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12-11-2015LAST POST
This thread has been my friday night entertainment :popcorn:

This is so interesting, I didn't look at my TV once while reading this thread. :lol:

That Morr post was such a out of no where slap in the face. I have always been a fan of Morr, and it has only grown over the past months.

As for ADV.1, I too have liked their designs, yet never really got why they were so expensive.

I hope this thread continues with more priceless information....
MatthewDavid wrote
Not looking good here... And it's a shame, because ADV's rims are pretty great looking. I'm sure I speak for many people on this forum when I say that I truly hope Jordan et al can change my mind about the business.

Their rims are like wanting to date an incredibly hot woman you know is also unmedicated bipolar: looks amazing, but really, you just shouldn't.
They had there chance as 360 Forged, failed miserably. It's already obvious he lied about all ADV's wheels being TUV certified, why should we believe him now when he says "Oh yeah, the M3 wheels were before, but nothing else"? Wonder if that line changes depending on what car forum he's on...
KEYON wrote
This thread has been my friday night entertainment :popcorn:

This is so interesting, I didn't look at my TV once while reading this thread. :lol:

That Morr post was such a out of no where slap in the face. I have always been a fan of Morr, and it has only grown over the past months.

As for ADV.1, I too have liked their designs, yet never really got why they were so expensive.

I hope this thread continues with more priceless information....
Wouldn't hurt for Morr to go ahead and post that picture. Telling us it's on Flickr doesn't really help us track it down.
Trevor .:R wrote
LOL ^^^ Exactly ! :party0030: Cant wait till ADV Goes under such a bad company no customer support they need to restart there whole operation...
you're clearly not speaking from experience. They were great with me. I even spoke with Jordan multiple times during my transaction with them. They answered all my questions (and believe me, I would send them an e-mail probably 3-5 times a week for ~6 weeks). Their customer support is great.
KEYON wrote
As for ADV.1, I too have liked their designs, yet never really got why they were so expensive.
My guess is that the manufacturer of the wheels already have quite a premium on the wheels. I got a quote for MHT wheels and the pricing was only about 100-200 off quoted prices for similar ADV.1 models. I have to admit the ADV.1 designs look better than the MHT / DUBone / Niche wheels.
MR///M3 wrote
you're clearly not speaking from experience. They were great with me. I even spoke with Jordan multiple times during my transaction with them. They answered all my questions (and believe me, I would send them an e-mail probably 3-5 times a week for ~6 weeks). Their customer support is great.
I am speaking from experience, my father has a 997 porsche turbo S, he ordered ADV7s polished finished then clear coated them. They came shipped poorly and scratches all over the finish. I have pictures to back this up, so they were sent back to have the finish redone. And then they came back fitment was off and had to be resent out again. Finally they came back and the centers were cut to small and the wheels could not have even been mounted. ADV is never going to have my business or my fathers ever again.
Trevor .:R wrote
I am speaking from experience, my father has a 997 porsche turbo S, he ordered ADV7s polished finished then clear coated them. They came shipped poorly and scratches all over the finish. I have pictures to back this up, so they were sent back to have the finish redone. And then they came back fitment was off and had to be resent out again. Finally they came back and the centers were cut to small and the wheels could not have even been mounted. ADV is never going to have my business or my fathers ever again.
Well I'm sure you're case is one that's very rare because I had a great experience and everyone else I've spoken to about them has had nothing but great things to say about their customer support.
littered with bad experience from ADV.1 says enough. Not even including the whole 360Forge scam artist shit. I love how Jordan says he was not part of it excuse this new that...ROFL...pathetic.
how come Active Autoworke is supporting ADV.1 if they're that bad?
isugoo wrote
how come Active Autoworke is supporting ADV.1 if they're that bad?
they're both in Miami, they support each other. Its good marketing, simple as that.
isugoo wrote
how come Active Autoworke is supporting ADV.1 if they're that bad?
They aren't that bad at all. There's a couple sour/butt hurt members on here that if you look at every single ADV.1 thread, they put their 2 cents in saying how bad they are.
This forum is littered with bad experiences? Do tell. We have horrible customer service? First i'm hearing of it. Our wheels are expensive? Yes - some are - others can be had around the 4k mark from a dealer which for a fully forged custom wheel is no worse than anything else on the market from any other manufacture. 360 Forged? Four years on and we still don't have anything better to talk about? Can't wait for us going out of business from "scamming customers"? We doubled our sales volume in the last year and we operate 100% on profit so I hate to disappoint that it won't be happening any time soon.

