Do you think E92s will continue to skyrocket in value?

akkando wrote

And 2008 cars are fine. They have all they important stuff and are a tail light and infotainment swap away from a modern look and feel. That's definitely where the best deals are.

I agree; all model years are basically the same m3. They're all great!

I just recently bought my '08 vert; not caring it had an outdated infotainment system or tail lights. For me, the things I really cared about was: a color other than Black, White, and Silver, lower miles, and one that was well cared for.

When I was searching for the right e93 M3, I didn't notice really any difference in asking price regardless of model year. Seemed like the the differentiator was really the mileage of the car and overall condition. I was surprised that it seemed like every model year was relatively the same asking price; if miles were close to the same.

So, seems that most people looking for an e93, at least, don't care about infotainment systems and tail light design. I sure don't. I've rarely even listened to my audio since I've bought the car.

Federal Reserve Chairman Powell testified in front of Congress today, and reported that all used car prices are up 10% during the last thirty days. So, this would indicate that we are in a raising bubble that will probably last through 2021.

tbuck wrote

chocstraw wrote

I have a feeling that this newsom era policy won't stick, it feels like a political promise far enough outside of his legacy that it can be quietly undone. Considering that CARB was able to get pretty much every car in the US on its emissions guidelines, it's a substantial market share that won't be given up. We'll see.

Another problem with these type of mandates is that they ignore the fact that there is no way that the underlying infrastructure, power plants and power transmission systems, are up for the massive increase in usage of electricity needed to charge the millions of cars a year that will be produced. Western states already have to deal with brown-outs so imagine if every car was also pulling juice off the grid. Pie in the sky, feel-good politics do not in fact have much to do with reality. No doubt an electric car in every garage will be a future reality, just not tomorrow, and not in 10 years either.

All new cars sold in California being electric by 2030 doesn't put an electric car in every garage in ten years, just for people who buy new. I think California would find a way to start the storm for the transition if it wants to, it doesn't have to be perfect, policy in California doesn't have to be very good because it has jobs, good weather, and cool stuff. Anyway even if they kick the can down the road it's looming on the horizon. If you're a car company does it make sense to keep investing in NA V8 engines even if California delays, and maybe again delay, but maybe they don't.

I'm bumping this in efforts to keep it somewhat current. I sold my 23k mile M3 to get into my current car. I planned all along to grab another slightly higher mileage car (~40k miles) a little down the road. With prices as they are the value for these car (according to me) is simply not there anymore. A 40k mile car used to be high $38-40k for a perfect one, now they are $50+.

Yup, funny how people in mid July thought this “bubble” would burst in a few months. Prices have only gone up since and will probably continue to do so. It keeps getting harder to find a clean non molested example plus the fact that used car values are also very high.

Car manufacturers like it this way, they are producing less cars but making the same (if not more) amount of $$.

GeorgeA wrote

Yup, funny how people in mid July thought this "bubble" would burst in a few months. Prices have only gone up since and will probably continue to do so. It keeps getting harder to find a clean non molested example plus the fact that used car values are also very high.

Car manufacturers like it this way, they are producing less cars but making the same (if not more) amount of $$.

100% agree. I think until we have a major market correction (e.g., minor recession) it is improbable that E9xs will fall significantly in price. Throw in the impact of inflation and suddenly its almost as though E9xs have move in parallel with everything else. I'm glad I pulled the trigger on an E92 CF roof with 56k miles for 32,500 in space grey no accidents toward the end of 2021.

Yes I didn't get the car for a steal, but I got my dream car that is in great shape but not so clean I'm scared to drive it. I waited and saved and shopped for the better part of a year (much longer on the savings part) and it was the best deal I came across.

Just one data point for folks still looking at making their first E9x purchase but it seems like the prices have only continued to climb at a material rate since early 2021.

Is this still a bubble? or Should I just stop waiting and pay 35k for 08 90k miles?

Brian setsu wrote

Is this still a bubble? or Should I just stop waiting and pay 35k for 08 90k miles?

The way it looks to me (and I have informally been tracking prices for the last 18 months or so) there is still very much a used car bubble. My father in law sold his super low mileage MB SLK to Carvana because they offered him about $3500 more than anyone else. Others tell of similar situations. So overall, the used market is still hot.

The issue with the E9x M3 market is that, while it has been carried along by the used market in general, they are not only well out of the depreciation curve but now they are fully into the "collectors" up swing. This is really shown by looking at the low-mileage and desirable color cars, as they have gone up by a good bit more than the market as a whole. Likely without the COVID BS going down this would have taken a few more years to reach this point, much like the E46 M3 did.

My view is that as the new car market gets passed the lingering supply chain problems and the used market sees a correction after that, I do not think the E9x market will see much downward pressure. Reality is, this is the last NA car, the last hydraulic steering car, the only V8 car and the lowest production M3 since the E30. All that makes it desirable long term both for collectors and enthusiasts alike, and so demand for even the high-mile, well worn examples will remain higher than supply from now on.

M3Dreaming wrote

100% agree. I think until we have a major market correction (e.g., minor recession) it is improbable that E9xs will fall significantly in price. Throw in the impact of inflation and suddenly its almost as though E9xs have move in parallel with everything else. I'm glad I pulled the trigger on an E92 CF roof with 56k miles for 32,500 in space grey no accidents toward the end of 2021.

Yes I didn't get the car for a steal, but I got my dream car that is in great shape but not so clean I'm scared to drive it. I waited and saved and shopped for the better part of a year (much longer on the savings part) and it was the best deal I came across.

