Cracked Vanos Hub Cover

[Etansinsta]

Originally Posted by Audioslave686

You will need the engine timing tool to remove the vanos bolts and retime the engine after the new vanos covers installed.
Not an easy DIY…

with the cam locks in place and the small bolt in the back of the vanos exhaust gears, re-timing wasn't needed in my instance.

good to double check of course though once everything is put back together

[Audioslave686]

Originally Posted by Etansinsta

with the cam locks in place and the small bolt in the back of the vanos exhaust gears, re-timing wasn't needed in my instance.

good to double check of course though once everything is put back together

Did they just torqued the bolts back and that's it?
Were they locking the crankshaft as well?

[jvictormp]

Originally Posted by Audioslave686

Did they just torqued the bolts back and that's it?
Were they locking the crankshaft as well?

Those bolts are supposed to be replaced once undone, right?

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Etansinsta

with the cam locks in place and the small bolt in the back of the vanos exhaust gears, re-timing wasn't needed in my instance.

good to double check of course though once everything is put back together

But special cam locks are still needed in order to lose/torque the center nut?

[Audioslave686]

Originally Posted by jvictormp

Those bolts are supposed to be replaced once undone, right?

yup, according to the service manual

[Audioslave686]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

But special cam locks are still needed in order to lose/torque the center nut?

yes, otherwise there is a risk of damaging the engine components.
the torque is no joke - 80NM + 200 degrees

[Etansinsta]

Originally Posted by Audioslave686

Did they just torqued the bolts back and that's it?
Were they locking the crankshaft as well?

Well, yes, the cam lock tool locks the cams in place.

The vanos gear bolts were all replaced with new ones at the time of install.

Essentially the steps for install would be

removal of plenum

removal of valve covers

removal of timing covers

installation of cam locks and small bolt to back of each exhaust gear (lower one)

removal of existing plastic covers

removal of vanos gear bolts

installation of metal covers and new vanos gear bolts

shaving 1-2mm off the timing covers to ensure appropriate clearance for the new bolts as the metal cover forces them to sit further back with the added thickness

install timing covers

install valve covers

install plenum

as you'll find, the majority of the job is very straightforward, it's the timing and torque portion that prompted me to have the dealer complete the work. no other shop locally here in Vancouver was willing to deal with re-timing the motor.


review the TIS service manuals / BMW instructions and you'll be more easily able to understand the technicality of the work.

another thing to note is, the new vanos bolts come with a small washer already attached, we did not remove this and simply clearanced the timing covers a bit to allow for expansion under heat.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Etansinsta

Well, yes, the cam lock tool locks the cams in place.

The vanos gear bolts were all replaced with new ones at the time of install.

Essentially the steps for install would be

removal of plenum

removal of valve covers

removal of timing covers

installation of cam locks and small bolt to back of each exhaust gear (lower one)

removal of existing plastic covers

removal of vanos gear bolts

installation of metal covers and new vanos gear bolts

shaving 1-2mm off the timing covers to ensure appropriate clearance for the new bolts as the metal cover forces them to sit further back with the added thickness

install timing covers

install valve covers

install plenum

as you'll find, the majority of the job is very straightforward, it's the timing and torque portion that prompted me to have the dealer complete the work. no other shop locally here in Vancouver was willing to deal with re-timing the motor.


review the TIS service manuals / BMW instructions and you'll be more easily able to understand the technicality of the work.

another thing to note is, the new vanos bolts come with a small washer already attached, we did not remove this and simply clearanced the timing covers a bit to allow for expansion under heat.

Thanks again mate!

Although I'm not planning to do this myself - desperately searching for a shop who want to take on on - I'm interested to understand whats going on.

Couple of more questions if you don't mind:
- Mentioned bolts that should be replaced is the actual center bolts, yes?
- Apparently you had to cut down a bit of the cover in order to get clearance for the nut. Was this Carbahns recommendation? I understand you did it because you had to, but seem strange Carbahn selected a "too" thick plate to fit there. Did you discuss this with them by any chance?

Btw for the rest of us I found a quite good video on the subject (+ more S65 on that channel):

[Etansinsta]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Thanks again mate!

Although I'm not planning to do this myself - desperately searching for a shop who want to take on on - I'm interested to understand whats going on.

Couple of more questions if you don't mind:
- Mentioned bolts that should be replaced is the actual center bolts, yes?
- Apparently you had to cut down a bit of the cover in order to get clearance for the nut. Was this Carbahns recommendation? I understand you did it because you had to, but seem strange Carbahn selected a "too" thick plate to fit there. Did you discuss this with them by any chance?

Btw for the rest of us I found a quite good video on the subject (+ more S65 on that channel):

Have you reached out to the local dealer? they were the only ones that would do it here in vancouver.

