automatic.

[captainaudio]

There is a huge differerence.

A DCT is a manual transmission that can be shifted manually or automatically.

A paddle shifted AT is an automatic transmission that can be shifted automcatically or manually.

Or maybe its the other way around.


In any case with the DCT you can drive in fully automatic mode or shift manually with the paddles while with the AT you can drive in fully automatic mode or shift manually with the paddles.


CA

[jcool10181]

Originally Posted by VVG

A dual clutch transmission is most definitely an automatic transmission. The mechanism may be different from a torque converter automatic, but it is still an automatic because it is capable of shifting gears automatically. I don't think this could be any clearer.

If it is capable of non-driver controlled shifting, then it is an automatic. Now, if they made a DCT that had to be shifted manually, then that would not be an automatic.

+1 DCT is still an automatic!

[F82_SID]

Originally Posted by captainaudio

There is a huge differerence.

A DCT is a manual transmission that can be shifted manually or automatically.

A paddle shifted AT is an automatic transmission that can be shifted automcatically or manually.

Or maybe its the other way around.


In any case with the DCT you can drive in fully automatic mode or shift manually with the paddles and with the AT you can drive in fully automatic mode or shift manually with the paddles.


CA

DCT is automatic and you just proved the point! Thank you!

[F82_SID]

Originally Posted by VVG

A dual clutch transmission is most definitely an automatic transmission. The mechanism may be different from a torque converter automatic, but it is still an automatic because it is capable of shifting gears automatically. I don't think this could be any clearer.

If it is capable of non-driver controlled shifting, then it is an automatic. Now, if they made a DCT that had to be shifted manually, then that would not be an automatic.

I would LOVE a DCT transmission that HAD to be shifted manually! Now we are talking!