Just one data point for folks still looking at making their first E9x purchase but it seems like the prices have only continued to climb at a material rate since early 2021.

I'd say you got that car for a steal!

Beautiful color too.

Logically it should continue to go up seeing it is the second rarest M3 generation.

Last 4 e9x m3s that on BAT didn’t meet reserve….. Glad to see the market softening

I've been looking into getting an E92 M3 also. I'm just waiting for the market to cool down and waiting to pay the G30 off. I wouldn't take a loan out on an older car (E9x M3s are like 11 years old or what have you). Your interest rates going to be stupid high. Even if the economy goes back to normal.

Then the search begins

Mosaud1998 wrote

I've been looking into getting an E92 M3 also. I'm just waiting for the market to cool down and waiting to pay the G30 off. I wouldn't take a loan out on an older car (E9x M3s are like 11 years old or what have you). Your interest rates going to be stupid high. Even if the economy goes back to normal.

Then the search begins

I've had the same interest rate on my e92 as I've had on newer cars (1.99%).

VR1 wrote

I've had the same interest rate on my e92 as I've had on newer cars (1.99%).

How'd you get 1.9% on a used car?

Mosaud1998 wrote

VR1 wrote

I've had the same interest rate on my e92 as I've had on newer cars (1.99%).

How'd you get 1.9% on a used car?

I used a credit union called DCU. However this was last year and I believe their rates are now like 5.24%, but nothing too crazy.

In addition to my 1.9% I also got a 5 year no deductible bumper to bumper warranty for like $3k which has paid for itself so it was pretty much like buying a new car lol

VR1 wrote

Mosaud1998 wrote

VR1 wrote

I've had the same interest rate on my e92 as I've had on newer cars (1.99%).

How'd you get 1.9% on a used car?

I used a credit union called DCU. However this was last year and I believe their rates are now like 5.24%, but nothing too crazy.

In addition to my 1.9% I also got a 5 year no deductible bumper to bumper warranty for like $3k which has paid for itself so it was pretty much like buying a new car lol

Which extended warranty company did you use? I'm also in the market for one. Thanks.

I don't think it'll skyrocket, but it'll hold its value other than the very few exception. I don't buy cars as an investment, if it holds value, it's good, if it doesn't, oh well.
Also, interest rate being so high is not helping with the news being all dooms day lol.
People who pay will be the ones that wants to seek the nostalgia.

Usually banks don't want to finance cars older than 8 years. They just think in terms of repo value. Special interest cars are hit and miss for them.

I think this bubble will partially hold, specifically for sports cars or or performance cars with specific driving experiences.

People did start asking too much for these. At the end of the day it is a front engined V8 car with rear wheel drive, and sub 3800 lbs and there are not a lot of way to get that anymore or from the past. Never again will ITBs hit the consumer mass market.

The E9X M3 is too much of a special interest car and too unique in BMWs line up historically for values to truly bottom out.

Look at the DUMB money E36s are going for.

Bump - It is interesting now that ~2-3 years have passed and values if anything have come down. Despite inflation, it turns out that I was not at risk of E9xs skyrocketing in value, and should have been asking a different question, will they even hold their value? I could likely sell mine for ~4k more than what I got it for with an additional 10k miles driven, but that doesn't account for the ~5k in preventative maintenance and ~3-4k in taxes paid.

As a general rule of thumb, as an every day consumer (i.e., not an auto expert), buying a car is never a good investment, as the costs of ownership (interest, insurance, gas, depreciation, repairs) always offset the marginal increases in value. If you are someone who makes a living buying and selling cars, you clearly are a SME and therefore this doesn't apply to you.

M3Dreaming wrote

Bump - It is interesting now that ~2-3 years have passed and values if anything have come down. Despite inflation, it turns out that I was not at risk of E9xs skyrocketing in value, and should have been asking a different question, will they even hold their value? I could likely sell mine for ~4k more than what I got it for with an additional 10k miles driven, but that doesn't account for the ~5k in preventative maintenance and ~3-4k in taxes paid.

As a general rule of thumb, as an every day consumer (i.e., not an auto expert), buying a car is never a good investment, as the costs of ownership (interest, insurance, gas, depreciation, repairs) always offset the marginal increases in value. If you are someone who makes a living buying and selling cars, you clearly are a SME and therefore this doesn't apply to you.

10k miles of awesomeness so even if you end up losing money, its money well spent. Would you do it again regardless? I would

nevin wrote

10k miles of awesomeness so even if you end up losing money, its money well spent. Would you do it again regardless? I would

Couldn't agree more, worth every penny. I moreso just thought it was interesting how far off my initial concern was (2-3 years ago I worried that now these cars would be unaffordable)

M3Dreaming wrote

Bump - It is interesting now that ~2-3 years have passed and values if anything have come down. Despite inflation, it turns out that I was not at risk of E9xs skyrocketing in value, and should have been asking a different question, will they even hold their value? I could likely sell mine for ~4k more than what I got it for with an additional 10k miles driven, but that doesn't account for the ~5k in preventative maintenance and ~3-4k in taxes paid.

As a general rule of thumb, as an every day consumer (i.e., not an auto expert), buying a car is never a good investment, as the costs of ownership (interest, insurance, gas, depreciation, repairs) always offset the marginal increases in value. If you are someone who makes a living buying and selling cars, you clearly are a SME and therefore this doesn't apply to you.

most importantly though, the opportunity cost of what you could have earned if you invested the money is what really separates cars from true investments. sure, there are exceptions - I think 3.2 RS Porsches increased in value 7 fold over 10 years or something - but that's exceptionally rare.