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      02-26-2018, 05:32 PM   #1
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(100% Solved) 00278D BSD. Alternator: Missing

Hello Guys, This is me E9x M3 Addict (DIYKing) ,


My car is just amazing and still looks and drives like brand new! BE Bearings + New Diff Seals all around + New oil + New Brake Fluids + New steering wheel fluid. Car has no visible problem at all! 08' the clock 41K

Since i have no visible problems, i decided to scan the car using ISTA+ after having a windows 10 crash and had to wipe all C:\ partition to recover and re install the system. It was just for a test scan to see did i correctly install all the drivers to use ISTA + INPA + NCSExpert ! Well everything worked like a charm at the very first time. There is no problem here.

Then the fault codes appeared on the list. I then realized my alternator is not getting read by DME. And i made a huge ISTA research to find out what is that about! And also applied test plan! Since i am scanning via K-DCAN cable, some of the tests are limited and can not continue without proper connector!

I would like to share my experience here so if anyone experiences in the feature, this can help out to solve it!
Here is the very very first time that i scan and get this faulty list and most probably did not scan the car more or less 9 months maybe more!

S 0085 No communication possible with DSC (It is not a faulty i just did not scan the car when the ignition fully on, other wise this error goes away)

00278C DME : Alternator

002712 Plausibility Speed - I didn't pay attention what the heck it is, did deleted and never come back again!

00278D BSD, Alternator : Missing (Run a test plan and will show you with the pictures below)

002B59 DME: Coolant Thermostat Monitoring ( This one related to low voltage and gone away after deleting from the sytem)

I made very detail research to find out what is DME : Alternator : Missing is!

In my case, Alternator is still working. I run the car i measured the Voltage using ISTA Live monitoring and also my Voltmeter connected to charging ports and when the high beams and fan fully operated, it shows 14.30V which means .30AMP and it should be in between 30-40Amp

When i turn off the lights and fan it reads : 14.44V which is totally normal and the battery reads 12.4 while the car is off!

So, alternator producing and charging the battery but what missing is without the DME control this can harm the electronic modules and if you keep running the car you may say good bye one or more sensitive electronic modules!

Here is and detail explanation of what BSD : DME does on Alternator :

BSD interface to the alternator

The alternator with BSD interface can actively communicate with the engine control unit. The alternator is not linked to the charge indicator lamp, only to the engine control unit. The alternator can detect a variety of faults.

Function
The following functions have been implemented in the engine control unit for the alternator with BSD interface:

-Activating/deactivating the alternator on the basis of appliable parameters

-Specification of the maximum permitted degree of utilisation of the alternator

-Control of the alternator's load response

-Calculation of the alternator moment degree of utilisation

-Diagnosis of the data line between the alternator and the engine control

-Filing of alternator faults in the defect code memory

Activating the load control lamp in instrument cluster via CAN

In comparison to alternators used so far, the display strategy of the load control lamp does not change when the alternator with BSD interface.

The basic function of the alternator is also ensured if the communication between the alternator and the engine control is interrupted.

Possible faults
The following possible faults can be distinguished from fault entries:

High temperature control: The alternator is overloaded; to be safe, the alternator voltage is reduced until the alternator has cooled down again. The charge indicator lamp does not light up.

-Mechanical fault: The alternator is mechanically blocked or the belt drive has failed.

-Electrical fault: Exciter diode defect, excite interruption, overvoltage due to controller defect.

-Communication failure: Line defect between the engine control and alternator.



So there is 6 very important function is not doing the job while DME is not seeing the alternator!

I didn't take a risk, so i will not drive the car till fix the issue. And at the first step i will be replacing the Regulator since the cable that comes from DME is directly connected to Alternator's regulator!

Before the replacement, ISTA mention to check other connectors in between DME to Alternator such as IBS sensor and Oil Condition Sensor. Oil Condition sensor has 2 point to check. One of them behind the Plenum and Plenum needs to be removed the other one where oil temperature sensor connected to!

And when i see the diagram IBS is not in between Alternator and DME. It is between DME to Battery!

The other connector is under the plenum at the very front. That also comes from Alternator and goes to DME!












Here is the Error :



When i click the first one with Test Plan this comes up :





This is what comes up when i click the 2nd Error with test plan!











