How to emphasize the "look through"

pkimM3r · 02-25-2014, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkim1079

I do about 1.5-2.5 laps depending on the track or until i say f it too many ppl flying already!

depends a little on how quick the other cars in your session are. out lap could be faster than some others at full tilt.

True.

bigjae1976 · 02-25-2014, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkim1079

How about this idea, since so many are so eager to flog it from the green flag.

Use warm up laps to focus on a couple things: keep your mind on looking forward for the first couple of laps before giving it the go.

What's a warm up lap?

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

What's a warm up lap?

So your one of those guys I let by and they spin off?

will.c · 02-25-2014, 06:36 PM

Actually funny enough my best lap times of the day are often achieved on the first few laps of the first or second session.... so I'm pretty much ballz out right off the bat.

There are ALWAYS people who drive SOOOOOOO slow on the first lap that there's a train to begin the session with...

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 06:47 PM

They are the smart ones, most stupid offs also happen in those first few laps.

bigjae1976 · 02-25-2014, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

So your one of those guys I let by and they spin off?

I've never spun on the first lap. The 2nd lap? A different story.

Actually, that was one of the harder adjustments when I went into the advanced group (group 4 of 4). The lap times on the out lap were faster than what I was driving in blue (level 2 of 4)...the most stressful lap was the out lap. With that, I've learned a lot from that experience. Don't get pushed beyond your capabilities but do get pushed beyond your comfort zone. It also increased my awareness of what the car is doing.

Odd thing...running with the instructor group, the warm laps are pretty damned slow for the most part.

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

I've never spun on the first lap. The 2nd lap? A different story.

Actually, that was one of the harder adjustments when I went into the advanced group (group 4 of 4). The lap times on the out lap were faster than what I was driving in blue (level 2 of 4)...the most stressful lap was the out lap. With that, I've learned a lot from that experience. Don't get pushed beyond your capabilities but do get pushed beyond your comfort zone. It also increased my awareness of what the car is doing.

Odd thing...running with the instructor group, the warm laps are pretty damned slow for the most part.

Instructors tend to be more cautious about silly mistakes. Looks bad to potential customers.

On a side note I am trying to practice the look thru by trying to see thru hot womens pants and shirts at work. When asked wtf I'm doing I say its a mental exercise to sharpen my senses.

will.c · 02-25-2014, 10:03 PM

well, I misspoke. My perception is to go about 2-3 sec off my normal pace on the first few laps but turns out that it sometimes works out to be quicker than when my (street) tires are cooked by like the 5th laps, which is typically when I go off if I do. Never gone off on the first few.

Anyways spinning or going off when tires are cold is stupid whereas doing so while they're up to temp is not? Also, wouldn't it be a waste of learning opportunity when you can approach and control the lower limits of traction due to cold tires, and ramp up the pace in parallel w/ the tire temp/grip? I don't know, maybe I don't have the most conservative of the mindsets, but I think going too slow as a way of "warming up" doesn't seem to me like the fastest to learn or take advantage of the track time. Just my thoughts.

bigjae1976 · 02-25-2014, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Instructors tend to be more cautious about silly mistakes. Looks bad to potential customers.

On a side note I am trying to practice the look thru by trying to see thru hot womens pants and shirts at work. When asked wtf I'm doing I say its a mental exercise to sharpen my senses.

That is true. With the DE orgs that I've ran with the instructor groups have exemplified great behavior. The most common thing I hear is the instructor group is so courteous.

IMO, that should always be the case in an HPDE environment. If not, the DE org is picking the wrong people to be instructors.

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 10:14 PM

I've just always been taught, warm up your tires, warm up your brakes, and warm up your brain before I push. The first session isn't about lap times its about refreshing your memory and senses. I feel a little nervous and a little cautious every time I go even if its only been 2 weeks. There is a whole day to go fast. Big mistakes by others that cause hours of cleanup or downtime doesn't benefit anyone and happens too often. Might be hard to see but I have a pretty aggresive mindset most of the time also.

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

That is true. With the DE orgs that I've ran with the instructor groups have exemplified great behavior. The most common thing I hear is the instructor group is so courteous.

IMO, that should always be the case in an HPDE environment. If not, the DE org is picking the wrong people to be instructors.

I've never been at an hpde where the instructors drive, other than for a few laps in beginner session to show the newb lines and such.

pkimM3r · 02-25-2014, 10:30 PM

warm up lap doesnt mean go extra slow....it just means short shift at 7000rpm and take it easy a bit and focus on what you are working on for one to two laps....then forget everything you just focused on and go balls to the wall.

jphughan · 02-25-2014, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

That is true. With the DE orgs that I've ran with the instructor groups have exemplified great behavior. The most common thing I hear is the instructor group is so courteous.

Yeah, in contrast to Red Group where people practically climb into each other's tail pipes when they want to pass.

pkimM3r · 02-25-2014, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by will.c

Actually funny enough my best lap times of the day are often achieved on the first few laps of the first or second session.... so I'm pretty much ballz out right off the bat.

There are ALWAYS people who drive SOOOOOOO slow on the first lap that there's a train to begin the session with...

i dont know if that is a good thing or a bad thing..if you are at your fastest times the first time out at the first session / second session which is where you get your memory back on that track, that means something is wrong no?

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkim1079

warm up lap doesnt mean go extra slow....it just means short shift at 7000rpm and take it easy a bit and focus on what you are working on for one to two laps....then forget everything you just focused on and go balls to the wall.

