Official S65 Rod Bearing Condition Example Thread

[Hondaman23]

Originally Posted by Assimilator1

Hondaman23
Got any pics of those 200k miles bearings?

Heck no! I don’t document stuff very well, as I never had to. Honda’s come out looking barely touched after 200k, but I always replace the bearings for good measure, so all I do is inspect them to ensure the crank is OK and quickly toss.

[fatalelement]

Don't have the full pics yet, but just swapped my bearings with MRF @ 117.5K and the #7 bearing was absolutely trashed and was hard to get off. Dodged a bullet for sure.

[G80indy]

Originally Posted by fatalelement

Don't have the full pics yet, but just swapped my bearings with MRF @ 117.5K and the #7 bearing was absolutely trashed and was hard to get off. Dodged a bullet for sure.

What were your OCIs and oil of choice?

[fatalelement]

Originally Posted by 330indy

What were your OCIs and oil of choice?

5,000 usually (though sometimes as long as 10,000, I'm not perfect, but 75%+ were 5k), and either LiquiMoly or Castrol when the former wasn't available (although some Motul snuck in there as well once or twice).

[TX]

Fatal, Any theories as to why that one bearing was making so much contact compared to the rest. Is it more than just oil starvation? Excessively minimal clearance? A one off?

[fatalelement]

Originally Posted by TX

Fatal, Any theories as to why that one bearing was making so much contact compared to the rest. Is it more than just oil starvation? Excessively minimal clearance? A one off?

While I am an engineer, I'm certainly not an automotive engineer but if you look at Malek's pictures (including his own blown engine), it doesn't seem uncommon for one bearing in particular to get really bad. In other threads he discusses that 3rd party bearings with LESS clearance are shown to come out with virtually no wear (i.e. how bearings in other cars look) in engines that had previously trashed bearings, so it would SUGGEST (though he is careful not to draw any conclusions since it's hard to do without a ton of a/b testing no one wants to do) that the OE stretch bolts may be a contributing factor (allowing a looser hold on the shells over time, which seems like it would lead to uneven wear on the shells). That would also explain why the wear is atrocious on the top but not uncharacteristically bad (for an S65B40 at 117.5k) on the bottom of #7.

But that's just a guess. Not sure why that one bearing was ass.

Glad it's lying on a table in his shop and not in my engine, that's for sure.

[IamFODI]

Originally Posted by fatalelement

That would also explain why the wear is atrocious on the top but not uncharacteristically bad (for an S65B40 at 117.5k) on the bottom of #7.

AFAIK the rod side usually gets it worse than the cap side because the rod side takes cylinder pressure plus the piston changing direction.

[Scharbag]

Originally Posted by TX

Fatal, Any theories as to why that one bearing was making so much contact compared to the rest. Is it more than just oil starvation? Excessively minimal clearance? A one off?

Tolerance stack. Pretty simple explanation.

[ckang008]

Can driving through a puddle then car stall cause knocking issue? It happened to my car and I managed to get it started again. But I hear this noise which I'm not sure where it's coming from.

Also the car felt a bit more sluggish on the throttle after stalling. Wonder if any water may have gotten in

Thanks

[IamFODI]

Originally Posted by ckang008

Can driving through a puddle then car stall cause knocking issue? It happened to my car and I managed to get it started again. But I hear this noise which I'm not sure where it's coming from.

Also the car felt a bit more sluggish stalling. Wonder if any water may have gotten in

Thanks

If you drive through a puddle that's high enough to get water into the intake, the thing to do is to throw the car in neutral and turn the engine off immediately. If you don't do that in time and the engine stalls, the very last thing you want to do is try to start it again.

Based on what you've described and the video you posted, there is water in it. The only question is how much. Do not start it again for any reason short of a last-ditch effort to escape injury or death. You're lucky your engine didn't grenade (look up hydrolock -- it ain't pretty). You'll be much luckier if there's no other discernible damage.

At a bare minimum, the oil must be changed immediately. If this is happening at a shop, the car must be towed there. If the engine runs well enough after an oil change (no/fewer abnormal noises or smoke from the tailpipes), idle it up to temp and watch for signs of trouble. If all is well, change the oil again, and repeat that process until the oil comes out clear. Then, for the next few hundred miles, drive mildly with no short trips or extended idling, and then change the oil again.

