Time to move on from the E92?

First things first, the E92 is the best car I’ve ever owned and I have yet to drive anything like it. It brought me more joy than all my prior German cars combined, and before the “incident” I would have sworn to you I would keep it forever. The plan was always to keep it indefinitely.

I recently had a track day where it threw a rod during warm up laps. No warning lights, wasn’t pushing it hard, doing about 85 on a straight away. Within a second, the entire car shut down, part of my crank shaft shot through my oil pan, and drenched my drivers side tire in oil. I started spinning as fast as a car can spin, and by some miracle was able to steer my car into the grass. With all the oil on one wheel, I was literally spiraling out of control.

After talking to several mechanics who specialize in M cars, they all said the same thing. After hearing that I replaced the rod bearings, did all preventative maintenance, did a pre track day inspection, they essentially said it could happen at any time. I could rebuild the engine, replace the RBs, but the main bearing will always be a risk.

Essentially, due to the finicky nature of the main bearing, at a moments notice, the S65 can be starved of oil and immediately throw a rod. I will be the first to admit I’m not a mechanic, there are so many of you who know 100x as much as I do about the inner workings of engines, but this is what folks more knowledgeable than I have said.

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i don’t see a way where I can have faith in this platform again.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I want to restate 1. This was my dream car, 2. I had no plans to replace it ever, and 3. Selling this car is the last thing I ever wanted to do.

I don’t necessarily know what I’m looking for here, maybe talk me out of it? Maybe just a little honest feedback, or for someone to share a similar story?

Same can be said of any car really, you’re at the mercy of a stack of machine tolerances with any engine, any platform. You do what you need to do for peace of mind. Sounds like you’re ready to move on. If you’re intent on tracking, get something that isn’t heartbreakingly expensive to repair.

spammysammich wrote

Same can be said of any car really, you’re at the mercy of a stack of machine tolerances with any engine, any platform. You do what you need to do for peace of mind. Sounds like you’re ready to move on. If you’re intent on tracking, get something that isn’t heartbreakingly expensive to repair.

I appreciate the sincere response. I will admit I am a track rookie and this was the first car I tracked.

I guess my thought is that not all cars should be at risk for engine failure when going in a straight line at sub 100 mph speeds, especially when maintained properly? Was I just really unlucky, that 1 in 1,000 guy, or is this a more systemic problem than folks admit?

Like I’m thinking this could’ve happened on the highway at any point in time, and may not even be track related?

For context, in the three different track days I’ve participated in, I was the only person who experienced engine failure, running across every car type, from early 2000s STIs to last years GT3RS’

None of us will share the exact same experiences. It really comes down to whether you’re willing to commit to the hobby and accept the risk, the same risk that could bite you on a casual Sunday drive to Cars and Coffee.

If you want peace of mind in a track car, get something easily serviceable that doesn’t require dropping $15K just to replace an engine.

And honestly, the S2000s and Subarus (WRX/STI) see more engine failures than an M3 ever would. S2Ks are notorious for oiling issues under high lateral Gs. EJ205s and EJ25s are just inherently weak and can let go at any moment. Even some GT3s aren’t bulletproof, the 991.1 had its fair share of engine failures.

That’s just the nature of buying and running second-hand performance cars.

M3Dreaming wrote

First things first, the E92 is the best car I’ve ever owned and I have yet to drive anything like it. It brought me more joy than all my prior German cars combined, and before the “incident” I would have sworn to you I would keep it forever. The plan was always to keep it indefinitely.

I recently had a track day where it threw a rod during warm up laps. No warning lights, wasn’t pushing it hard, doing about 85 on a straight away. Within a second, the entire car shut down, part of my crank shaft shot through my oil pan, and drenched my drivers side tire in oil. I started spinning as fast as a car can spin, and by some miracle was able to steer my car into the grass. With all the oil on one wheel, I was literally spiraling out of control.

After talking to several mechanics who specialize in M cars, they all said the same thing. After hearing that I replaced the rod bearings, did all preventative maintenance, did a pre track day inspection, they essentially said it could happen at any time. I could rebuild the engine, replace the RBs, but the main bearing will always be a risk.

Essentially, due to the finicky nature of the main bearing, at a moments notice, the S65 can be starved of oil and immediately throw a rod. I will be the first to admit I’m not a mechanic, there are so many of you who know 100x as much as I do about the inner workings of engines, but this is what folks more knowledgeable than I have said.

