Professional ceramic coating and correction - worth it for my use case?

Mikey240 wrote

Yes sir! They will be giving me a few bottles of Car Pro products and one of them is the pH neutral car wash. They are also giving me a bottle of the top-off spray and then one other product as a care package type of thing.

CARPRO makes some great products. You should check out their Perl and Darkside sealants for your tires.

https://www.carpro-us.com/tire-trim-dressings-coatings/?_bc_fsnf=1&Surface=Rubber

Westside Guy wrote

CARPRO makes some great products. You should check out their Perl and Darkside sealants for your tires.

https://www.carpro-us.com/tire-trim-dressings-coatings/?_bc_fsnf=1&Surface=Rubber

Yep, this shop uses all Car Pro products & they give you a bunch of bottles of various stuff(soap, topper, etc.) as part of the service.

BTW - I asked them to quote me on adding PPF to JUST the front clip or bumper. Im reluctant but after a terrible day yesterday of bug shit and stuff on the front of the car, I feel I have to consider the extra protection for the front.

Mikey240 wrote

BTW - I asked them to quote me on adding PPF to JUST the front clip or bumper. Im reluctant but after a terrible day yesterday of bug shit and stuff on the front of the car, I feel I have to consider the extra protection for the front.

Back in the 90's I remember driving up from Manhattan to Cooperstown with my son to visit the Baseball Hall of Fame. I had the white 325i in this picture and the entire front of the car was plastered with dead bugs when I arrived.

The bumper, headlights, hood, A pillars, side mirror caps and the windshield were totally covered and it looked like I had a two tone car and it took forever to clean this bug shit off!

If it is within your budget, I would definitely protect the entire front of your car with PPF and instead of you paying the shop for ceramic buy a do it yourself ceramic coating.

Westside Guy wrote

Back in the 90's I remember driving up from Manhattan to Cooperstown with my son to visit the Baseball Hall of Fame. I had the white 325i in this picture and the entire front of the car was plastered with dead bugs when I arrived.

The bumper, headlights, hood, A pillars, side mirror caps and the windshield were totally covered and it looked like I had a two tone car and it took forever to clean this bug shit off!

If it is within your budget, I would definitely protect the entire front of your car with PPF and instead of you paying the shop for ceramic buy a do it yourself ceramic coating.

That car is a beauty! I owned a 1988 325is for many years. Great car, Ill have to dig up some pics.

I will get a quote today and see what they say. I might go for the front clip PPF. I think Im still going to have them do the professional coating though, whether I do PPF or not. I just feel that having it done once by pros makes sense for me. Its the full gamut too - decon, correction, polish, clay, etc. Two coats of Car Pro & then a coat of gliss. Includes wheels and glass too. I think its worth it.

I can handle caring for it after myself but want to start with a proper base, per se

1K while is a decent chunk of change its totally worth doing. I'm also a DIYer and i've done several cars myself doing the full process of decon, clay, polish then coating and my back would surely appreciate spending the money then standing there with a polisher for hours.

It all comes down to how perfect you want it to be and what is your car washing plans afterwards. If the car sees anything but two bucket self wash then i would say there is no point in chasing the perfect finish because all it takes is one bad wash to bring swirls right back. Its important to make sure the detailer knows what level of polishing you are expecting because that is where the bulk of your money should be going towards. Applying ceramic coating is easier than waxing a car nowadays. Its all in the prep work.

As for PPF I did it to my M5 Touring for the first time and i'm a believer now. The key is finding a good installer. No matter how careful i drive i use to always come back from road trips with some rock chips on the bumper or hood which annoys me. With PPF and nearly 3K miles later the car is still pristine. While you can 'see' ppf under some angles its still worth doing because i see rock chips way easier than ppf.

I paid 2500 for the full front clip. full hood, bumper, fenders, mirrors. I also ended doing the side skirts because those take a beating with summer tires no matter how you drive.

Alan

Mikey240 wrote

That car is a beauty! I owned a 1988 325is for many years. Great car, Ill have to dig up some pics.