Trevor - it sounds like you had legitimate issues and it also sounds like we worked with your father to resolve them in a timely manner refinishing the wheels. What was resolved of this? If you or your father wasn't properly taken care of and feel that the product wasn't up to your expectations we'll take care of it right now. I can say we've had issues with our shipping in the early days (so i'm not surprised to see this was an issue) and have revamped this part of our operation from the ground up to avoid issues in the future.

But please do not confuse a manufacture or shipping defect as bad customer service. They are unrelated. From what you're stating we worked with your father to try and resolve the situation in a timely manner. We never claimed to be perfect - but when we're not we stand by our product and bend over backwards to make things right for you. Trevor - email me if your father still has any issues/concerns so I can set things right.

As far as everyone else still claiming our product is crap... you know the product that is certified to be of the same quality as all of the wheels you're touting to be superior... most of which have no first hand experience with our company or our product there isn't anything more I can do to change your mind. We are creating wheels in accordance with the quality benchmark (TUV) you set. I'm not sure what else we can do to please you.
ADV.1 Matt wrote
This forum is littered with bad experiences? Do tell. We have horrible customer service? First i'm hearing of it. Our wheels are expensive? Yes - some are - others can be had around the 4k mark from a dealer which for a fully forged custom wheel is no worse than anything else on the market from any other manufacture. 360 Forged? Four years on and we still don't have anything better to talk about? Can't wait for us going out of business from "scamming customers"? We doubled our sales volume in the last year and we operate 100% on profit so I hate to disappoint that it won't be happening any time soon.

Trevor - it sounds like you had legitimate issues and it also sounds like we worked with your father to resolve them in a timely manner refinishing the wheels. What was resolved of this? If you or your father wasn't properly taken care of and feel that the product wasn't up to your expectations we'll take care of it right now. I can say we've had issues with our shipping in the early days (so i'm not surprised to see this was an issue) and have revamped this part of our operation from the ground up to avoid issues in the future.

But please do not confuse a manufacture or shipping defect as bad customer service. They are unrelated. From what you're stating we worked with your father to try and resolve the situation in a timely manner. We never claimed to be perfect - but when we're not we stand by our product and bend over backwards to make things right for you. Trevor - email me if your father still has any issues/concerns so I can set things right.

As far as everyone else still claiming our product is crap... you know the product that is certified to be of the same quality as all of the wheels you're touting to be superior... most of which have no first hand experience with our company or our product there isn't anything more I can do to change your mind. We are creating wheels in accordance with the quality benchmark (TUV) you set. I'm not sure what else we can do to please you.
Thank you! This was needed. :clap:
ADV.1 Matt wrote
This forum is littered with bad experiences? Do tell. We have horrible customer service? First i'm hearing of it. Our wheels are expensive? Yes - some are - others can be had around the 4k mark from a dealer which for a fully forged custom wheel is no worse than anything else on the market from any other manufacture. 360 Forged? Four years on and we still don't have anything better to talk about? Can't wait for us going out of business from "scamming customers"? We doubled our sales volume in the last year and we operate 100% on profit so I hate to disappoint that it won't be happening any time soon.

Trevor - it sounds like you had legitimate issues and it also sounds like we worked with your father to resolve them in a timely manner refinishing the wheels. What was resolved of this? If you or your father wasn't properly taken care of and feel that the product wasn't up to your expectations we'll take care of it right now. I can say we've had issues with our shipping in the early days (so i'm not surprised to see this was an issue) and have revamped this part of our operation from the ground up to avoid issues in the future.

But please do not confuse a manufacture or shipping defect as bad customer service. They are unrelated. From what you're stating we worked with your father to try and resolve the situation in a timely manner. We never claimed to be perfect - but when we're not we stand by our product and bend over backwards to make things right for you. Trevor - email me if your father still has any issues/concerns so I can set things right.

As far as everyone else still claiming our product is crap... you know the product that is certified to be of the same quality as all of the wheels you're touting to be superior... most of which have no first hand experience with our company or our product there isn't anything more I can do to change your mind. We are creating wheels in accordance with the quality benchmark (TUV) you set. I'm not sure what else we can do to please you.
Solid. Nicely said.
i still dont' get it... how can a set of 21" MSRP can be over 10g for ADV1.
Matthew - I'm not trying to argue and I don't feel I've acted unprofessionally with anyone on this forum. However, please don't confuse me trying to address the blatantly false accusations being made about our company and product as trying to act unprofessional. I'm simply trying to interject a few facts into the discussion and like most "arguments" on internet forums no one ever gives up an inch on what they believe or what they've heard from their mothers brothers aunt's mailman about the topic regardless of actual firsthand knowledge of the topics discussed and things quickly spiral downward. It's the nature of the beast unfortunately but we NEVER call people out, act disrespectful, or try and berate members. Period. End of discussion.