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i [...]

I have a similar sentiment, I like my e92 a lot and it’s served me well so far, but the mains do make me slightly paranoid. I’m considering selling it after my warranty ends due to that failure point. It’s true that all cars can fail but the e9x tends to be pricier to fix than most cars. It’s hard because it’s a very fun car.

F8x seem to be more reliable. I’ve even thought of getting a type R to go polar opposite to bulletproof reliability.

E92Bean wrote

I have a similar sentiment, I like my e92 a lot and it’s served me well so far, but the mains do make me slightly paranoid. I’m considering selling it after my warranty ends due to that failure point. It’s true that all cars can fail but the e9x tends to be pricier to fix than most cars. It’s hard because it’s a very fun car.

F8x seem to be more reliable. I’ve even thought of getting a type R to go polar opposite to bulletproof reliability.

Thank you for your thoughtful reply, this is exactly the sentiment I was looking for. Essentially, someone to acknowledge that I’m not crazy and that as much as we all love the S65, they are not bullet proof and are in comparison with alternative models, carry a certain level of risk with them.

I like your thought on an R, they are fun little guys and with a few tasteful mods can be speed demons. My best friend had one for many years until he switched to a G87

After that can't blame you for leaving the platform honestly. But if I was going to keep it, I'd probably buy a stroker engine from carbahn or similar and keep moving forward.

I used to track lap an '88 RX7 and I would flog the car and it never let me down. When I bought my M3 and told the owner of the driving school what I bought, he said it was a beautiful car and to never put it on a track. Maybe he knew something or maybe he thought it was too nice a car to flog. I wish I still had the RX7 as a track car.

Baba Louey

I chalk it up to being part of the car repair lottery, many will say German car lottery but any car that gets time at the limit can have a failure and risk goes up. Granted this was a known design flaw, but many track the shit out of these things and don’t have any trouble. I see it as random and part of the game. I can certainly understand your dilemma and moving on isn’t a bad thing. This car checks the boxes enough where I’d replace the engine. It’s more about the feel, e9x is dialed in and I’m comfortable with the platform. That’s important to me now and would factor in a decision to sell or not.

M3Dreaming wrote

First things first, the E92 is the best car I’ve ever owned and I have yet to drive anything like it. It brought me more joy than all my prior German cars combined, and before the “incident” I would have sworn to you I would keep it forever. The plan was always to keep it indefinitely.

I recently had a track day where it threw a rod during warm up laps. No warning lights, wasn’t pushing it hard, doing about 85 on a straight away. Within a second, the entire car shut down, part of my crank shaft shot through my oil pan, and drenched my drivers side tire in oil. I started spinning as fast as a car can spin, and by some miracle was able to steer my car into the grass. With all the oil on one wheel, I was literally spiraling out of control.

After talking to several mechanics who specialize in M cars, they all said the same thing. After hearing that I replaced the rod bearings, did all preventative maintenance, did a pre track day inspection, they essentially said it could happen at any time. I could rebuild the engine, replace the RBs, but the main bearing will always be a risk.

Essentially, due to the finicky nature of the main bearing, at a moments notice, the S65 can be starved of oil and immediately throw a rod. I will be the first to admit I’m not a mechanic, there are so many of you who know 100x as much as I do about the inner workings of engines, but this is what folks more knowledgeable than I have said.

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i don’t see a way where I can have faith in this platform again.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I want to restate 1. This was my dream car, 2. I had no plans to replace it ever, and 3. Selling this car is the last thing I ever wanted to do.

I don’t necessarily know what I’m looking for here, maybe talk me out of it? Maybe just a little honest feedback, or for someone to share a similar story?

I'd look at it in a different way. Your car is a 2010. That engine has been through 15 years of god knows what. You got unlucky and the engine should have had more years in it.

Would you pay 15-20 grand to have another 15+ years out of it?

If you truly planned to keep it forever, the answer should be easy. It's a hard car to upgrade from. Nearly anything else is a compromise in some way or significantly more expensive than what this car cost new.

M3Dreaming wrote

First things first, the E92 is the best car I’ve ever owned and I have yet to drive anything like it. It brought me more joy than all my prior German cars combined, and before the “incident” I would have sworn to you I would keep it forever. The plan was always to keep it indefinitely.