The was a 1991 and my first BMW. I traded it in for a Samoa Blue 1994 325i cabriolet which I kept for 9 years. ❤️

Alan l. wrote

1K while is a decent chunk of change its totally worth doing. I'm also a DIYer and i've done several cars myself doing the full process of decon, clay, polish then coating and my back would surely appreciate spending the money then standing there with a polisher for hours.

It all comes down to how perfect you want it to be and what is your car washing plans afterwards. If the car sees anything but two bucket self wash then i would say there is no point in chasing the perfect finish because all it takes is one bad wash to bring swirls right back. Its important to make sure the detailer knows what level of polishing you are expecting because that is where the bulk of your money should be going towards. Applying ceramic coating is easier than waxing a car nowadays. Its all in the prep work.

As for PPF I did it to my M5 Touring for the first time and i'm a believer now. The key is finding a good installer. No matter how careful i drive i use to always come back from road trips with some rock chips on the bumper or hood which annoys me. With PPF and nearly 3K miles later the car is still pristine. While you can 'see' ppf under some angles its still worth doing because i see rock chips way easier than ppf.

I paid 2500 for the full front clip. full hood, bumper, fenders, mirrors. I also ended doing the side skirts because those take a beating with summer tires no matter how you drive.

Alan

They quoted me an extra $550 for the front clip getting PPF. So, about $1500 for everything. Thats not too bad , IMO. I feel thats the part of the car that gets the brunt of the possible damage. Its simply too expensive to do the whole car or even the full front. I have to stop somewhere. . Im going to go for it. The service includes a clay bar treatment and a "light", one step polish he said.

As for washing & post-care, I am a big fan of waterless washes versus wet washes. My toy cars never really get that dirty - just front bug shit and the usual road grime/dust from driving. Really a perfect candidate for waterless washing. I feel like there are more chances for something going wrong with a full wet wash with mitts, drying, etc. versus careful & frequent waterless washes. We have horribly hard water here too so even drying a washed panel right away still leaves water spots. Its maddening, LOL.

Adams Water-less wash product is really good. Super lubricated but contains NO wax, sealant or ceramic in it. Its 100% just a good wash. Wont alter or mess with any coatings on the car.

With quality micro-towels and using a bunch of them with one-direction wipes and very gentle pressure, you cant go wrong.

The PPF and how it will look does make me a tad nervous but like you said, Ill lose more sleep over chips on the front bumper versus some "off" looking paint angles with PPF.

Mikey240 wrote

As for washing & post-care, I am a big fan of waterless washes versus wet washes. My toy cars never really get that dirty - just front bug shit and the usual road grime/dust from driving. Really a perfect candidate for waterless washing. I feel like there are more chances for something going wrong with a full wet wash with mitts, drying, etc. versus careful & frequent waterless washes. We have horribly hard water here too so even drying a washed panel right away still leaves water spots. Its maddening, LOL.

Eh, I'll disagree, but it's not a strong argument and in the end you should do what you want to do.

I find waterless wash to effectively be "dusting" the car. I prefer to have water actually hit the surface of the car and take some of the dirt and etc. away from it. It's then wet, but is also "cleaner" to start with when you start to touch it with microfibers, which is something that you are still doing - just with a dirtier surface. As for drying, a leaf blower will get most of the water off. Then hit your microfiber with some waterless wash as you run around getting any drips you missed. I'd bet this is faster too, especially compared to using a cloth folded again and again to find a clean surface, and getting the little nooks and crannies everywhere.

Again, not saying your method is wrong. But there are a lot of options and you might have disregarded something equivalent or better.

I’m not a fan of waterless washes. Much higher risk in scratching the paint. Unneeded risk if you have access to water/hose.

After years saying I’ll never spend that much for a pressure washer I finally got sick of replacing the $3-400 machines every two years and bought Kranzle. Wow there is a noticable difference and really changed the whole washing experience for me.

For a car that isn’t that dirty and mostly dusty a strong pressure washer rinse plus some Adam’s mega foam, let it sit for a few minutes and a rise could be enough already.

Alan

tracer bullet wrote

Eh, I'll disagree, but it's not a strong argument and in the end you should do what you want to do.

