HPDE experiments, results and observations

rhyary · 10-02-2021, 04:49 PM

Now I can't wait for a rainy day!
Who would have thunk that.
.

rhyary · 10-03-2021, 11:10 AM

I broke down and violently violated my principle of buying tires cheaply.

I just HAD to try the RT660 275/30/19.

The RT660 265/35/19 did well, very well last time at nyst. But it is a tall tire for the rear 295/30/19.

My love affair with the 275/30/19 was short. the FFI500 completely disintegrated the inside tire wall and to some degree I think that 275/30 has just too short of a side wall.

But But But…. the RT660 275/30/19 is actually a tall 275/30. So my hope it is closer to the 285/30 of other brands. And really like how the car feel on the 285/30.

The main issue of the 285/30 is that where are no extreme performance tires at that size.

Long time ago, I tried the AD08R in that size, but I don't remember much and the car was setup differently.

So my plan for LRP on Oct 11 and 23 is for:
Rear 295/30/19 RR
Front 275/30/19 RT660

For LRP on Nov 5th I plan on a cold day and will try my recent purchase of the UHP All season.

rhyary · 10-03-2021, 11:45 AM

Tire Rack specs are bewildering. The diameters are listed the same, but rev per miles are different.

All the 275/30/19 diameters are listed at 25.6" with the exception of ECS listed at 25.5"

However, the rev per miles are not consistent.
RT660 808 rev per mile
ADO8R 813
PS91 781
FFI500 815
ECS 815

This make the PS91 the taller 275/30

For comparison
285/30/19 all listed as 25.8" diameter but:

MPSS 807 rev per miles
PS91 775
ECS 808
SO-4 808 (on sale)

So if the rev per mile is more correct than diameter. The 285/30 MPSS and the 275/30 RT660 are about the same sidewall hight.

The MPSS 285/30 i know and like so this is my benchmark.

The rest of the TR numbers:
275/30/19 RT660
Side width 11.1
tread width 10.2
diameter 25.6
rev per mile 808

285/30/19 MPSS
SW 11.4
TW 10.4
diameter 25.8
rev per mile 807

Square factor
RT660 11.1/10.2 = 8.8%
MPSS 11.4 / 10.4 = 9.6%

The RT660 has more square shoulders.

rhyary · 10-09-2021, 06:20 PM

1:36.07 at NYST
Fastest time this year

Front RT660 265/35/19 before corded
Rear RR 295/30/19 last day

Lunch time switched to sticker RT660 275/30/19 - did high 1:36 first session after lunch and the rest of the day 1:37 laps

Monday LRP on
Front RT660 275/30/19 second day
Rear RR 295/30/19 stickers

Note about the RT660, they got faster as i got closer to cording them. I suppose they were closer to slicks before the end.

rhyary · 10-09-2021, 06:41 PM

Theoretical lap between 1:36.44 on Sep 29th and 1:36.07 Oct 9th was 1:35.11.

rhyary · 10-10-2021, 02:40 PM

Installed Trailbrake External TPMS.

Now will be logging tire pressure and core temp using CAN2 on the EVO5:

rhyary · 10-12-2021, 06:36 PM

Personal Best at LRP 60.37
First PB was 60.46 and a session later 60.37

for the first time did 6 laps on 60.x and the test on 61.

The previous session did 4 x 60.x pace which was a record, to be broken the next session.

Previous days I was able to get one lap on 60.x and the rest were on 61.x

still no lap below 60 and given my tires scenario and what's left form the season, it will have to be good enough. Will see. I have three more days scheduled at LRP.

It was fun chasing someone, might as well be a BMW.

rhyary · 10-12-2021, 07:01 PM

Tires for above LRP:
RT660 275/30/19 second day (got shaved at NYST)
RR 295/30/19 first day

Bartledoo · 10-12-2021, 09:53 PM

You easily have time left to get well under 60sec. Just go faster.

roastbeef · 10-13-2021, 12:56 AM

still breaking early on that front straight i see.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bartledoo

You easily have time left to get well under 60sec. Just go faster.

I am reviewing all my laps on my videos and I agree with you. i need to drive better.

It is not the equipment.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roastbeef

still breaking early on that front straight i see.

It is not where I brake, but how much.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 08:10 AM

This is how short I am from breaking 60sec.

Advice and opinions are welcomed.

DRLane · 10-13-2021, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhyary

This is how short I am from breaking 60sec.

Advice and opinions are welcomed.