I recently had a track day where it threw a rod during warm up laps. No warning lights, wasn’t pushing it hard, doing about 85 on a straight away. Within a second, the entire car shut down, part of my crank shaft shot through my oil pan, and drenched my drivers side tire in oil. I started spinning as fast as a car can spin, and by some miracle was able to steer my car into the grass. With all the oil on one wheel, I was literally spiraling out of control.

After talking to several mechanics who specialize in M cars, they all said the same thing. After hearing that I replaced the rod bearings, did all preventative maintenance, did a pre track day inspection, they essentially said it could happen at any time. I could rebuild the engine, replace the RBs, but the main bearing will always be a risk.

Essentially, due to the finicky nature of the main bearing, at a moments notice, the S65 can be starved of oil and immediately throw a rod. I will be the first to admit I’m not a mechanic, there are so many of you who know 100x as much as I do about the inner workings of engines, but this is what folks more knowledgeable than I have said.

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i don’t see a way where I can have faith in this platform again.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I want to restate 1. This was my dream car, 2. I had no plans to replace it ever, and 3. Selling this car is the last thing I ever wanted to do.

I don’t necessarily know what I’m looking for here, maybe talk me out of it? Maybe just a little honest feedback, or for someone to share a similar story?

Sorry to hear about your engine failure , and the resulting scary spin out!

I wondered if you can shed more light on your engine failure?
You said here that it spat out part of the crankshaft, but elsewhere you said it threw a rod, is the latter the correct comment?
I'll be adding your case to the 'blown engines' list (linked below), so more info would be handy. e.g year and miles of your car, what brand rod bearings were fitted, FSH or not?

Re mains failures, no personal experience myself, but from the stats me and aus have collected in the blown motors thread v2 their are 34 engines with confirmed mains failure plus another potential 6.
Assuming that the majority of failures reported here are from the English speaking world, then those 40* represent about 0.09% of cars sold to NA LHD and ECE RHD markets (UK, and I believe Aus, NZ etc). Although, of course we have no idea what % of owners of blown engines report it on the internet, and then how many find their way here.
*A few of these reports are from the EU.
But I think it still gives some context showing that mains failure are rare.

I think its important to be 100% confident with the car you are driving on a track. Do what you gotta do. Just my .02

To be frank this is one of the reasons I parted with my E90. I miss it bad, but couldn't get over the anxiety of something going wrong, even with thorough maintenance and stewardship. I had the same 'own forever' mentality and put a LOT of time and money into it.

I'm apparently a glutton for punishment and stepped into an F90 after. Love it but it's not the same.

My recommendation is either go for broke, have fun, and accept whatever happens, or just be done with it move on.

Here's one solution to consider - a C7 Z06 LT4 swap.
..
and another LS swap example:
.

I guess I’m in a similar scenario as you. Shot a rod right out the block when I was bearly even getting on it. Car has a g2 blower on it but I bearly even drove it the last 3 years as my main focus was building my company.
If only this danm car wasn’t my dream car 8 years ago I would of dumped it. As of right now the cars getting ready to get a forged internal low compression build at lang racing. Still don’t know how I feel about it but will see haha

M3Dreaming wrote

First things first, the E92 is the best car I’ve ever owned and I have yet to drive anything like it. It brought me more joy than all my prior German cars combined, and before the “incident” I would have sworn to you I would keep it forever. The plan was always to keep it indefinitely.

I recently had a track day where it threw a rod during warm up laps. No warning lights, wasn’t pushing it hard, doing about 85 on a straight away. Within a second, the entire car shut down, part of my crank shaft shot through my oil pan, and drenched my drivers side tire in oil. I started spinning as fast as a car can spin, and by some miracle was able to steer my car into the grass. With all the oil on one wheel, I was literally spiraling out of control.

After talking to several mechanics who specialize in M cars, they all said the same thing. After hearing that I replaced the rod bearings, did all preventative maintenance, did a pre track day inspection, they essentially said it could happen at any time. I could rebuild the engine, replace the RBs, but the main bearing will always be a risk.

Essentially, due to the finicky nature of the main bearing, at a moments notice, the S65 can be starved of oil and immediately throw a rod. I will be the first to admit I’m not a mechanic, there are so many of you who know 100x as much as I do about the inner workings of engines, but this is what folks more knowledgeable than I have said.

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i don’t see a way where I can have faith in this platform again.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I want to restate 1. This was my dream car, 2. I had no plans to replace it ever, and 3. Selling this car is the last thing I ever wanted to do.

