Carbahn 4.6l - Cam or No?

[dpeete]

Thank you all for the contributions. In the end, I’ve decided to forgo the cams for two reasons:
1. Carbahn started the teardown this week and found the block is too damaged to use, so I need to pay an additional $4k to source another block. So the “race credits” are lower than projected. This is now a $41k job without cams.
2. Being in California I think I am heading for trouble doing this on a street car. If I want to play games, I should start by swapping x-pipes and software between tests.

I’d love the cams to further emphasize the peaky and revvy nature of the s65, but I just don’t think it makes sense in my case.

Motor will hopefully be built in 2 weeks, and then we’ll see if the install can be done in ‘24, or if it will be a New Year’s present.

[mikerunt]

Originally Posted by dpeete

Thank you all for the contributions. In the end, I’ve decided to forgo the cams for two reasons:
1. Carbahn started the teardown this week and found the block is too damaged to use, so I need to pay an additional $4k to source another block. So the “race credits” are lower than projected. This is now a $41k job without cams.
2. Being in California I think I am heading for trouble doing this on a street car. If I want to play games, I should start by swapping x-pipes and software between tests.

I’d love the cams to further emphasize the peaky and revvy nature of the s65, but I just don’t think it makes sense in my case.

Motor will hopefully be built in 2 weeks, and then we’ll see if the install can be done in ‘24, or if it will be a New Year’s present.

41k for just motor?!

[dpeete]

Originally Posted by mikerunt

41k for just motor?!

The rebuild is ~$31k with the new block.
Plus you have R&R labor which ~$5k.
And then you have all of the replacement items… you don’t put a new motor in without new injectors, filters, gaskets, single use fasteners and etc.
Plus I am at 68K miles, so while the clutch still had some meat on it, it doesn’t make sense to not swap the clutch and resurface the flywheel.

It adds up fast. But with the condition my car is in, I couldn’t get another vehicle as rewarding for $41k IMO - it is a low-ish mileage 6MT 2011 Competition with pretty much every other component on it recently refreshed or upgraded.

[darren p.]

I agree, you aren't getting anything remotely as rewarding for that money so you may as well pump it into the car you already love and with that engine setup and the 4.10 rear end, the car is going to be a monster...although, I would have done the cams...at that point, whats another $5k? You can do them later I suppose but its an engine out job from my understanding so now would be the perfect time.

What diff are you running?

[dpeete]

Originally Posted by darren p.

I would have done the cams...at that point, whats another $5k?

Getting the car to pass smog here in California doesn’t seem like a sure thing, even with swapping the tune out. I also was told that I wouldn’t get the 2 year warranty with the cams.

Originally Posted by darren p.

What diff are you running?

The car has a Dinan diff, which has been fine for canyon carving. I bought the car with it back in 2012, and it also had the Dinan intake, software, exhaust, underdrive pulley and strut tower braces installed, so I’ve never driven it stock. Over the last year I installed the Autosolutions shifter, a carbon plenum and airbox lid, carbon driveshaft, GAS monoballs, Stoptech ST40R Trophy brakes, Apex EC7RS forged 19’s, and Michelin PS4S. So other than a suspension refresh, rear subframe bushings and Recaros, it has everything I want.

[mikerunt]

Originally Posted by dpeete

The car has a Dinan diff, which has been fine for canyon carving. I bought the car with it back in 2012, and it also had the Dinan intake, software, exhaust, underdrive pulley and strut tower braces installed, so I’ve never driven it stock. Over the last year I installed the Autosolutions shifter, a carbon plenum and airbox lid, carbon driveshaft, GAS monoballs, Stoptech ST40R Trophy brakes, Apex EC7RS forged 19’s, and Michelin PS4S. So other than a suspension refresh, rear subframe bushings and Recaros, it has everything I want.

How’s the carbon driveshaft and pleneum been.

[dpeete]

Originally Posted by mikerunt

How’s the carbon driveshaft and pleneum been.

No issues with the driveshaft.

The plenum is fine, but didn’t add much induction sound over the Dinan intake.

[darren p.]

Originally Posted by dpeete

Getting the car to pass smog here in California doesn’t seem like a sure thing, even with swapping the tune out. I also was told that I wouldn’t get the 2 year warranty with the cams.

That is lame they won't warranty it with the cams...I guess wait two years for the warranty to end...but then you'd still have to contend with smog. Bummer

The Dinan rear is just a stock diff with the 4.10 gears is it not? I'm waffling between OS Giken and Drexler which is why I asked. Sounds like the car is well sorted out. Does it also have the bored out Dinan throttle bodies?

Which plenum and which driveshaft? Removing the cabin filter housings/plastic made a big difference with the induction sound on my Karboneous.

[Thumbie]

You liking the Autosolutions shifter? Never heard of someone who didn't. I think it's the next thing for me to "refresh"

[dpeete]

Originally Posted by Thumbie

You liking the Autosolutions shifter? Never heard of someone who didn't. I think it's the next thing for me to "refresh"

The shift feeling is great… but I was getting way too much noise from vibration. I thought it was an issue with the 80a bushings, but in retrospect maybe it was an early warning of the impending main bearing failure. I am going to leave the 80a bushings in and see how it goes with the new motor. I don’t have an Ultimate Clutch Pedal, but I think I’ll probably do that with the new clutch going in.

[dpeete]

Originally Posted by darren p.

The Dinan rear is just a stock diff with the 4.10 gears is it not? I'm waffling between OS Giken and Drexler which is why I asked. Sounds like the car is well sorted out. Does it also have the bored out Dinan throttle bodies?

Which plenum and which driveshaft?

The Dinan diff is just bigger gearing… it is fine for my needs. If tracking I’d go with the Giken.

I don’t have the Dinan throttle bodies… they appear to be vaporwear on the stock motor. I suppose they might help the 4.6l motor, but Carbahn doesn’t offer them.

The plenum is by Carbon Klasse and is the motorsport model with the larger air chamber.

The driveshaft is the YFCM product from Matt.

[OmairK]

For some financial context… I might be going to DeMan Motorsports for my 718 Cayman GTS to go to from the 4.0 to 4.5/4.7 liters. I’m heading towards a bill of $35-$45k (pending displacement) so you’re in the ball park. My motor however has 4200 miles on it and is in great condition unlike you having to source another block. Transmission regearing and other add-ons are another $15-$20k but with the E9x M3, I’m all in at $6-$7k with a new 4.10 diff from Diffsonline. I wouldn’t spare the 292 Cams though… I think when you’re invested so heavily… what’s another $3k? Especially considering when you inevitably go to tune it, you’ll always have that inner voice saying “what if…”

I also have an E90 M3 ZCP 2011 6MT with 69k miles. All options ticked!