Since i am running the software using K-DCAN, i can not see the waves! Or Since DME can not see the Alternator it can not continue to see the waves from regulator! So i can not confirm the Amp of the Alternator using the software! But basically what it says is when you run your high beams and fan, you alternator should load more amp and you should see the changes!

















I think either BSD cable is failed or Regulator! I will also report the progress !

Another helpful link to BSD :

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e...unting/Or82vy4

Here is the part i ordered : (This part is over $135 anywhere else and it is not in the states at the moment If you are shopping at well known bmw wholesalers) But luckily i found in Ebay half the price! And this is what exactly the other ones selling!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Valeo-O...-/171573495960

If anyone experienced something like that, please share your experience and possible solutions! Thank you!

Current Idle Video : https://instagram.com/p/Bfrn4X2H24p/
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      02-27-2018, 04:25 PM   #2
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Part 2 :

Today i was able to remove the Alternator within 10 min. It is really easy if you know what to do! I saw many people were struggling to remove the alternator. I will give you the trick how to remove within 5 min! (Thanks to my very close Turkish Friend Talha)

Get the cap out from tensioner :



The First key is you have to remove the 2 tensioner's 14mm bolt after removing the belt!



The second and most important key is remove the Alternator's top bolt about quarter inch and remove the bottom bolt about half inch. And get a hammer and start hitting the bottom bolt like you are hammering a nail! There is the back part of this bolt has to move quarter inch while you are hammering! And you will see that alternator start getting loose. And then jiggle the alternator and see how loose it become. If it is not that loose hammer back again! Once it is loose remove regardless of order bottom or top bolt and put the alternator to the bottom of the engine tray!



Pull the alternator closer to you and remove the 2 pin DME cable first and than get 17mm positive cable and tape it! I also remove the negative battery cable in the trunk before i start the job. My battery is extremely easy to access since i remove all this plastic crap was holding before!

It should be done!



















What amazes me the most is i can not get over how damn clean this car is. Every part still looks brand new #NeverDrivenInRain

And get a 2000 grid sand paper to sand the back connector part till gets real shiny even mine is in good condition i will do it anyway! So you know electric transfers very well to the Regulator!
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      02-27-2018, 05:49 PM   #3
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nice
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      02-27-2018, 08:19 PM   #4
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Awesome!
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      03-02-2018, 05:20 PM   #5
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Part 3 :

I polish the tips before i install the new voltage regulator.



I am also waiting an answer from the seller since the one i received does not look identical to mine such as instead of 2 pin, there is only one pin and also some physical differences even tho it fits perfect!

But when i check this plug, it shows only one socket and the other side looks empty anyway to me!



Here is the pics :











And i think they used Dielectric Grease when they first install this regulator, because i am seeing some grease around this 3 hole. i will use too, it also eliminate any sort of voltage loose and protects from corruption or rust!

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      03-02-2018, 10:13 PM   #6
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Your car is super clean, no surprise!
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      03-03-2018, 01:19 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdott View Post
Your car is super clean, no surprise!
i think it is as clean as yours might be little dirtier
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      03-06-2018, 06:42 PM   #8
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Update :

Hello Guys. I was able to replace the Voltage Regulator with the part number 599221. I installed it and start the vehicle. DME cleared the error and then i got another issue which was unexpected.

Everytime i start the car, dash had battery sign and idrive warning with Charging Malfuntioning. I verified with the seller and he also show me that Valeo selling this version and this part for our alternator.

I totally trust him but unfortunately the one i received most probably defective!

He ask me that did you disconnect the battery while you were re installing the alternator or did you properly install the prongs.

Well i already removed the battery cable before i even remove the alternator. And also i did very proper installation and got this click sound after installing the regulator!

The strange thing was when i push the gas (If i go over 2500 rpm) Error clears and alternator comes back to life no more errors anymore. But i had to do that everytime i start the car!

I asked my friend what do you think about this situation , He asked his Alternator guy and told me that if the alternator comes back the life after pushing the gas, alternator itself is totally fine, you got defective regulator, and it happened several times to us.

And then i request a refund from the seller, he did it right away and follow up with the issue. I strongly suggest him for anyone.