I don’t necessarily know what I’m looking for here, maybe talk me out of it? Maybe just a little honest feedback, or for someone to share a similar story?

Sorry about your loss . But It's good to hear , you were able to save yourself and the car....
He got S65 bearing failure at the German Autobahn.
He was less fortunate , he and his passenger ended up in the hospital. As you can see ..

M3Dreaming wrote

First things first, the E92 is the best car I’ve ever owned and I have yet to drive anything like it. It brought me more joy than all my prior German cars combined, and before the “incident” I would have sworn to you I would keep it forever. The plan was always to keep it indefinitely.

I recently had a track day where it threw a rod during warm up laps. No warning lights, wasn’t pushing it hard, doing about 85 on a straight away. Within a second, the entire car shut down, part of my crank shaft shot through my oil pan, and drenched my drivers side tire in oil. I started spinning as fast as a car can spin, and by some miracle was able to steer my car into the grass. With all the oil on one wheel, I was literally spiraling out of control.

After talking to several mechanics who specialize in M cars, they all said the same thing. After hearing that I replaced the rod bearings, did all preventative maintenance, did a pre track day inspection, they essentially said it could happen at any time. I could rebuild the engine, replace the RBs, but the main bearing will always be a risk.

Essentially, due to the finicky nature of the main bearing, at a moments notice, the S65 can be starved of oil and immediately throw a rod. I will be the first to admit I’m not a mechanic, there are so many of you who know 100x as much as I do about the inner workings of engines, but this is what folks more knowledgeable than I have said.

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i don’t see a way where I can have faith in this platform again.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I want to restate 1. This was my dream car, 2. I had no plans to replace it ever, and 3. Selling this car is the last thing I ever wanted to do.

I don’t necessarily know what I’m looking for here, maybe talk me out of it? Maybe just a little honest feedback, or for someone to share a similar story?

Cars are dangerous. You are lucky. You should feel good right now. I'm glad you are ok. Same thing or worse could happen from any number of catastrophic failures. People have tires blow on the highway, drive off the road, and die.

If you love the e92, drop a built motor in there.

People don't realize how bad things can be and how unsafe street cars really are at high speeds. This is why most serious race cars have carbon tubs, or at least a proper cage and restraint systems - you have a much better chance of surviving a high speed impact.

Street cars really aren't safe on the track....at all. That being said, it's where I started before I got serious into racing. Now that I'm retired, I have no desire to go back - the risk is too high.

Overall, my message is - Life is weird; live every day to the fullest. If the car brings you joy, don't get rid of it; get back on the horse cowboy.

Peace

DrFerry wrote

Here's one solution to consider - a C7 Z06 LT4 swap.
.

.
and another LS swap example:
.

Comes with free jello salad and a kiss from your cousin.

I kid, I kid.

TechE wrote

To be frank this is one of the reasons I parted with my E90. I miss it bad, but couldn't get over the anxiety of something going wrong, even with thorough maintenance and stewardship. I had the same 'own forever' mentality and put a LOT of time and money into it.

I'm apparently a glutton for punishment and stepped into an F90 after. Love it but it's not the same.

My recommendation is either go for broke, have fun, and accept whatever happens, or just be done with it move on.

Ha!

I bought an F90 and the motor went...e92 still going strong. The irony.

Knock on wood; wishing you well.

Sorry to read your misfortune. That would sincerely break my heart if it happened to me. FWIW I’ve attended around 8 track days in 11-12 years of ownership myself and I am currenty at 280,085 miles. I’ve had my fair share of crap come up but I wouldn’t let this car go for anything. Any car can fail at a track day even if it is pampered, so I wouldn’t leave the E9X platform for that reason but maybe something more affordable would suit you better. Sometimes change is good though and it might re ignite your passion for racing. Good luck making your decision.

There are better driving cars out there than the E92 no question. Just bring fun money. Explore & enjoy.

M3Dreaming wrote

Putting aside the fact that I could have died (what if I had been doing 140 on a straight away), or 50+ on a turn with a nice cement wall right there, i don’t see a way where I can have faith in this platform again.

What if the car in front of you blows a motor and covers your tires in oil? What if the guy behind you blows out his brakes coming into 10A at road Atlanta?

Sounds like your problem isn’t the m3, sounds like it’s you don’t need to be on track in any car.