I've never been to LR, so take it with grain…

Looks like in comparison to the e46 you tend to pinch a couple corners and cheat their entry by turning in early? Namely the turn heading for the up hill. The e46 launches as he is already pointed vs you're still turning which makes WOT scary? Same with entering the first corner?

I'll be back East for a couple months next summer in Litchfield county so literally 25 mins from LR. Planning on spending a bunch of time there and hitting all the other requisite stops. I look forward to driving with you Rami!

dparm · 10-13-2021, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRLane

I've never been to LR, so take it with grain…

Looks like in comparison to the e46 you tend to pinch a couple corners and cheat their entry by turning in early? Namely the turn heading for the up hill. The e46 launches as he is already pointed vs you're still turning which makes WOT scary? Same with entering the first corner?

I'll be back East for a couple months next summer in Litchfield county so literally 25 mins from LR. Planning on spending a bunch of time there and hitting all the other requisite stops. I look forward to driving with you Rami!

This was my assessment as well. There are too many brake applications. Would be curious to see the traces for speed, accelerator, brake, and steering wheel. Gsum too, if possible.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 08:57 AM

@DRLane It would be great to see you on east tracks.

Bartledoo · 10-13-2021, 09:24 AM

I think a big problem for you being late on throttle is not setting up your exit so you can open the wheel for adding throttle. You aren’t rotating the car. So if you added throttle anywhere near where you should, you would have too much steering input. Then when you have the car rotating a smidge under throttle you lift, like 3:25. That’s lost time. Open the wheel proactively and add throttle and you would’ve still made the turn without lifting.

It also appears that you aren’t on the grip limit. I would suggest building a cheap sim in the off season to practice for confidence in your car control. I will admit that I don’t use mine much, but between my first two track seasons I did and it made a big difference in car control confidence.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 11:47 AM

>> Open the wheel proactively and add throttle and you would've still made the turn without lifting.

I can try, but implementation is harder than understanding.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 12:40 PM

Oops on the hill.

Not happy about this one.

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 12:51 PM

Hot into LRP T1

rhyary · 10-13-2021, 05:46 PM

Bought 8 x RE-71R 265/35/19 for the front at $182/tire.

The RT660 265/35/19 worked well but it was a one time thing at $311/tire. Not happy about that price at all.

rhyary · 10-16-2021, 06:09 PM

Nothing new.
Another 60.39 bit than the rear speed sensor went bad and not ABS and last day on 275/30/19 RT660 so I dialed it back a notch and try to see what it's like with no ABS.

10-02-2021, 04:49 PM	#727
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Now I can't wait for a rainy day! Who would have thunk that. . Attached Images
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10-03-2021, 11:10 AM	#728
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	I broke down and violently violated my principle of buying tires cheaply. I just HAD to try the RT660 275/30/19. The RT660 265/35/19 did well, very well last time at nyst. But it is a tall tire for the rear 295/30/19. My love affair with the 275/30/19 was short. the FFI500 completely disintegrated the inside tire wall and to some degree I think that 275/30 has just too short of a side wall. But But But…. the RT660 275/30/19 is actually a tall 275/30. So my hope it is closer to the 285/30 of other brands. And really like how the car feel on the 285/30. The main issue of the 285/30 is that where are no extreme performance tires at that size. Long time ago, I tried the AD08R in that size, but I don't remember much and the car was setup differently. So my plan for LRP on Oct 11 and 23 is for: Rear 295/30/19 RR Front 275/30/19 RT660 For LRP on Nov 5th I plan on a cold day and will try my recent purchase of the UHP All season.
	Appreciate 0