Oh I shift at 4000 all the time?

pkimM3r · 02-25-2014, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Oh I shift at 4000 all the time?

thats because you are steering with your right foot at 12 oclock.

jphughan · 02-25-2014, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

I've never been at an hpde where the instructors drive, other than for a few laps in beginner session to show the newb lines and such.

Wow, I feel bad for those instructors. I'm not an instructor, but I'd imagine that while it must be hugely rewarding to watch the light bulb go off in a student's mind while you're working with him/her, it would also be a bit torturous to be out at the track for a day or full weekend and never get a chance to drive yourself. In The free track time seems to be a major selling point for the instructors out here, not surprisingly.

pkimM3r · 02-25-2014, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jphughan

Yeah, in contrast to Red Group where people practically climb into each other's tail pipes when they want to pass.

reads like a comment from the RAINBOW section.

jphughan · 02-25-2014, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkim1079

Quote:

Originally Posted by jphughan

Yeah, in contrast to Red Group where people practically climb into each other's tail pipes when they want to pass.

reads like a comment from the RAINBOW section.

1MOREMOD · 02-25-2014, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jphughan

Wow, I feel bad for those instructors. I'm not an instructor, but I'd imagine that while it must be hugely rewarding to watch the light bulb go off in a student's mind while you're working with him/her, it would also be a bit torturous to be out at the track for a day or full weekend and never get a chance to drive yourself. In The free track time seems to be a major selling point for the instructors out here, not surprisingly.

Well its a racing school rather than just regular hpde, proformance racing. I have driven 1 bmwcca day they may drive some but never went back to find out. Didn't like it. Turn2 is relatively new and ran with them mostly last year and nasa is new here as well so will be doing some time trial stuff.

bigjae1976 · 02-26-2014, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jphughan

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

That is true. With the DE orgs that I've ran with the instructor groups have exemplified great behavior. The most common thing I hear is the instructor group is so courteous.

Yeah, in contrast to Red Group where people practically climb into each other's tail pipes when they want to pass.

Yup. The warm up is from the grid to the end of the hot pits...then balls to the wall!

klammer · 02-26-2014, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

Quote:

Originally Posted by jphughan

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

That is true. With the DE orgs that I've ran with the instructor groups have exemplified great behavior. The most common thing I hear is the instructor group is so courteous.

Yeah, in contrast to Red Group where people practically climb into each other's tail pipes when they want to pass.

Yup. The warm up is from the grid to the end of the hot pits...then balls to the wall!

That's how I do it

I'm pretty ready to go from the start, and since I've only ran street tires, not really too worried about them getting up to temp and never really got the "warm up the brakes" idea...isn't heat the enemy? and I've never had them not work when needed

: nowadays I'll play more...like wait around for a car or driver I want to test myself against, let them catch up, and then get on them in full race mode and see where that car and driver is at...gotta love doing that in a 4 door

02-25-2014, 06:36 PM	#48
will.c Captain 130 Rep 638 Posts Drives: E46M Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Central Jersey iTrader: (5)	Actually funny enough my best lap times of the day are often achieved on the first few laps of the first or second session.... so I'm pretty much ballz out right off the bat. There are ALWAYS people who drive SOOOOOOO slow on the first lap that there's a train to begin the session with...
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02-25-2014, 06:47 PM	#49
1MOREMOD - 11818 Rep 23,187 Posts Drives: Race car-> Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: check your mirrors iTrader: (5)	They are the smart ones, most stupid offs also happen in those first few laps. Last edited by 1MOREMOD; 02-25-2014 at 07:01 PM..
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02-25-2014, 10:03 PM	#52
will.c Captain 130 Rep 638 Posts Drives: E46M Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Central Jersey iTrader: (5)	well, I misspoke. My perception is to go about 2-3 sec off my normal pace on the first few laps but turns out that it sometimes works out to be quicker than when my (street) tires are cooked by like the 5th laps, which is typically when I go off if I do. Never gone off on the first few. Anyways spinning or going off when tires are cold is stupid whereas doing so while they're up to temp is not? Also, wouldn't it be a waste of learning opportunity when you can approach and control the lower limits of traction due to cold tires, and ramp up the pace in parallel w/ the tire temp/grip? I don't know, maybe I don't have the most conservative of the mindsets, but I think going too slow as a way of "warming up" doesn't seem to me like the fastest to learn or take advantage of the track time. Just my thoughts.
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02-25-2014, 10:14 PM	#54
1MOREMOD - 11818 Rep 23,187 Posts Drives: Race car-> Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: check your mirrors iTrader: (5)	I've just always been taught, warm up your tires, warm up your brakes, and warm up your brain before I push. The first session isn't about lap times its about refreshing your memory and senses. I feel a little nervous and a little cautious every time I go even if its only been 2 weeks. There is a whole day to go fast. Big mistakes by others that cause hours of cleanup or downtime doesn't benefit anyone and happens too often. Might be hard to see but I have a pretty aggresive mindset most of the time also.
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02-25-2014, 10:30 PM	#56
pkimM3r Banned 206 Rep 7,298 Posts Drives: m3 saloon in granny mode. Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: lost angeles iTrader: (0)	warm up lap doesnt mean go extra slow....it just means short shift at 7000rpm and take it easy a bit and focus on what you are working on for one to two laps....then forget everything you just focused on and go balls to the wall.
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