I find waterless wash to effectively be "dusting" the car. I prefer to have water actually hit the surface of the car and take some of the dirt and etc. away from it. It's then wet, but is also "cleaner" to start with when you start to touch it with microfibers, which is something that you are still doing - just with a dirtier surface. As for drying, a leaf blower will get most of the water off. Then hit your microfiber with some waterless wash as you run around getting any drips you missed. I'd bet this is faster too, especially compared to using a cloth folded again and again to find a clean surface, and getting the little nooks and crannies everywhere.

Again, not saying your method is wrong. But there are a lot of options and you might have disregarded something equivalent or better.

Fair enough - and you might be right. I think the waterless option is really only for very lightly dirty cars "Lightly" being the keyword here. There is a fine line and if you cross it, yer gonna muck up the paint for sure. Ive checked my own work as in do a section waterless & then examine it under various lighting to look for any issues I might have just caused. So far, so good but there could be micro scratches, I guess. Ugh, this is so hard.... .

I do use water from time to time but only when I feel it really needs it. Like I said, our water here is loaded with shit. . The leaf blower thing helps but then the nooks and crannies just release water that makes more spots. Just more work and I feel like I can screw up more. However, Im going to confirm with the shop what they recommend. I am open to trying different things.

Alan l. wrote

I’m not a fan of waterless washes. Much higher risk in scratching the paint. Unneeded risk if you have access to water/hose.

After years saying I’ll never spend that much for a pressure washer I finally got sick of replacing the $3-400 machines every two years and bought Kranzle. Wow there is a noticable difference and really changed the whole washing experience for me.

For a car that isn’t that dirty and mostly dusty a strong pressure washer rinse plus some Adam’s mega foam, let it sit for a few minutes and a rise could be enough already.

Alan

Gotchya. As I replied to the other guy, maybe you're right. the water based washes just have so many more steps and conditions. And, when Im done I have to use a detail-wipe step to get rid of the damned water spots so there are microfiber towels still hitting the paint surface. Yes, its clean at that point but still.

I could invest in a water ionizer or whatever ya call them but when does it end?

Alan l. tracer bullet

Let me ask you guys: What do you with the car after say a long drive or busy weekend of driving and the light road grime/dust that will collect along the bottom half of the car, wheels, etc? Do you do anything or just let it be until the next water-based wash?

Its the "in-between wet washes" protocols that can be tricky. I know a light dusting isnt a big deal but after a long day of driving, the car does get a little grimy. Am I being too anal wanting to deal with this? Just leave it? Or do you guys wash with water basically after every long trip or weekend of driving? To me, this light grime is what a waterless wash excels at but perhaps I need to rethink this?

I currently use a two bucket system but thats a pain. Might switch to using 4-5 wash mitts instead with one bucket.

My car does have splash guards installed which do help the bottom of the doors and quarter panels.

In that scenario this is what i do.

Leaf blow the entire car to remove some of the pollen, dust, leaves etc.. (i do this after every drive anyway with all the pollen around)

Fill up the foam cannon with some Adams mega foam soap and cover the entire car. Let it sit for 5mins

Rinse with high pressure washer (key step since there is enough pressure to actually remove grime/dirt)

Leaf blow dry

After all that i might go over the wheels with a microfiber towel and some quick detailer.

I've actually learned to ignore it. Easier said then done, I'm always itching to make any of our cars perfect. But when I know how fast some dust, pollen, etc. accumulates I realize it will only be nice for 5 minutes into the next drive, or even until my kid leaves the garage door open a few hours on a windy day. So it's got to be pretty dirty (a relative term) for me to finally do it, or I've actually got time available for it.

I also foam it down first (I have an HK sprayer with a battery air compressor thing hooked up, I DIY'd it but they make them this way). It goes a few minutes then I rinse it off with the nozzle on the garden hose. Then it is basically the 1-bucket wash with multiple mitts. I might do half the hood with one, flip it, do the other half of the hood and it goes into an empty bucket and I grab the next one. Say the trunk lid and the back of the car, flipping part way through. Next mitts do the top half of the sides of the car, then the lower half.

Rinse off again, blow dry what I can, towel dry the rest. Nicer Rag Company towel with a mist of waterless wash or detail spray.

