More rod bearings

[Munichm3]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

One guy fixed the cold start clunk noise by replacing the S65 Vanos-Gears under BMW warranty .
Here is the paper of the S65 PUMA-case ..

But does this have any negative effect besides a noise? I’ve seen many cars like this with no issues

[WingZeroX5]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

One guy fixed the cold start clunk noise by replacing the S65 Vanos-Gears under BMW warranty .
Here is the paper of the S65 PUMA-case ..

just curious, if it was a PUMA case, would that work if I brought it in and have them fix it?

[BOOF-M3]

Originally Posted by Duk996

Is there any chance BMW will own up to making any of this right? At least in my case?

I think I'm missing something here. Too bad that video isn't actually of OP's car. I know there are a lot of really smart people here and certainly not many with as much knowledge as Philippe but why are you determining that the S65 is shot just from the shavings? Do we even know what those shavings are yet? A faint knock at low RPM's is the beginning of the end? And no one answered OP's question about BMW owning up to it, although I think we already know the answer to that. They have not been held accountable in the court system yet although some minor headway has been made.

https://www.carcomplaints.com/news/2...-lawsuit.shtml

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by BOOF-M3

I think I'm missing something here. Too bad that video isn't actually of OP's car. I know there are a lot of really smart people here and certainly not many with as much knowledge as Philippe but why are you determining that the S65 is shot just from the shavings? Do we even know what those shavings are yet? A faint knock at low RPM's is the beginning of the end? And no one answered OP's question about BMW owning up to it, although I think we already know the answer to that. They have not been held accountable in the court system yet although some minor headway has been made.

https://www.carcomplaints.com/news/2...-lawsuit.shtml

For what it's worth I recall my knock sounding just like the video I posted (I remember finding that video and going "bingo", then being frustrated by a lack of explanation as to why). I know that doesn't reconcile with what more knowledgeable people here are saying; I'm at a loss on that.

I will update as things progress but I'm assuming I will find a bunch of worn bearings and 1 substantially damage one.

Do people think an overrev would do this? I never overreved it but maybe the previous owner did? But wouldn't the valve train or the rods themselves go first?

[decimation1]

Originally Posted by BOOF-M3

I think I'm missing something here. Too bad that video isn't actually of OP's car. I know there are a lot of really smart people here and certainly not many with as much knowledge as Philippe but why are you determining that the S65 is shot just from the shavings? Do we even know what those shavings are yet? A faint knock at low RPM's is the beginning of the end? And no one answered OP's question about BMW owning up to it, although I think we already know the answer to that. They have not been held accountable in the court system yet although some minor headway has been made.

https://www.carcomplaints.com/news/2...-lawsuit.shtml

If the rod is already knocking, the crank is almost always already damaged and you can't just throw new bearings in....

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by decimation1

If the rod is already knocking, the crank is almost always already damaged and you can't just throw new bearings in....

I think I agree, right now the car does the start up knock but runs fine, once it's up to temp I get the 1000 to 2000 rpm faint knocking, but not when it's cold! So I'm hoping it's at the very early stages where the oil and its viscosity is actually making a difference and the crank is not damaged. But i see how the odds are against me.

[EnVe46]

The only thing I?d be concerned with are the shavings going throughout the engine itself. It?ll take multiple changes to get it out. Depending on the size of the shavings it could damage the cams and other lubricated parts by scoring them. Hopefully you caught it soon enough

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by EnVe46

The only thing I?d be concerned with are the shavings going throughout the engine itself. It?ll take multiple changes to get it out. Depending on the size of the shavings it could damage the cams and other lubricated parts by scoring them. Hopefully you caught it soon enough

I'v thought of that, I'd like to think the debris would be forced out of the bearing and into the oil pan where the pump would pick it up and filter it out. Each journal is lubricated in parallel and not series. So I think it might be ok. Not convinced about cylinder walls and pump though, those would not be protected.

[BOOF-M3]

OP, I'm still interested in your thoughts on BMW taking some responsibility for the bearings issue. Are you in a discussion with BMW currently? I think you stated that it's at a BMW dealership which is obviously best if you are trying to get some help from them if this is what everyone is expecting it to be. If so, how far up the chain are you? Service adviser level or beyond that? Not sure but I think this thread would help others in your boat if you are actually making headway with them. And as the link I supplied earlier showed, the S65 bearing issue is not lost yet although many here will tell us that it's a pipe dream.

