Tire Talk Megathread

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Bartledoo

What about my question? Have you compared data in the same car with some fast drivers?

I have not with one exception.
my race driver instructor drove my car at NYST and was 2sec slower.

[omgzirra_exe]

im the undisclosed king of using cheap tires.. as I use sub $700 set of 140TW drifty boi tires. which was shared by derbo :P

also I'm cheap.

and me no racing anyone.

I'm just out there to drive with friends and occasionally attempt a PB. but mainly I work on being consistent. always aiming for a +/- sector time while maintaining an exact lap time +/-.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I have not with one exception.
my race driver instructor drove my car at NYST and was 2sec slower.

Then, I suggest a new instructor/coach unless he is merely teaching you w2w skills, and/or wasn’t trying to push the car (which would be understandable).

Also, that doesn’t give much info. A lucky dog / chumpcar / lemons racer is a race driver technically, and some don’t hesitate to brag about it. If you put some quick drivers in your car and they do some things better (and maybe some things worse) you can have data and video to see where and how. I’m surprised you haven’t tried to do this by now, with how often you are at the track. Giving yourself something to chase is nice as well. Don’t short change yourself.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Bartledoo

Didn't you just buy re050 for the track?

Sorry, I missed this question.
I have two front sets RE-71R (4) that I will not use at NYST.
I have one front set of 285/30/19 RE-050A that is going on next for NYST. With this tire and size I was on 1:36 pace at NYST and is the fastest time on street tires. The wear of the RE-050A is as good as it gets on this track. Unlike softer tires like MPSS or MPS4S, they don't get destroyed. I suspect that it is a hard compound that allows 140tw tire to last longer. But I don't know.

I also have, new to me, 3 front sets of 265/35/19 RE-050A as previously mentioned. These mainly be used at NYST for the rest of the summer.

While I had a very consistent and fast sessions at NYST on RT-660, it was a one time thing. I am not going to that track with $330/tire on the front. With one exception. There will be a time that I will try the Force to test its durability vs lap time at NYST. So far I don't see it happening this year.

[slcook54]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Agreed.
I know nothing.

No need to be dismissive. You've built the house for yourself, you have to live in it.

I think we've beat this topic to death in Rhyary's main thread, but I still don't understand the logic from a development or an economics standpoint.

The math has to be price of tires divided by total life, so you can back into tire cost per day. If you buy PSS for 25% off and roast them in one day, that's not more economical than buying new ECF / RS4 which wear like iron. I've done the math in your thread to illustrate. It's a rounding error for the amount of money you have into your build.

I think you like experimenting, which is cool in and of itself, but I don't think your experiments are yielding any meaningful results or helping you get faster efficiently.

My guess is that you'll probably be faster on slicks than 100tw then 200tw. There isn't some magic combo of all seasons fronts and pirelli slick rears that's going to net a faster time.

And if you're okay being slightly slower than others, why not just buy a couple sets of endurance tires and see how you progress while keeping the tire variable constant.

[rhyary]

My goal is to report as accurately as possible my experience with tires I buy. And for the last year I decided to buy tires that have been dismissed as "no good" for substantial discount. I made clear that my goal is to match tire types but not manufactures.

Some may have confused tire wear at NYST with tires wear in general. To clarify, tire wear at NYST is NOT because the tires I buy, but the surface of that particular track (it prioritize motorcycle grip if I understand correctly the issue)

If you take my reports on tire wear at NYST, and extrapolate the info to other tracks such as WGI, PMP or LRP, you are missing my point completely.

If you think that the Force (endurance) will last at NYST substantially longer at NYST at sub 1:39 pace, than I am guessing you are mistaken. Unfortunately, until I get around to try it, I won't know for sure. As a refrence an RT-660 was done on the second day by lunch. That was on 1:36 pace which I am not sure the Force can do.


A typical day at NYST is 7x20min session. So the issue is what tires can finish a second day on pace. Until today, NO front passenger tire was able to finish a second day at the pace I am going. If you flip pass for driver both tires will be gone. On the second day the driver side inside will be gone, and the passenger outside will be gone.

If you still convinced that I don't know how to use a calculator than don't blame me for being dismissive.

[PrimeBMW]

If you run a square setup with the same tire on all four corners you can rotate as needed to get the most life/value of the set.
On the other hand I've heard of Ross Bentley (driver coach) purposely changing the set up of a car forcing the driver to adapt and learn to drive around an I'll handling car. Maybe he's on to something with all these mismatched sets 🤔😏

[omgzirra_exe]

Originally Posted by rhyary

My goal is to report as accurately as possible my experience with tires I buy. And for the last year I decided to buy tires that have been dismissed as "no good" for substantial discount. I made clear that my goal is to match tire types but not manufactures.

Some may have confused tire wear at NYST with tires wear in general. To clarify, tire wear at NYST is NOT because the tires I buy, but the surface of that particular track (it prioritize motorcycle grip if I understand correctly the issue)

If you take my reports on tire wear at NYST, and extrapolate the info to other tracks such as WGI, PMP or LRP, you are missing my point completely.

If you think that the Force (endurance) will last at NYST substantially longer at NYST at sub 1:39 pace, than I am guessing you are mistaken. Unfortunately, until I get around to try it, I won't know for sure. As a refrence an RT-660 was done on the second day by lunch. That was on 1:36 pace which I am not sure the Force can do.