Then i told my friend again that here is the scenario , If i get another regulator which looks exactly like mine is not in the states at the moment and the proce tag $141. The new Valeo 439675 Alternator is $265 at ECSTuning. What would you buy? The answer was def new alternator.

Then i got this dilemma Brand New Valeo 439675 Alternator with $265 vs Remanufactured Valeo 439675 with BMW Logo on it $850 + Core Charge.

I called Valeo and ask what is the differences between bmw logo and yours. The answer was Nothing! Same product!

I talked the ECS about it, they are like i would def get the brand new one!

Well why in the world someone will buy remanufactured bmw product with the price tag between 650 - 850?

Is there really any differences between this 2 product? Even bmw dealer uses reman Alternator for the repairs but why?

After talking them and my friends, i got the new one and i will be done with the project tomorrow and update with the results.

What i at least accomplished is now i know it is not the BSD Cable issue, it is the regulator issue that was causing a problem on DME!

And also i got real experienced to remove the alternator within 10 min!
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      03-07-2018, 07:40 PM   #9
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Conclusion :

I received the new Alternator from ECSTuning. Installed it. All errors are cleared. Legend is back to the roads.

The regulator i got was the correct part. The new Alternator came with the single pin as well!

Other than that the only differences between this alternators is the new one is made in Poland, the old one Made in France!

Here is some pics :









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      06-22-2019, 01:41 AM   #10
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Which alternator did you get? I think there’s a 150 and 180 amp
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      06-24-2019, 07:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Route 16 View Post
Which alternator did you get? I think there’s a 150 and 180 amp
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-valeo-pa...317837981~val/
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      11-25-2019, 02:21 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaNGRia View Post
Thanks for the write up guys.

Looks like I'll be replacing my alternator.

A few days ago I got the charging malfunction light on the dash with the battery picture, I pulled over and checked the voltage while running and it was 14.3 so I said no problem alternator is working fine. I drove a few more miles to work and the battery alarm cleared and came back several times. I checked the voltage again, it was charging so I was scratching my head. The next day or two I checked it when I started the car and it was charging, but after getting the revs up a bit driving to work I almost instantly got the charging malfunction alarm. I checked the voltage this time while driving with my ODBII app on my phone and saw the voltage was around 12.5 and dropping which was no good if the alternator was charging. I parked the car and shut it off and turned it back on again. Instant battery alarm and voltage was 12.2. I gave it a few revs and the voltage didn't change. I turned off all electrical loads except for headlights and drove the car back home while it still had enough juice to run the engine and bare electronics to get her home. Car is parked in the garage pending a new alternator delivery.

It's probably just the voltage regulator went out, or even simpler the brushes, but the price I found for it was $141 vs a new alternator for $230 to $280 so I ordered the alternator (2 day lead time), sucks I had to buy from someplace else as ECS is out of stock until december 2nd ---UGH ECS!!! ---

The alternator is 10 years old, so I figured why spend that much for a voltage regulator when I can get the whole thing for another 100 bucks.

Also,
What's this deal with the bottom bolt? Why are you guys using pry bars and hammering the bolt while threaded to back out the rear lower captive nut on the alternator? BMW TIS makes no mention of this being an issue.
You've got me worried about that one..
Cheers,
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      11-25-2019, 04:48 AM   #13
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Great detailed write up man
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      11-27-2019, 08:46 PM   #14
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Hey there,

The trick i have mention comes from a guy who have 25 years of experience on Bimmers and he does engine builts daily in Turkey.

That trick will save you alot of time to get the alternator out from there and it works like a charm.

You do not have too much space to hammer as hard as you think to the point that you can damage the treads. It gives a play to the alternator after sitting there for years!

Trust me, i would never done something like that if i didnt trust my guy! It is the same logic removing the stuck brake rotors. You use hammer to move that rusty seized metal! Just make sure to remove that bolts about half inch before hammering!

And make sure the Alternator you are getting is 180 Amp!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TX View Post
Thanks for the write up guys.

Looks like I'll be replacing my alternator.