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by BOOF-M3

OP, I'm still interested in your thoughts on BMW taking some responsibility for the bearings issue. Are you in a discussion with BMW currently? I think you stated that it's at a BMW dealership which is obviously best if you are trying to get some help from them if this is what everyone is expecting it to be. If so, how far up the chain are you? Service adviser level or beyond that? Not sure but I think this thread would help others in your boat if you are actually making headway with them. And as the link I supplied earlier showed, the S65 bearing issue is not lost yet although many here will tell us that it's a pipe dream.

I am definitely in communications with them and it has been escalated within. At this point I just want to give them the opportunity to help before broadcasting too many details.

[BOOF-M3]

Absolutely, stating the facts as you have is good. Speculation and bad mouthing will get you nowhere. Good work, we are all pulling for you. Great community even though as Philippe would say "Bmw drivers have no friends". I'm sure a picture stating that will be coming up shortly.

Edit: Phil? No picture?

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by jhanksevo

Good stuff Philippe, as usual

Thank you Sir !

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Munichm3

But does this have any negative effect besides a noise? I’ve seen many cars like this with no issues

Its for sure,the noise sounds not really healthy and I can hear it too .
On the other hand.. I know S65's from 2007 with the cold start clunk noise . And today we are in 2017 . That's 10 year later with the noise and they are running fine .

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by WingZeroX5

just curious, if it was a PUMA case, would that work if I brought it in and have them fix it?

Only if your car is still under BMW warranty .
If not , I really hope you have deep pockets because S65 Vanos-Gears are not cheap .
But you can always show them the paper of the PUMA-case ..

On the other hand , I never understood how this fixed the noise by replacing the S65 Vanos-Gears by exactly the same S65 Vanos-Gears ....

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Duk996

I am definitely in communications with them and it has been escalated within. At this point I just want to give them the opportunity to help before broadcasting too many details.

Any updates about your car ?

[MachinesWithSouls]

If anyone is interested, I only drove the car once or twice a month, and I?ve found that if I turn the car ON, give the fuel pump a chance to prime, the start the car, that clunk is not anywhere near as bad.

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Any updates about your car ?

No, nothing yet. I started looking at rs5s though haha. My gut is bmw screws me in which case I don't see myself ever buying one again. Depending on how this gets sorted out I may trade it in after it's fixed.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Duk996

No, nothing yet. I started looking at rs5s though haha. My gut is bmw screws me in which case I don't see myself ever buying one again. Depending on how this gets sorted out I may trade it in after it's fixed.

All performance cars have their own issues

In the case of the RS5, the main one is massive carbon buildup. Do you want to remove the mainfold every 30k miles? I don't.

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

All performance cars have their own issues

In the case of the RS5, the main one is massive carbon buildup. Do you want to remove the mainfold every 30k miles? I don't.

Sounds like a cake walk compared to replacing bearings, doing oil analyses, and risking the whole engine grenading. Just to be clear I'm not committed to anything. Just spitballing. I liked the M up until now...

[decimation1]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

All performance cars have their own issues

In the case of the RS5, the main one is massive carbon buildup. Do you want to remove the mainfold every 30k miles? I don't.

^^Bingo^^ Doesn't matter which brand, everyone has AT LEAST one major issue that has to be dealt with....

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Duk996

Sounds like a cake walk compared to replacing bearings, doing oil analyses, and risking the whole engine grenading. Just to be clear I'm not committed to anything. Just spitballing. I liked the M up until now...

No worries. Everyone can have the car they want.

The only issue with the S65 is rod bearings, which costs ~2500 at a reputable shop or can be done for ~600 yourself. Nothing else.

The RS5 engine's carbon buildup does not have any solution. I've removed the mainfold of a N55 and it's a pain in the ass, I'm not sure rod bearings are worse.

If you want a highly reliable car you'll have to buy a Toyota. There is not one performance car that 'just works'. The E9X M3 is one of the most reliable there is.

[Duk996]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

No worries. Everyone can have the car they want.

The only issue with the S65 is rod bearings, which costs ~2500 at a reputable shop or can be done for ~600 yourself. Nothing else.

The RS5 engine's carbon buildup does not have any solution. I've removed the mainfold of a N55 and it's a pain in the ass, I'm not sure rod bearings are worse.

If you want a highly reliable car you'll have to buy a Toyota. There is not one performance car that 'just works'. The E9X M3 is one of the most reliable there is.

It sounds reasonable until you're in my shoes dealing with the possibility of needing a new engine. If BMW told me to replace the bearings periodically I would have been ok with it. I was completely broadsided. Was I supposed to just tear the bottom end apart on a whim? Or because I read it on the forums? Who periodically replaces rod bearings? The whole thing is ridiculous.