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11-25-2008, 06:34 PM | #46 |
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BMW M Mexico: Wouldn't this just be cheaper than the stroker and make far more power: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Parts...3A1|240%3A1318
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11-25-2008, 07:27 PM | #47 | |
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11-25-2008, 08:42 PM | #48 | |
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The weight is definitely an issue, 40 kg difference. That includes the transmission, which should be lighter than the DCT. Anyway, I saw that, and it got me thinking... |
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11-25-2008, 10:31 PM | #49 |
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V8 stroker produces both more hp and more torque than the stock V10, 34hp more than 500 is more than barely IMO but nevertheless not a huge amount, stoker V8 also produces more torque than the 383 pounds feet of the stock S85 V10. So, more hp, more torque and at least 50kg less due to the lighter nature of the V8 stroker relative to the stock V8. My car is not DCT so weight in that respect is not an issue. Besides even if it were, I would rather have the DCT over the SMG that is not possible yet since it does not fit the V10. I did analyze the V10 possibility but thought I would rather retain (or improve) the carīs balance and get enough NA power and lose some weight in other areas. At the end of the day I will have an M3 that is lighter by 200 lbs than the stock E92 M3 and produces more power than even the 911 GT2 at sea level with similar weight (and significantly more power than a 911 tt). That is my goal. Not possible to achieve this goal I think with the V10 shoed into the M3 chassis and also not going to be less expensive than going with the stoker kit. Still, if your willing to spend the extra $$$, V10 stoker is most certainly enticing and for sure lots of fun, just not what I want. I already own a 700 plus hp twin turbo Mercedes AMG in a slightly lighter chassis that the E92M3 than will most certainly kick any M stokerīs ass straight line and probably under most "bends" on highways and streets (since no one pushes cars to the limit generally on highways), just not on track that is what I want from this one.
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11-25-2008, 10:37 PM | #50 | |
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I mentioned DCT as, well, I was thinking of my car, and also substituting 7 speed for 7 speed. I would rather have less weight and more power, but the v10 is an interesting option at that particular price. The v8 stroker is clearly the better track option for the chassis. The 997 GT2 dyno's 480 wheel on a mustang, I don't see the stroker even coming close. If it does though, sign me up. |
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11-25-2008, 11:19 PM | #51 | |
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11-26-2008, 12:37 AM | #52 | |
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Of course losses aren't only 10%, the figure is obviously underrated. Many cars are underrated and produce more power than manufacturers state on paper, the 335 even falls into this category. The GT2 is underrated just like the GT3 is underrated which dyno's 380 wheel. The dyno I have for the 997 GT2 is very accurate, from AWE-Tuning, one of the most respected in the tuner business. Crank figures or stated figures don't mean anything, the stroker will not dyno the same as a 997 GT2, I wish it could though. Absolutely, 18 grand just for the engine and transmissions, sounds like a good deal for those parts. Just brainstorming In case you might be interested in the 997 GT2 and AWE's work on it, they are now over 580 wheel with just the usual bolt on's: http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...er-2008-a.html Here is the chart just for fun, I think it is VERY optimistic for the stroker to get near something like a 997 GT2, I think 450 wheel on a mustang would be an incredible achievement for RDsport: |
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11-26-2008, 09:31 AM | #54 | |
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11-26-2008, 08:14 PM | #56 |
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11-26-2008, 08:16 PM | #57 | |
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Dinan is going to do it but swapping the V10 in takes something away from the M3 IMO. It is not a bad way to go if someone wants maximum power in a naturally aspirated form, as in swapping in a stroker V10. Dyno's can be manipulated to an extent, but that is why there are certain tuners we trust. Anyway, can't wait to see your project come along (and I am disappointed RDsport is gone). As far as the dyno for your chip, I don't know anything about that particular dyno and was not familiar with it at all and have not seen major tuners use it. No point of reference for me, I'm sure the company knows what they were doing though. |
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11-26-2008, 08:26 PM | #58 | |
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The GT3 is underrated, along with the GT2, Carrera GT, and Ford GT. So, just depends, the 03 cobra was underrated big time as well. Some cars are overrated, the RX8 being overrated to the point Mazda had to revise the hp rating on it due to owners asking what was up. |
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11-27-2008, 09:27 AM | #60 |
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Iīve owned and own Porsches and have friends that own them. I know of none of these that have been understated and some of these have been dynod. I also took the liberty of speaking with TechArt yesterday for some other matters and asked them the same. They have a really nice 700bhp GT2 by the way. They say it is not understated. I also recall a magazine that tested all these results some time ago, it turned out that most European cars produced a bit less hp than stated (including Porsche) and it was the american corvette that turned out to be understated but in those cases it was 3 or 4bhp, nothing major. I donīt think Prosche would understate a car by 20 or 30 bhp, law suits can also easily go both ways (understate a car, crash, and your in deep dodo). But, hey, at the end of the day I suppose we will all believe what we want. My personal belief is that Porsche does not understate hp, but thatīs just me and is why I say to each his own. So, whatever the case, the RDSport stroker will produce more hp in an aspirated fashion at sea level than will the "stated" GT2 hp and with the weight reduction I have put it through, just a tad heavier.
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11-27-2008, 03:55 PM | #61 | |
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The car is rated at 530 hp at the crank yet turns 128 mph trap speeds. A gallardo is rated at 520 hp at the crank yet does 118 mph trap speeds. Crank ratings don't matter, different crank motors at 500 hp won't all put the same power to the ground and won't perform the same. They can claim any number they want. I spend a lot of time researching cars, it isn't a belief, it is a fact that Porsche underrates certain cars. The dyno database on dragtimes has many dynos to serve as a point of reference. How is a stock 997 GT3 putting down 386 wheel: http://www.dragtimes.com/Porsche--GT3-Dyno-Sheets.html Are the losses 7% (of course not) or is it underrated? I won't go into other manufacturers and vehicles they have produced that put down more power than advertised as I guess we are talking about 997 GT2 performance from the stroker. This is a large leap, and 530 claimed horses from RDsport are not going to be the same as the GT's claimed 530 horses. |
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11-27-2008, 06:07 PM | #62 | |
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11-27-2008, 06:50 PM | #63 |
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I agree, honestly, I don't know if RDsport is overstated or not. I would assume they are spot on. Lets hope they are understated and that the stroker produces amazing results.
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11-29-2008, 10:51 AM | #64 |
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RDSport numbers are conservative as are Dinan.
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12-03-2008, 08:02 PM | #65 |
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12-03-2008, 08:06 PM | #66 |
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whoa i just read the thread...
guys how are you going to tell me that the rd sport kit will produce 530bhp.. if it does than that really nice. but i just hate when companies talk about hp gains when they have not yet even finished yet. wtf are you guys going to do if it produces 480 490. everything is complete speculation, let them finish it first. I will be happy if they just finish it, to be talking about some hp numbers are complete nonsense at this stage |
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