I do the wheels before the car, and the windows last. If I do the engine, it's before the wheels.

Living in MN with salt everywhere (Z4 stays parked, but I try to be nice to my x3), you have to develop a little bit of an ability to occasionally lower the bar.

Mikey240 wrote

Alan l. tracer bullet

Let me ask you guys: What do you with the car after say a long drive or busy weekend of driving and the light road grime/dust that will collect along the bottom half of the car, wheels, etc? Do you do anything or just let it be until the next water-based wash?

Its the "in-between wet washes" protocols that can be tricky. I know a light dusting isnt a big deal but after a long day of driving, the car does get a little grimy. Am I being too anal wanting to deal with this? Just leave it? Or do you guys wash with water basically after every long trip or weekend of driving? To me, this light grime is what a waterless wash excels at but perhaps I need to rethink this?

I currently use a two bucket system but thats a pain. Might switch to using 4-5 wash mitts instead with one bucket.

My car does have splash guards installed which do help the bottom of the doors and quarter panels.

This is where the “ionizer” you mentioned can be a solution. It’s actually a deionizing filter that produces deionized (DI) water.

I used to leave the car between washes to avoid paint damage. But I added a DI filter to my setup and as it’s pure water you can just rinse the car down and leave it without touching the paint or drying it.

This effective for a quick rinse to get light dust or light bug splatter off a coated car. The filters aren’t cheap, and you do have to periodically change the filter resin, the life of which will depend on your water quality and how much you use it.

But if the cost would be worth it for you, DI water can be a game changer to save time on little things like this. I use it to rinse brake dust off wheels, light dust off the entire car, and I use it as a final rinse when washing the car. I typically don’t even dry the car. Just rinse it and walk away. There’s nothing in the water, so there aren’t any spots.

My filter system was $500 and resin changes are about $110. 1 to 2 per season, depending on use. I have 4 cars, 2 live outside.

This is real unnecessary detailing nerd stuff. But if you’re crazy about keeping things clean, it’s a real stress reliever. That comes at a cost, but could be worth it for you.

^^^ Good stuff.

I've got an RO setup, it's slow because it's a small setup that gives up only a gallon or so an hour, I typically use it to cut 50:50 tap water in my coffee equipment and small fish tank. I've gotten ahead on a couple gallons for the car but only used it once - basically spraying it on after my normal washing routine. I don't typically get spots anyhow (I'm blessed with fairly soft tap water and only wash in the shade) so it wasn't quite worth it. If I had super hard ground water I would reconsider.

My dad's got a ZeroWater pitcher from Lowes and amazingly it puts out practically 0 TDS water just with gravity, but of course it's super slow. Can't wash a car with it but could collect water over a day or days if someone wanted just to experiment with the idea and decide if it's worth going to the next step.

Between my softish water, leaf blower, and some super soft drying towels I haven't had any problems so far. Acknowledging there's different cases for everyone and where they live.

I use the Spotless Water DIW-20 system and use that as my final rinse water. I also use it just to get light dusting off the car but find i don't use it that often because the resin doesn't last long and its $150 a pop to replace. As long as i hit the car with my EGO 765 leaf blower to remove the water i don't find the need to use the spotless system.

The biggest game changer for me is always having a fresh coating of ceramic on the paint where drying the car with a blower is extremely easy. Gtechniq CSL and EXO are two of the easiest coatings to use and the slickness is unbelievable after it cures.

Alan

Alan l. wrote

The biggest game changer for me is always having a fresh coating of ceramic on the paint where drying the car with a blower is extremely easy. Gtechniq CSL and EXO are two of the easiest coatings to use and the slickness is unbelievable after it cures.

Alan

This is why Im going for the car pro DQuartz Pro(two coats) and then a coat of gliss. I will very likely experience better wash results and thats that I am hoping for!

Ive heard/read nothing but good things about the Car Pro coatings & products. Also have heard the same about Gtechniq products.

Waterless washing is the way to go, ONR + Ultra Black Sponge.

My OG M2 was paint corrected + ceramic coated, would never do that again. I used a pressure washer, foam cannon, 2 bucket method with grit guards. I’d get very fine micro marring.