Couple of more questions if you don't mind:
- Mentioned bolts that should be replaced is the actual center bolts, yes? yes, the actual gear bolts. there are 4 of them

- Apparently you had to cut down a bit of the cover in order to get clearance for the nut. Was this Carbahns recommendation? I understand you did it because you had to, but seem strange Carbahn selected a "too" thick plate to fit there. Did you discuss this with them by any chance?

I did not discuss with them and this was simply the recommendation of the dealer to avoid any potential issues. You'll find that the washer does not want to come off of the new bolt - it simply spins near the bolt head but cannot easily be removed.

If anyone has brought this up with carbahn, please comment. presumably they removed the small washer from the bolt and installed without it.

you can see the washer in some of the pics i previously posted!

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Etansinsta

Have you reached out to the local dealer? they were the only ones that would do it here in vancouver.

Couple of more questions if you don't mind:
- Mentioned bolts that should be replaced is the actual center bolts, yes? yes, the actual gear bolts. there are 4 of them

- Apparently you had to cut down a bit of the cover in order to get clearance for the nut. Was this Carbahns recommendation? I understand you did it because you had to, but seem strange Carbahn selected a "too" thick plate to fit there. Did you discuss this with them by any chance?

I did not discuss with them and this was simply the recommendation of the dealer to avoid any potential issues. You'll find that the washer does not want to come off of the new bolt - it simply spins near the bolt head but cannot easily be removed.

If anyone has brought this up with carbahn, please comment. presumably they removed the small washer from the bolt and installed without it.

you can see the washer in some of the pics i previously posted!

Thanks again for clarifications mate, just want to have as clear understanding of the job as possible during my search for a shop.

Yes I spoke to the main dealer (presumably largest in the country) who confirmed they get to see losen caps now and then. They said "nothing to worry about, they don't fall off, alternatively drive without". Typically customers who cares about, or by any chance understand anything about his/her car, are unfortunately ignored and even more so when refering to The Horrorstory Internet as source.
Glad but surpriced to hear you got them to even install aftermarket stuff, good job.

This whole story about a piece of plastic not possible to replace yet with the potential to destroy the engine is just out of propotions crazy. Basically not possible maintain, really BMW??
Would be great if there was another way to attach something light yet strong that keep the tip of the spring from start walking out.

[motorhead_02]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Checked this morning prior leaving for office, lower cap made me nervous enough to instead catch the tube.
Started to check around with the local shops. New Vanos are around 800 Euros over here (know I need two + will check other side as well). One shop was eager to investigate aftermarket alternative.
Some shops have never seen the issue before while a couple immediately confirmed "this happen".

Main dealer hasn't come back yet but will be interesting to get their thoughts. The quality of this piece of plastic design reminds of the TA's gear, clearly not good enought and should have been adressed by BMW IMHO.

Ps. One wonder how this light cap can rotate with the torque required. The s65 obviously have extremely fast throttle response, may that be the reason..? I certainly run the DCT with proper blip and I don't mind revving a tad now and then. Makes me wonder...

if you will replace all the vanos units with plastic covers just because old plastic covers ,dont you think it is possible that you will start looking thru the oil cap again sooner or later? Dinan racing stroker engine plates its the best solution so far.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by motorhead_02

if you will replace all the vanos units with plastic covers just because old plastic covers ,dont you think it is possible that you will start looking thru the oil cap again sooner or later? Dinan racing stroker engine plates its the best solution so far.

Haha, yeah checking caps via the oil fill will certainly be part of the pre start up routine..😉.

Maybe I end up with washers but prefer caps as I view the work/risk significantly less with no need to worry about cam timing/special tools.
Also I would like to avoid modifications in order to adjust nut clearance.

[Ajolives]

I bought bolts that have a separate washer unless it's the flanged head everyone is talking about…so shouldn't be a need to grind away at the cover unless I'm missing something here.

[Ajolives]

Originally Posted by Ajolives

@helmsman I bought bolts that have a separate washer unless it's the flanged head everyone is talking about…so shouldn't be a need to grind away at the cover unless I'm missing something here.

Helmsman apparently you cannot tag someone while editing after the fact and im too lazy to repost, lol

[motorhead_02]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Thanks again mate!

Although I'm not planning to do this myself - desperately searching for a shop who want to take on on - I'm interested to understand whats going on.

Couple of more questions if you don't mind:
- Mentioned bolts that should be replaced is the actual center bolts, yes?
- Apparently you had to cut down a bit of the cover in order to get clearance for the nut. Was this Carbahns recommendation? I understand you did it because you had to, but seem strange Carbahn selected a "too" thick plate to fit there. Did you discuss this with them by any chance?