10-03-2021, 11:45 AM	#729
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Tire Rack specs are bewildering. The diameters are listed the same, but rev per miles are different. All the 275/30/19 diameters are listed at 25.6" with the exception of ECS listed at 25.5" However, the rev per miles are not consistent. RT660 808 rev per mile ADO8R 813 PS91 781 FFI500 815 ECS 815 This make the PS91 the taller 275/30 For comparison 285/30/19 all listed as 25.8" diameter but: MPSS 807 rev per miles PS91 775 ECS 808 SO-4 808 (on sale) So if the rev per mile is more correct than diameter. The 285/30 MPSS and the 275/30 RT660 are about the same sidewall hight. The MPSS 285/30 i know and like so this is my benchmark. The rest of the TR numbers: 275/30/19 RT660 Side width 11.1 tread width 10.2 diameter 25.6 rev per mile 808 285/30/19 MPSS SW 11.4 TW 10.4 diameter 25.8 rev per mile 807 Square factor RT660 11.1/10.2 = 8.8% MPSS 11.4 / 10.4 = 9.6% The RT660 has more square shoulders.
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10-09-2021, 06:20 PM	#730
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	1:36.07 at NYST Fastest time this year Front RT660 265/35/19 before corded Rear RR 295/30/19 last day Lunch time switched to sticker RT660 275/30/19 - did high 1:36 first session after lunch and the rest of the day 1:37 laps Monday LRP on Front RT660 275/30/19 second day Rear RR 295/30/19 stickers Note about the RT660, they got faster as i got closer to cording them. I suppose they were closer to slicks before the end.
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10-09-2021, 06:41 PM	#731
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Theoretical lap between 1:36.44 on Sep 29th and 1:36.07 Oct 9th was 1:35.11.
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10-10-2021, 02:40 PM	#732
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Installed Trailbrake External TPMS. Now will be logging tire pressure and core temp using CAN2 on the EVO5: Attached Images
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10-12-2021, 06:36 PM	#733
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Personal Best at LRP 60.37 First PB was 60.46 and a session later 60.37 for the first time did 6 laps on 60.x and the test on 61. The previous session did 4 x 60.x pace which was a record, to be broken the next session. Previous days I was able to get one lap on 60.x and the rest were on 61.x still no lap below 60 and given my tires scenario and what's left form the season, it will have to be good enough. Will see. I have three more days scheduled at LRP. It was fun chasing someone, might as well be a BMW.
	Appreciate 1 CHSe92260.50

10-12-2021, 07:01 PM	#734
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Tires for above LRP: RT660 275/30/19 second day (got shaved at NYST) RR 295/30/19 first day
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10-12-2021, 09:53 PM	#735
Bartledoo Driver 2708 Rep 2,715 Posts Drives: 2011 E90 M3 6MT Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Seattle, WA iTrader: (0) Garage List 2023 Corvette Stingray [0.00] 2002 Porsche Boxster [0.00] 2011 E90 M3 [0.00] 2021 Tesla Model Y [0.00]	You easily have time left to get well under 60sec. Just go faster. __________________ E90M 6MT Slicktop Single Humper in need of a diet
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10-13-2021, 12:56 AM	#736
roastbeef Lieutenant General 11865 Rep 12,880 Posts Drives: E92 M3 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Orange County, CA iTrader: (4)	still breaking early on that front straight i see. __________________ Instagram; @roastbeefmike
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10-13-2021, 08:10 AM	#739
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	This is how short I am from breaking 60sec. Advice and opinions are welcomed. Attached Images
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10-13-2021, 08:57 AM	#742
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	@DRLane It would be great to see you on east tracks.
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10-13-2021, 09:24 AM	#743
Bartledoo Driver 2708 Rep 2,715 Posts Drives: 2011 E90 M3 6MT Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Seattle, WA iTrader: (0) Garage List 2023 Corvette Stingray [0.00] 2002 Porsche Boxster [0.00] 2011 E90 M3 [0.00] 2021 Tesla Model Y [0.00]	I think a big problem for you being late on throttle is not setting up your exit so you can open the wheel for adding throttle. You aren’t rotating the car. So if you added throttle anywhere near where you should, you would have too much steering input. Then when you have the car rotating a smidge under throttle you lift, like 3:25. That’s lost time. Open the wheel proactively and add throttle and you would’ve still made the turn without lifting. It also appears that you aren’t on the grip limit. I would suggest building a cheap sim in the off season to practice for confidence in your car control. I will admit that I don’t use mine much, but between my first two track seasons I did and it made a big difference in car control confidence. __________________ E90M 6MT Slicktop Single Humper in need of a diet
	Appreciate 2 dparm3928.00 rhyary1637.00

10-13-2021, 11:47 AM	#744
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	>> Open the wheel proactively and add throttle and you would've still made the turn without lifting. I can try, but implementation is harder than understanding.
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10-13-2021, 12:40 PM	#745
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Oops on the hill. Not happy about this one.
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10-13-2021, 12:51 PM	#746
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Hot into LRP T1
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10-13-2021, 05:46 PM	#747
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Bought 8 x RE-71R 265/35/19 for the front at $182/tire. The RT660 265/35/19 worked well but it was a one time thing at $311/tire. Not happy about that price at all.
	Appreciate 0

10-16-2021, 06:09 PM	#748
rhyary Banned 1637 Rep 2,883 Posts Drives: 2013 M3 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (0)	Nothing new. Another 60.39 bit than the rear speed sensor went bad and not ABS and last day on 275/30/19 RT660 so I dialed it back a notch and try to see what it's like with no ABS.
	Appreciate 0