glitter, flakes, magnetic material in oil after some high RPM driving

[bmwm3s65]

ok. So I am getting ready to have the engine replaced. I've decided on either having dealership replace it with remaned engine, or indy shop with carbahn 4.2l and gamble on saving a few thousand if my old core is viable. My number 1 concern is reliability. Does anyone have any experience with the carbahn 4.2l engine in terms of reliability? I cannot find much information on dinan/carbahn engines on these forums. The way I drive I am expecting/hoping for at least 150,000 miles out of a replacement engine.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

ok. So I am getting ready to have the engine replaced. I've decided on either having dealership replace it with remaned engine, or indy shop with carbahn 4.2l and gamble on saving a few thousand if my old core is viable. My number 1 concern is reliability. Does anyone have any experience with the carbahn 4.2l engine in terms of reliability? I cannot find much information on dinan/carbahn engines on these forums. The way I drive I am expecting/hoping for at least 150,000 miles out of a replacement engine.

I have experience with Carbahn. You are good to go for their 4.2L.

[bmwm3s65]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I have experience with Carbahn. You are good to go for their 4.2L.

That's good to hear. I am anxious to drive again. I am hoping to pull the trigger on the engine in a couple days. on Carbahn's site, dyno showed 471 hp with race gas, while I am not concerned about any power increase if there is any but I am wondering if it would be noticeable over stock.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

That's good to hear. I am anxious to drive again. I am hoping to pull the trigger on the engine in a couple days. on Carbahn's site, dyno showed 471 hp with race gas, while I am not concerned about any power increase if there is any but I am wondering if it would be noticeable over stock.

In the future if you want to get 292 cams, headers and Karbonius intake you'll wind up with 5% more power than if you had stock displacement

[deansbimmer]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

ok. So I am getting ready to have the engine replaced. I've decided on either having dealership replace it with remaned engine, or indy shop with carbahn 4.2l and gamble on saving a few thousand if my old core is viable. My number 1 concern is reliability. Does anyone have any experience with the carbahn 4.2l engine in terms of reliability? I cannot find much information on dinan/carbahn engines on these forums. The way I drive I am expecting/hoping for at least 150,000 miles out of a replacement engine.

I hate to sound like a Debbie Downer but I've never seen a rebuilt engine from anybody last over 100k. Not even close. Rebuilds don't seem to last as long. Bored/stroked builds even more so.

Someone driving on a rebuilt engine with over 100k may chime in to state their experience but I've never seen one- just carnage from failed rebuilds. Just another factor to consider.

[bmwm3s65]

Originally Posted by deansbimmer

I hate to sound like a Debbie Downer but I've never seen a rebuilt engine from anybody last over 100k. Not even close. Rebuilds don't seem to last as long. Bored/stroked builds even more so.

Someone driving on a rebuilt engine with over 100k may chime in to state their experience but I've never seen one- just carnage from failed rebuilds. Just another factor to consider.

Is there a difference between a rebuilt and remanufactured engine? is one more reliable over the other? Should I take a chance on an eBay or car-parts used engine over a rebuilt/remanufactured bmw engine if going for reliability?

[acarr6]

Originally Posted by deansbimmer

I hate to sound like a Debbie Downer but I've never seen a rebuilt engine from anybody last over 100k. Not even close. Rebuilds don't seem to last as long. Bored/stroked builds even more so.

Someone driving on a rebuilt engine with over 100k may chime in to state their experience but I've never seen one- just carnage from failed rebuilds. Just another factor to consider.

What seems to be the failing point of these rebuilds you've seen?

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by deansbimmer

I hate to sound like a Debbie Downer but I've never seen a rebuilt engine from anybody last over 100k. Not even close. Rebuilds don't seem to last as long. Bored/stroked builds even more so.

Someone driving on a rebuilt engine with over 100k may chime in to state their experience but I've never seen one- just carnage from failed rebuilds. Just another factor to consider.

Is this because people with rebuilt engines have not accumulated sufficient miles i.e. reach 100K miles or is it because of the nature of re-assembly?

[bmwm3s65]

Are the engines, dealerships get from Germany any different or are they most likely engines that were damaged and rebuilt?

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

Is this because people with rebuilt engines have not accumulated sufficient miles i.e. reach 100K miles or is it because of the nature of re-assembly?

He can answer for himself, but I think the real reason is 'rebuilds' will be an order of magnitude less reliable than the engine that comes from the factory.

There are lots of people selling stroker kits and rebuilds and all this crap, but where are the cars that have survived for a few years with those engines?

Carbahn/Dinan is the most likely to offer a S65 of similar quality to BMW as they were hired by M Motorsports to run the P65 engine program, so they know these engines extremely well.

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

He can answer for himself, but I think the real reason is 'rebuilds' will be an order of magnitude less reliable than the engine that comes from the factory.

There are lots of people selling stroker kits and rebuilds and all this crap, but where are the cars that have survived for a few years with those engines?

Carbahn/Dinan is the most likely to offer a S65 of similar quality to BMW as they were hired by M Motorsports to run the P65 engine program, so they know these engines extremely well.

Steve and company also did a full S65 Daytona Prototype development program too back in 2010 since they thought they were going to be forced to replace the S62 in the DP cars. If there's anyone in the country who knows how to build a superior S65, it should be Carbahn. I would bet my reliability dollars on his 4.2L S65 build with its increased clearance rod bearings the higher quality valve springs versus a stock one from BMW (where one would think you should at least do a rod bearing replacement right off the bat on the BMW supplied S65 with the engine out of the car -- which of course would void any BMW warranty on the engine).