My M2C, I only did ONR waterless washes. It’s just so easy, way safer too. The chemical itself helps clean and protect your paint when cleaning. Lots of people will say the opposite, but somehow ONR with a sponge (using a single bucket with a grit guard) is pure magic. Save your money! However if your car is extra filthy, a quick pressure washer or touchless wash to get the larger grime off is helpful then proceed to do an ONR wash.

Ultimately do what you’re comfortable with, and what you enjoy doing (if detailing is your thing!).

stututum2 wrote

Waterless washing is the way to go, ONR + Ultra Black Sponge.

My OG M2 was paint corrected + ceramic coated, would never do that again. I used a pressure washer, foam cannon, 2 bucket method with grit guards. I’d get very fine micro marring.

My M2C, I only did ONR waterless washes. It’s just so easy, way safer too. The chemical itself helps clean and protect your paint when cleaning. Lots of people will say the opposite, but somehow ONR with a sponge (using a single bucket with a grit guard) is pure magic. Save your money! However if your car is extra filthy, a quick pressure washer or touchless wash to get the larger grime off is helpful then proceed to do an ONR wash.

Ultimately do what you’re comfortable with, and what you enjoy doing (if detailing is your thing!).

Wait - when you say "never do that again", do you mean the correction & ceramic coating or wet washing as described? Just confirming

Either way, I prefer waterless washing for so many reasons. My car isnt a daily so it rarely gets super dirty if ever. I feel like I have more chances to screw something up with wash mitts, drying, etc. Wet washing is also much more of a hassle, IMO.

Using quality micro towels & lots of them with gentle pressure appears to work great. I will confirm with my detail shop as for do's and dont's post service.

Mikey240 wrote

Wait - when you say "never do that again", do you mean the correction & ceramic coating or wet washing as described? Just confirming

Either way, I prefer waterless washing for so many reasons. My car isnt a daily so it rarely gets super dirty if ever. I feel like I have more chances to screw something up with wash mitts, drying, etc. Wet washing is also much more of a hassle, IMO.

Using quality micro towels & lots of them with gentle pressure appears to work great. I will confirm with my detail shop as for do's and dont's post service.

Yeah same the hassle of pulling out the pressure washer, etc etc haha.

I wouldn’t get a ceramic coating/paint correction again, from a cost pov. I ordered my cars and instructed the dealer to not wash it, is the paint 100% perfection, probably not but it looks pretty good, if necessary I’m not against some polishing, otherwise too much money.

Edit: as for wet washing method, I wouldn’t do it again either (first few times with the foam cannon is fun sure I did it for years haha). Only time would be if the car is really dirty, then I’ll just use a hose or pressure washer first (without touching hand to paint), then proceed to waterless wash method.

I also enjoy applying sealants/waxes haha, and the surface is extra shiny and smooth! Self decon wash upon delivery helps, like an iron remover + some type of paint prep/strip wash, then just apply your favorite protectants!

As for the waterless wash, highly recommend the sponge. I’ve used what some call the Gary deen method where you use like 20+ towels folding and flipping, it’s a hassle and higher risk of scratching. The sponge is just magic haha. But if you’re more comfortable with the towel method, totally fine! Just make sure to wash your towels (and if you buy new towels, wash them before first use).

For your use case, ceramic is nice-to-have, not need-to-have. Garaged, 5k miles/yr, winter storage…paint isn’t getting hammered. If you already enjoy washing and your sealant game is strong, save the $1k. But if you hate spending weekends detailing and want that “always clean” look with minimal effort, CQuartz + Gliss is worth it. No wrong answer

philpose1 wrote

For your use case, ceramic is nice-to-have, not need-to-have. Garaged, 5k miles/yr, winter storage…paint isn’t getting hammered. If you already enjoy washing and your sealant game is strong, save the $1k. But if you hate spending weekends detailing and want that “always clean” look with minimal effort, CQuartz + Gliss is worth it. No wrong answer

Yep, I actually do enjoy some detailing but I wanted to start with the cleanest slate possible. I went ahead and did get a partial front STEK PPF and the whole car got the quartz pro coating. Looks fabulous and will be easier to care for going forward. More driving time.