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      03-24-2008, 09:51 PM   #67
dawgdog
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I have a heavily modded 335 and no way does it handle as well as the M3. The achiles heel is not having an LSD. And there have been nightmares putting these in the 335. Without an LSD it is just impossible to keep the wheels planted. And from 80 on I bet the M3 pulls away. The one real advantage to the modded 335 is that instantaneous torque - kind of addicting.
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      03-24-2008, 10:31 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by Sick Speed View Post
I don't street race. Races are for the tracks only. The point was to see which car pulled quicker through 3rd gear. Had we more room we would have taken it through the top of 4th which is where both cars experience max output. We simply did not have the room.

Both cars have similar mileage right around 2K miles.

Some of you need to remember in my original post at the very bottom I state I am waiting my turn to place my order for my 2008 M3. I will be an owner too to add to the stable and I am NOT bashing the new M3.

It is quantitative evidence that the new M3 is not delivering as much punch as I would have hoped considering the price. Again...this is my opinion based on my personal observations. Like I said in my earlier post for the price difference I want more power delivery.

I am not sure I follow what you mean when you say I should have shifted at 4200 RPM. I reach max torque at 4300 RPM and max HP at 5700 RPM with the DINAN re-flash calibration.

SS
The question is at what rpm in 3rd gear did the M3 shift? At redline or at 5000 rpms? (I am assuming the modded 335 shifted at redline in 3rd gear).
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      03-24-2008, 10:43 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by Sick Speed View Post

I am not sure I follow what you mean when you say I should have shifted at 4200 RPM. I reach max torque at 4300 RPM and max HP at 5700 RPM with the DINAN re-flash calibration.

SS

in the OP I thought you were saying that both cars were shifting at 5000 rpm. My point was that 5000 rpm represents a larger part of the 335's powerband. If you were actually shifting at redline in the 335, while the M3 was shifting at 5000 rpm, all you've done is design the worst test in automotive test history.

Though you've proven that a short-shifted M3 is slower than a fully revved, tuned 335. A hypothesis I'm sure most would have agreed with before you ran the cars.

here's the line that is confusing me:

"The 335i took the M3 by almost an entire car length up to 80 MPH to 5K RPM mid way through 3rd and was still pulling away before we had to hit the breaks."
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      03-24-2008, 11:47 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaiman View Post
in the OP I thought you were saying that both cars were shifting at 5000 rpm. My point was that 5000 rpm represents a larger part of the 335's powerband. If you were actually shifting at redline in the 335, while the M3 was shifting at 5000 rpm, all you've done is design the worst test in automotive test history.

Though you've proven that a short-shifted M3 is slower than a fully revved, tuned 335. A hypothesis I'm sure most would have agreed with before you ran the cars.

here's the line that is confusing me:

"The 335i took the M3 by almost an entire car length up to 80 MPH to 5K RPM mid way through 3rd and was still pulling away before we had to hit the breaks."
I see what you are saying but I am only referencing my pull and not the M3's. I have no idea where he was RPM wise but I believe what you are saying is that had the M3 had more distance to reach its peek then the run would have been more level and with this I agree which is why I stated I wish we had more distance.

My E46 M3 revs as high as the new 2008 M3 and I need a lot of straight to get the max output you are referring to.

As I said...we simply did not have the space. All of that aside it does not negate the fact that the 335i pulled significantly harder and outdistanced the M.

Now if we were at 100 and began the pull I am certain the results would be in favor of the M3. I will be taking the 335i to Sebring in the not too distant future and one of the other members has the E92 M3 (broken in) and we have already discussed doing some trial runs.

First...I have to get the set up on my 335i squared away and THAT is a PITA because I am waiting on a set of Volks from Japan before I install the coil overs and sways.

Again...the tech driving the M3 is as experienced as they come and even he said he was surprised with the results.

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      03-24-2008, 11:50 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
The question is at what rpm in 3rd gear did the M3 shift? At redline or at 5000 rpms? (I am assuming the modded 335 shifted at redline in 3rd gear).
I shifted at 5800 RPM. Keep in mind, too, that I have the stupid idiot stock CDV (changing out soon) and the stock shifter and my shifts feel like marshmallows. Due to the stock CDV and weak ass stock shift kit of the 335i it is IMPOSSIBLE to transition gears without feeling the split second hesitation in clutch engagement with either an over or under revved throttle. You cannot avoid this with the stock 335i CDV and stock shifter.

The stock E92 M3 CDV and stock shift unit are head and shoulders above the 335i stock parts.

Once I install the SSK and replace the CDV with a much larger opening I will be much happier.

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      03-25-2008, 07:06 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sick Speed View Post
I see what you are saying but I am only referencing my pull and not the M3's. I have no idea where he was RPM wise but I believe what you are saying is that had the M3 had more distance to reach its peek then the run would have been more level and with this I agree which is why I stated I wish we had more distance.
Why would you need a lot of road to get max power output from either car? In what gear did you guys start?

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Originally Posted by Sick Speed View Post
I shifted at 5800 RPM. Keep in mind, too, that I have the stupid idiot stock CDV (changing out soon) and the stock shifter and my shifts feel like marshmallows.
Why did you shift early?

It is important to know the rpm at which the M3 shifted from 3rd to 4th gear. If the car was not broken in, the driver might not have revved it to redline.

Regardless, any race between a modded 335 and a stock M3 should be close--even from a rolling start. So, I am not surprised at the outcome.
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      03-25-2008, 10:02 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Why would you need a lot of road to get max power output from either car? In what gear did you guys start?



Why did you shift early?

It is important to know the rpm at which the M3 shifted from 3rd to 4th gear. If the car was not broken in, the driver might not have revved it to redline.

Regardless, any race between a modded 335 and a stock M3 should be close--even from a rolling start. So, I am not surprised at the outcome.
Typo...I shifted at 6800 RPM. I have fat fingers. Like I said earlier...I have no idea what the M shifted.

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      03-26-2008, 02:17 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Why would you need a lot of road to get max power output from either car? In what gear did you guys start?



Why did you shift early?

It is important to know the rpm at which the M3 shifted from 3rd to 4th gear. If the car was not broken in, the driver might not have revved it to redline.

Regardless, any race between a modded 335 and a stock M3 should be close--even from a rolling start. So, I am not surprised at the outcome.
I don't think they got into 4th. He was saying they ran from a 20mph roll up to 80mph.
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      03-26-2008, 02:20 PM   #75
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I don't think they got into 4th. He was saying they ran from a 20mph roll up to 80mph.
Exactly - we never made it to 4th.
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      03-27-2008, 08:55 AM   #76
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I wonder if I should tell this guy I actually paid closer to USD$170,000 for my M3?
Err...I see your 170K and raise you 50k!
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      03-27-2008, 04:15 PM   #77
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Err...I see your 170K and raise you 50k!
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