Per Jordan's argument on L4P - It must've been before my time because we have a stellar reputation on that forum and no bad blood with anyone i've seen in my time with ADV.1. My job for the first 6 months was simply to be online forums and interact with communities, answer questions, etc and i've seen no evidence of that forum rejecting us. Again - i'm not trying to be disrespectful to you - simply stating that my experience hasn't been that and i've seen no evidence of that.

Now onto addressing the TUV certification more in depth and why only having one set certified for the M3 platform...

What we haven't been able to explain well enough apparently is that with TUV certification you can have a 20X8.5, 20X10.5 setup for the M3 that is built and TUV certified. Another wheel built next in line with the identical materials, in the same factory, on the same machine, at the same time, but running a 20X8.5, 20X11 M3 setup (or even an identical 20X8.5, 20X10.5 but with a different spoke design) is considered by TUV to be a completely different wheel and thus won't have certification.

From a structural and quality standpoint there is NO difference between the 20X10.5, and 20X11 wheel - the only difference is the paperwork. Our wheels haven't changed in their manufacturing process since day one which means getting all of our wheels TUV certified is simply a matter of paperwork.

This is why we've been able to achieve a TUV manufacturing certification and why now we can pump paperwork through on tons of wheels to make things official on anything our customers need TUV certified. But understand - paperwork or no paperwork the quality and safety of the wheels on the 20X11 wheel (or different spoke design wheel) isn't compromised simply because it doesn't have the paperwork. They are ALL made in accordance to TUV standards and have been since day one.

If that wasn't the case we would not have been able to achieve TUV manufacturing status. Now i'm sure someone at this point will say "But X company says their entire line is TUV certified". Most wheel manufactures that don't build custom offsets can do this simply because there is a finite amount of widths and offsets possible to achieve this. They may only offer a 19X8.5 19X10.5 in 4 offsets, and as such only have to certify 8 wheels to have that entire line TUV certified.

For us on the other hand as we can build ANY offset you'd like to have our entire lineup TUV certified we'd have to build and test a 19X10 +0, 19X10 +1, 19X10 +2, 19X10 +3, and on and on and on. And then after we certified 150 wheels for the rear at 2k a pop for certification we'd have to do the same for the front wheel. No company has done this before and this is why we haven't - there is no reason to as the actual structure and safety/load rating of the wheel doesn't change with a different offset. Which is why we don't TUV certify "every" wheel.

For our 1-piece wheels alone it would require 40 different forgings (wheel sizes), x 12 spoke designs x roughly 100 different offset permutations which would only require about 48,000 wheels to be certified to have our entire 1-piece line officially TUV certified in every fitment configuration possible. And then we'd have to start in on our 3-piece wheels. Do you think any other big name wheel manufacture did that to TUV certify their entire line? Of course not.

Hopefully this can help claify why this whole TUV certified/not TUV certified thing is a slightly ridiculous discussion to begin with. The facts are this - our wheels are up to TUV standards or we wouldn't have been able to get TUV manufacturing certification. Every ADV.1 wheel on the road can pass that certification but are we going to certify every style and option? No. And no other company would either. For our customers in Germany - where this certification is actually necessary, those are the applications we're going to certify for on their specific orders.

I hope this can clarify the TUV certification and any concerns with the safety of our product line.
checkmate wrote
Are VMR wheels (sold by EAS and ModBargains) legit?
They're gravity cast wheels made in taiwan. Claim to be JWL/VIA.
now i understand why the Really big wheel companys dont' pump out # of designs as ADV.
What is TUV?

Over the years HRE has received numerous questions regarding TUV certification. What is it? Why is it important? What is required? Other companies are starting to claim they have TUV certification and we have received numerous questions as to whether these claims are true or false. HRE can’t determine whether others are properly going through the legitimate process of getting TUV approval or just falsely claiming TUV approval to improve their image. What we can do is clarify what is required of TUV and what you should be looking for from a company that claims to have TUV approval.