If the noises continue and/or there's smoke from the tailpipes, it's teardown time.

Speaking from experience here. Thankfully it was with a different car with a less expensive engine.

Good luck!

[TX]

ckang do not start that engine again. That level of noise is causing damage. I would say water ingestion, usually they hydrolock and things grenade. You may have bent a rod, either way running it is not helping.

[TX]

Originally Posted by Scharbag

Tolerance stack. Pretty simple explanation.

So essentially that rod ended up with a thinner clearance than the already too thin clearance problem from shells that were on the thick side.
Thanks.

[ckang008]

Thanks Iamfodi and tx for the reply. Im going to have someone tow the car away. Will it be better if I go back to Official dealership to get this fixed or any 3rd party mechanic can get this sorted? Thanks

[IamFODI]

Originally Posted by ckang008

Thanks Iamfodi and tx for the reply. Im going to have someone tow the car away. Will it be better if I go back to Official dealership to get this fixed or any 3rd party mechanic can get this sorted? Thanks

The only 3rd party I’d trust is one that specializes in these cars.

[ckang008]

Cool thanks I'll get the dealer to tow it then thanks again

[ckang008]

Btw I'm still on my original rod bearings. Was wondering if it will be also a good time to get 3rd party bearings too since probably there's more work to be done

[fatalelement]

Originally Posted by ckang008

Btw I'm still on my original rod bearings. Was wondering if it will be also a good time to get 3rd party bearings too since probably there's more work to be done

Dealer's only gonna put original style bearings back in at a truly exorbitant cost which means you'll be doing it again soon enough, so probably get a place that actually does aftermarket RB replacement to do so.

[slcook54]

Originally Posted by fatalelement

Don't have the full pics yet, but just swapped my bearings with MRF @ 117.5K and the #7 bearing was absolutely trashed and was hard to get off. Dodged a bullet for sure.

Saw these in person on Monday while I was getting mine done and remember how bad #7 looked. Glad you caught it!

[ccbl]

2010 E90 M3 at 123,000km
3RD owner. 2 Previous owners were mature older lawyers who never tracked and dealer maintained for tax write off purposes.

Shop didn't take a pic of bearings in order to cylinders and handed me them in a box. So they are ordered randomly. Motor mounts were done. Previous owner stated no winter driving but only owned the car for 2 years.

S65 Rod Bearing by Steven Luong, on Flickr

DSC_0142 by Steven Luong, on Flickr
DSC_0143 by Steven Luong, on Flickr

S65 Motor Mounts by Steven Luong, on Flickr

S65 Motor Mounts by Steven Luong, on Flickr
S65 Motor Mounts by Steven Luong, on Flickr
S65 Motor Mounts by Steven Luong, on Flickr

[Scharbag]

Originally Posted by ckang008

Can driving through a puddle then car stall cause knocking issue? It happened to my car and I managed to get it started again. But I hear this noise which I'm not sure where it's coming from.

Also the car felt a bit more sluggish on the throttle after stalling. Wonder if any water may have gotten in

Thanks

At 12:1 compression and 500ml per hole, it only takes 42ml of water in 1 cylinder to cause major damage. This is only 3 tablespoons. Not very much at all.

If your engine stalled, it needs to be inspected. Typically hydrolock is covered by insurance here.

Good luck.

[ckang008]

Looks like bad news. They said the valve most likely bent. Told me either to replace the engine or they will disassemble it and replace whatever parts broken. It's my first year driving the car and I'm planning to sell it after fixing it given this car has less than 30000km on it and frankly need a taller car to go through the frequently flooded roads in China where I'm taking it as daily. The water level that I went through this time is barely anything compqre to China roads. Will it be better to fix it up the current engine and resell it? . Prob just redo rod bearings too to give it more selling point if go with fixing engine route thanks

[MaAl]

27k Miles

2011 DCT

I am the 3rd owner, first owner drove 18k miles the first year, second owner only drove 6k miles during the 7 years he owned it afterwards..

More wear than id expect for the mileage but I imagine it was all done during the first few months

Replaced with VAC/ARP @ Active Autowerke