A few days ago I got the charging malfunction light on the dash with the battery picture, I pulled over and checked the voltage while running and it was 14.3 so I said no problem alternator is working fine. I drove a few more miles to work and the battery alarm cleared and came back several times. I checked the voltage again, it was charging so I was scratching my head. The next day or two I checked it when I started the car and it was charging, but after getting the revs up a bit driving to work I almost instantly got the charging malfunction alarm. I checked the voltage this time while driving with my ODBII app on my phone and saw the voltage was around 12.5 and dropping which was no good if the alternator was charging. I parked the car and shut it off and turned it back on again. Instant battery alarm and voltage was 12.2. I gave it a few revs and the voltage didn't change. I turned off all electrical loads except for headlights and drove the car back home while it still had enough juice to run the engine and bare electronics to get her home. Car is parked in the garage pending a new alternator delivery.

It's probably just the voltage regulator went out, or even simpler the brushes, but the price I found for it was $141 vs a new alternator for $230 to $280 so I ordered the alternator (2 day lead time), sucks I had to buy from someplace else as ECS is out of stock until december 2nd ---UGH ECS!!! ---

The alternator is 10 years old, so I figured why spend that much for a voltage regulator when I can get the whole thing for another 100 bucks.

Also,
What's this deal with the bottom bolt? Why are you guys using pry bars and hammering the bolt while threaded to back out the rear lower captive nut on the alternator? BMW TIS makes no mention of this being an issue.
You've got me worried about that one..
Cheers,
TX
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      12-19-2019, 11:29 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaNGRia View Post
Hey there,

The trick i have mention comes from a guy who have 25 years of experience on Bimmers and he does engine builts daily in Turkey.

That trick will save you alot of time to get the alternator out from there and it works like a charm.

You do not have too much space to hammer as hard as you think to the point that you can damage the treads. It gives a play to the alternator after sitting there for years!

Trust me, i would never done something like that if i didnt trust my guy! It is the same logic removing the stuck brake rotors. You use hammer to move that rusty seized metal! Just make sure to remove that bolts about half inch before hammering!

And make sure the Alternator you are getting is 180 Amp!

I appreciate the tips, sorry for the late reply. I replaced the alternator with a Valeo 439675 180amp. I took the old alternator voltage regulator apart and the brushes were totally shot. No way was it going to work, I'm surprised it lasted as long as it did. I couldn't pass on the price of the Valeo alternator compared to throwing a regulator on the old alternator. I may still do that and keep it as a spare.

Charging malfunction is gone and the car is charging nicely. I do have one question about the data bus connection. The new one has a single pin (as yours) where the original had two pins. There was a little piece of paper with the new alternator that said one or two pin connectors are the same, but no explanation of how or why that is. I'm mostly curious what that second pin was for and what it does or did on the old alternator.

Only other thing I can say is don't bust off the vent nipple on the radiator hose getting the fan out of the car or you will be into a new project.
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      12-20-2019, 11:08 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TX View Post
I appreciate the tips, sorry for the late reply. I replaced the alternator with a Valeo 439675 180amp. I took the old alternator voltage regulator apart and the brushes were totally shot. No way was it going to work, I'm surprised it lasted as long as it did. I couldn't pass on the price of the Valeo alternator compared to throwing a regulator on the old alternator. I may still do that and keep it as a spare.

Charging malfunction is gone and the car is charging nicely. I do have one question about the data bus connection. The new one has a single pin (as yours) where the original had two pins. There was a little piece of paper with the new alternator that said one or two pin connectors are the same, but no explanation of how or why that is. I'm mostly curious what that second pin was for and what it does or did on the old alternator.

Only other thing I can say is don't bust off the vent nipple on the radiator hose getting the fan out of the car or you will be into a new project.
You do not need to worry about the pin. The old one has 2 pin but the socket has only one pin. So the one comes with the old one was useless from the beginning (Don't ask me y)
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      12-31-2019, 02:11 PM   #17
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So my car will go into limp mode (Engine Malfunction) under WOT. Only code I have is this one. Hopefully a new alternator fixes it.
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      01-03-2020, 02:15 PM   #18
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So my car will go into limp mode (Engine Malfunction) under WOT. Only code I have is this one. Hopefully a new alternator fixes it.
Please update the results after the alternator swap. I never seen limp mode on alternator failure before.
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