A typical day at NYST is 7x20min session. So the issue is what tires can finish a second day on pace. Until today, NO front passenger tire was able to finish a second day at the pace I am going. If you flip pass for driver both tires will be gone. On the second day the driver side inside will be gone, and the passenger outside will be gone.

If you still convinced that I don't know how to use a calculator than don't blame me for being dismissive.

i do the same thing you do, i run different but close tires similar in TW rating. when i am being cheap.

for example, i had RE71R in the rear (the grippier tire) and a pair of Federal 595RSRR up front (the less grippier tire) both tires 200TW.

wasn't a big deal, but the RSRR ends up giving up first before the RE71R did.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by rhyary

My goal is to report as accurately as possible my experience with tires I buy. And for the last year I decided to buy tires that have been dismissed as "no good" for substantial discount. I made clear that my goal is to match tire types but not manufactures.

Some may have confused tire wear at NYST with tires wear in general. To clarify, tire wear at NYST is NOT because the tires I buy, but the surface of that particular track (it prioritize motorcycle grip if I understand correctly the issue)

If you take my reports on tire wear at NYST, and extrapolate the info to other tracks such as WGI, PMP or LRP, you are missing my point completely.

If you think that the Force (endurance) will last at NYST substantially longer at NYST at sub 1:39 pace, than I am guessing you are mistaken. Unfortunately, until I get around to try it, I won't know for sure. As a refrence an RT-660 was done on the second day by lunch. That was on 1:36 pace which I am not sure the Force can do.


A typical day at NYST is 7x20min session. So the issue is what tires can finish a second day on pace. Until today, NO front passenger tire was able to finish a second day at the pace I am going. If you flip pass for driver both tires will be gone. On the second day the driver side inside will be gone, and the passenger outside will be gone.

If you still convinced that I don't know how to use a calculator than don't blame me for being dismissive.

If you did 36 on RT660, then the force can easily do 36.

We get it, NYST wears tires more. Doesn’t mean they all wear at the same rate there though. And nyst isn’t the only track you run, so why is it the one used when arguing tires always?

[leftfootbr8king]

I bet if you all keep arguing with ryhary about this he will change his mind.

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by leftfootbr8king

I bet if you all keep arguing with ryhary about this he will change his mind.

You sound like you might know him quite well...

[DRLane]

I hope we're able to bring this conversation back to, 19" wheels? Come on man.

[leftfootbr8king]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

You sound like you might know him well...

Never met him.

[DrFerry]

What if I run 19 inch wheels on the front axle, a 17 inch wheel on the left rear and an 18 inch wheel on the right rear? Would the reduction in unsprung mass and the reduction in rotational inertia (angular momentum) reduce my lap times? Assuming the tire diameters are almost equal.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Bartledoo

If you did 36 on RT660, then the force can easily do 36.

We get it, NYST wears tires more. Doesn't mean they all wear at the same rate there though. And nyst isn't the only track you run, so why is it the one used when arguing tires always?

NYST day rate is on the inexpensive side for the amount of track time you get. however tire wear makes it a very costly day if you use expensive tires. It is not a trivial expense. Typically you will have some sort of balance between tread life to heat cycles. Not at NYST. Having said that, NYST is a very good track to learn to drive fast. So I don't want to just dismiss it as "no good" track.

It is my home track and the amount of track time I do on that track requires special attention to tires. For PMP, WGI and LRP I am fine with the tires I get for my level of driving.

Good to know the Force can be on the same pace as RT-660. This is not the impression I got from reading.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by DRLane

I hope we're able to bring this conversation back to, 19" wheels? Come on man.

Brakes in 5 4 3….

[911r]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Brakes in 5 4 3….

Sell CCBs for an AP kit, 18" wheels, cheap tires, problem solved

I for one enjoy your tire adventures. As long as you're having fun, that's all that counts.

[omgzirra_exe]

Originally Posted by 911r

Sell CCBs for an AP kit, 18" wheels, cheap tires, problem solved

I for one enjoy your tire adventures. As long as you're having fun, that's all that counts.

NGL Though 19in tire availability is a-lot higher on the cheaper spectrum of 200TW tires.

me personally will attempt this 19" adventure in the near future... as it's a solid 1.5years before 18in FF wheel production..

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by 911r

Sell CCBs for an AP kit, 18" wheels, cheap tires, problem solved

I for one enjoy your tire adventures. As long as you're having fun, that's all that counts.

Thank you.
Yes it is all fun.
I don't expect anyone to take this chit chat too seriously.

19" and ccb stays. we wouldn't want to make a change would we?

[Bartledoo]

On that note, be sure to make 2 clicks adjustment to rear high speed compression (either direction), 1 click rear low speed compression (either direction), 3 clicks front high speed rebound (either direction), and 4 clicks front low speed rebound (either direction). Then, spin the remaining adjustment knobs at random to maintain ideal balance.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Bartledoo

On that note, be sure to make 2 clicks adjustment to rear high speed compression (either direction), 1 click rear low speed compression (either direction), 3 clicks front high speed rebound (either direction), and 4 clicks front low speed rebound (either direction). Then, spin the remaining adjustment knobs at random to maintain ideal balance.

Unfortunately I have only one type of rebound.
So it will not be possible to follow your advise.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Unfortunately I have only one type of rebound.
So it will not be possible to follow your advise.

That must be why the car is so imbalanced and destroys only the front tires. Case closed.