Image hosted on: farm8.staticflickr.com

1) WHAT IS TUV? - In the case of wheels, TUV is a European auditing and certification body that ensures wheels manufactured for sale in Germany, Switzerland and Austria meet international (ECE Regulations), EC (European Community) directives, and German Motor Traffic Agency (KBA) road traffic legislation.

2) HOW DOES TUV WORK? - There are 3 major aspects to receiving TUV certification.
a) Manufacturer Certification (Certification of the wheel manufacturer’s quality management system) - If you aren’t an actual manufacturer you can’t be a TUV certified manufacturer. If you’re not a real manufacturer and your supplier isn’t a TUV certified manufacturer you cannot have your wheels TUV approved. This requires that the actual manufacturing facility (in HRE’s case this is our production facility at our headquarters in Vista, CA) passes an audit every 3 years by TUV authorities from Europe. The facility must ensure the manufacture of its wheels meet the standards set by the authorities above in point 1. This is very similar to an ISO 9001 audit and designed to ensure consistent quality of manufacture. TUV wants to ensure that wheels sent to TUV for te sting are not “ringers” and that all wheels manufactured at the approved facility meet the same standards. HRE’s quality management system was originally certified in 2008 by Germany and recertified in 2011 by Austria (which is applicable for Germany).

b) WHEEL TESTING CERTIFICATES (Certification of wheels as conforming to geometric standards and having passed structural fatigue and impact requirements for specific vehicle and load rating requirements) - Once a manufacturer’s facility is certified they are then able to send wheels to Europe to pass TUV geometric tolerance analysis and testing for fatigue and impact. This is not a generic style-based test, but vehicle-based with each style being tested with the proper widths and offsets and load rating for the appropriate vehicle targets. This is a very time consuming and costly endeavor for any manufacturer to TUV certify their entire wheel offering, particularly a brand like HRE that makes custom fitments and offers dozens of styles for any particular vehicle. Given this fact, HRE does not certify every style and fitment, however we do have multiple styles in several fitments tested, approved and certified for sale in Germany, Switzerland and Austria. Regardless of certification, ALL HRE wheels are designed to pass TUV structural specifications (with varying load ratings depending on vehicle targets) and are sent for certification when the demand for them in Europe meets a minimum threshold.

c) VEHICLE OWNER CERTIFICATION (Certificates ensuring wheels installed on an owner’s vehicle are TUV certified for that vehicle) - This is a certificate that the owner of the vehicle receives from TUV authorities showing his wheels are TUV certified so he can legally register his vehicle and pass annual inspections in Germany. The wheel manufacturer does not supply this document.

3) IS TUV FOR WHEELS ONLY? - TUV does not only cover wheels. It covers everything from toys to wheels to appliances so companies may hold TUV certificates that do not in any way allow them to legally sell wheels in Germany, Switzerland or Austria. By the same token HRE is only able to sell wheels (not toys) and only those wheels tested in Europe having passed the appropriate tests. None of this is possible without FIRST receiving the manufacturer certification. More importantly, simply by having a wheel pass a TUV test does NOT mean you are a TUV certified manufacturer. You must have a manufacturing facility to certify and that facility must pass the audit.

4) WHY DOESN'T HRE PUBLISH TUV CERTIFICATIONS? - We’ve been asked for a long time to publish TUV certificates. For many reasons HRE does not publish internal specifications and documents, but we will deviate from that decision to help clarify the confusion and show you our manufacturer certificates from 2008 and 2011 and we will show you an example of a wheel testing certificate; in this case the latest wheels sent to TUV for testing, a P43 in 20x9.5 ET42, PCD 5/114.3. The tests required 3 wheels to be tested for cornering fatigue, radial fatigue and impact at 750kg, a much higher level than the original design load rating. All passed. These tests certify the P43 style in that specific width, offset and PCD for that specific load rating.

Image hosted on: farm8.staticflickr.com

Image hosted on: farm8.staticflickr.com

Image hosted on: farm8.staticflickr.com


5) HOW DO I KNOW IF A COMPANY IS REALLY TUV APPROVED? - TUV obviously wants to ensure others aren’t making false claims about TUV approval. For this reason they have a simple website system to check a manufacturer’s TUV Registration ID number. HRE’s current TUV ID number is 20102112006509. This number can be confirmed as genuine by following the link below to the TUV website and entering the registration number or simply typing in HRE. Ask a manufacturer for their registration ID number and website link. They should be proud to give it to you.

HRE TUV ID check: CLICK HERE
awesome post Lon! HRE is so win... maybe one day i'll get a set.
oh shit. game over son

HRE FTW
Lon wins.