[bmwm3s65]

Now I am second guessing. I am leaning towards a bmw engine, but after the warranty I would definitely want to do rod bearings at some point while I hopefully wouldn't have to open the carbahn engine to do anything.

[bmwm3s65]

My end goal in this car would still be a stroker engine. while I hope the engine would last to at least 100k, if the engine stays healthy until I at least pay the car and engine off in a couple years, I might be ready to get a stroker at that point so a stock bmw engine may be the way to . Man why does this have to be so hard!

[acarr6]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

He can answer for himself, but I think the real reason is 'rebuilds' will be an order of magnitude less reliable than the engine that comes from the factory.

There are lots of people selling stroker kits and rebuilds and all this crap, but where are the cars that have survived for a few years with those engines?

Carbahn/Dinan is the most likely to offer a S65 of similar quality to BMW as they were hired by M Motorsports to run the P65 engine program, so they know these engines extremely well.

My gintani stroker (and supercharged) was built 5 years ago. 4.4L. Still going strong!

[akkando]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

My end goal in this car would still be a stroker engine. while I hope the engine would last to at least 100k, if the engine stays healthy until I at least pay the car and engine off in a couple years, I might be ready to get a stroker at that point so a stock bmw engine may be the way to . Man why does this have to be so hard!

If that's your end goal just cut out the middle man and get one from Carbahn now so you don't have to take the engine out again later. Plus you know, you get it now.

[TX]

One thing to consider which you just mentioned - you’re still paying off the car which now has a bad engine and you would be paying off a 27k engine build plus labor and extras. Let’s call it 35k on top of whatever you might owe on the car. You should weigh your options to make sure it’s a good investment before proceeding.

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

My end goal in this car would still be a stroker engine. while I hope the engine would last to at least 100k, if the engine stays healthy until I at least pay the car and engine off in a couple years, I might be ready to get a stroker at that point so a stock bmw engine may be the way to . Man why does this have to be so hard!

The low cost (relatively) Carbahn 4.2L S65 is not a stroked engine. It is simply slightly bored to achieve 0.2L displacement increase. Their stroker is 4.6L. There are only a few engine building shops in the country with the proper equipment to retreat the cylinder walls after boring such as Carbahn, The S62 Shop (engine builder is former Dinan DP engine builder), and a handful of others l can't recall right now.

[drrust]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

My end goal in this car would still be a stroker engine. while I hope the engine would last to at least 100k, if the engine stays healthy until I at least pay the car and engine off in a couple years, I might be ready to get a stroker at that point so a stock bmw engine may be the way to . Man why does this have to be so hard!

Although a stroker sounds like it would be the most desirable route, it is also likely the most expensive. As someone who has an E90 M3 with close to 170k miles, I've had to consider what my options are as I approach 200k miles and need to consider replacing rod bearings for a second time.

My recollection is that a rebuilt "stock" motor is on the order of $15k. Stokers about $25k. The most economical option is to pick up a used motor and have the rod bearings replaced before installing. Depending on mileage one should be able to get the motor and new bearings for under $10k. Some might say that option has the most risk as one cannot be sure of the motors history.

The other "interesting" route would be some sort of LS install, but only a few examples exist and my recollection is that the cost would be on the order of a rebuilt motor or even stroker depending one found a used or a crate engine.

I hope you can find a solution for your car that you're happy with.

[deansbimmer]

Originally Posted by bmwm3s65

Is there a difference between a rebuilt and remanufactured engine? is one more reliable over the other? Should I take a chance on an eBay or car-parts used engine over a rebuilt/remanufactured bmw engine if going for reliability?

"remanufactured" is typically the more thorough rebuild with every component restored to original tolerance and spec. A "rebuild" is a little more relaxed and usually tends to only the items that caused the need for rebuild.

Originally Posted by acarr6

What seems to be the failing point of these rebuilds you've seen?

Still seen main and rod bearing failures in rebuilt motors. I had a Dinan stroker come in with a spun main bearing. Have also seen broken piston rings, premature cylinder failure (oil burning/incorrect bore prep), a broken valve, head gasket failure, and even an "extra" head bolt washer that got lodged and locked up a cam. BMW's precision, process control, and overall quality is extremely hard to match by any other private enterprise.

There's also a difference between someone that can build an engine for racing and maximum output, and one who builds one for maximum longevity. There's no shortage of people who will claim the highest outputs etc, but it's a whole different story when you try to get someone to stand behind a build for 100k miles.

[bmwm3s65]

Originally Posted by deansbimmer

"remanufactured" is typically the more thorough rebuild with every component restored to original tolerance and spec. A "rebuild" is a little more relaxed and usually tends to only the items that caused the need for rebuild.



Still seen main and rod bearing failures in rebuilt motors. I had a Dinan stroker come in with a spun main bearing. Have also seen broken piston rings, premature cylinder failure (oil burning/incorrect bore prep), a broken valve, head gasket failure, and even an "extra" head bolt washer that got lodged and locked up a cam. BMW's precision, process control, and overall quality is extremely hard to match by any other private enterprise.

There's also a difference between someone that can build an engine for racing and maximum output, and one who builds one for maximum longevity. There's no shortage of people who will claim the highest outputs etc, but it's a whole different story when you try to get someone to stand behind a build for 100k miles.

I decided to go with a bmw reman from Germany. dealership said i can keep my old engine for 1k more. not sure if its worth it.

[BayE30]

curious what the price is for a reman from BMW Germany?

[bmwm3s65]

Any reason to pay 1k to keep my old engine? I have a hoist and an engine stand to put it on and the engine still runs so I would think I could get at least 1k out of it if i sell it, just not sure if its worth the hassle.