Btw for the rest of us I found a quite good video on the subject (+ more S65 on that channel):

Originally Posted by Ajolives

I bought bolts that have a separate washer unless it's the flanged head everyone is talking about…so shouldn't be a need to grind away at the cover unless I'm missing something here.

What if to shave the head of the bolt 1-2mm?

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Ajolives

Helmsman apparently you cannot tag someone while editing after the fact and im too lazy to repost, lol

Haha, fair enough this also works fine..😁. Thanks for input, everything of interest and sucked into my "feasibilty study". Didn't quite work out your previous posts; you have parked your car awaiting Dinan washers? Plan to do all 4? And believe you already bought timing tools.
Still searching alternative aftermarket solutions, seen pictures on parts that look interesting but don't know status on tested/confirmed good nor availability.

Appreciate your continued input mate.

[Ajolives]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Haha, fair enough this also works fine..😁. Thanks for input, everything of interest and sucked into my "feasibilty study". Didn't quite work out your previous posts; you have parked your car awaiting Dinan washers? Plan to do all 4? And believe you already bought timing tools.
Still searching alternative aftermarket solutions, seen pictures on parts that look interesting but don't know status on tested/confirmed good nor availability.

Appreciate your continued input mate.

Sure. Up to date, saw Ethan's post in August, found out one of mine was cracked. Drove lightly til I found out both bank 1 covers were cracked. Parked it for two weeks waiting for parts.

Bought timing tools, bolts, used gears, all ancillary parts/gaskets, ready to R&R the gears. Opened everything up, saw how tight the covers where even though they were cracked. Closed everything back up and have been driving it normally since. Even had a couple spirited drives with a new M2CS (140 mph in Mexico) and stage 2 Audi S6 since and been mostly worry free.

Once the DINAN washers come in I'm going back in to get the job done. I also bought new gaskets for the timing solenoids and plan on cleaning them out.

At 150k I'm almost half expecting VANOS issues in the next year or so but so I kind of want to bite the bullet and just replace it all now but my budget would take a huge hit. I have RBs and new clutch/flywheel planned early next year and still waiting to take care of cosmetic issues. Have a Euro bumper sitting in my garage waiting to be painted and installed.

[Ajolives]

Originally Posted by motorhead_02

What if to shave the head of the bolt 1-2mm?

The CarBahn washer looks to be a tad bit thicker than the OE washer. I would imagine excluding the OE washer should still give the head of the bolt enough clearance.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Ajolives

The CarBahn washer looks to be a tad bit thicker than the OE washer. I would imagine excluding the OE washer should still give the head of the bolt enough clearance.

Don't get why the Dinan washer is so thick, looks friggin 3-4mm stainless steel, a walking spring won't add much pressure.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by Ajolives

Sure. Up to date, saw Ethan's post in August, found out one of mine was cracked. Drove lightly til I found out both bank 1 covers were cracked. Parked it for two weeks waiting for parts.

Bought timing tools, bolts, used gears, all ancillary parts/gaskets, ready to R&R the gears. Opened everything up, saw how tight the covers where even though they were cracked. Closed everything back up and have been driving it normally since. Even had a couple spirited drives with a new M2CS (140 mph in Mexico) and stage 2 Audi S6 since and been mostly worry free.

Once the DINAN washers come in I'm going back in to get the job done. I also bought new gaskets for the timing solenoids and plan on cleaning them out.

At 150k I'm almost half expecting VANOS issues in the next year or so but so I kind of want to bite the bullet and just replace it all now but my budget would take a huge hit. I have RBs and new clutch/flywheel planned early next year and still waiting to take care of cosmetic issues. Have a Euro bumper sitting in my garage waiting to be painted and installed.

So the covers are really snug on, very odd how it still can rotate the tab out of its seat as its done in my case. Can't see any cracks, yet, thought.

Any idea how its mounted in the first place, wonder if they've used heat. Must be a reason to why bmw doesnt sell them separetly.

[Ajolives]

@Helmsman Sure do! I bought a spare one to learn. I didn't really understand how oil pressure adjusted the timing of the cams so I did some homework.

I had some time to kill so took some pics:

The first series is taking off the cover to show the tabs. There's six tabs that hold the cover down using a ridge underneath the cover plate. Basically start with a pic and pop them out, walking the cover as you go. I suggest starting 45 degrees from the hole and travel away so the last tab to pop off is that one so it doesn't crack. Once you get three or four loose you can pop it off.

Second series is a disassembled unit I bought for an extra cover and once again to get a good idea of how this BS works. The consist of the spring unsprung, cover plate off, chambers and center piece removed. Basically those chambers fill with oil and move the camshafts laterally to change the degree.

[Ajolives]

More