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      06-01-2018, 12:13 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Railgun View Post
Typical hypocrisy.
To go down that road, let's at least do it right and use the actual car (there were two - this being the second and inverse of the white one).

That being said, the article is a very inaccurate piece that takes certain statements that were used over a year ago and combined it with a statement to Macron about the frustration of not being able to circumvent the EU and impose separate trade deals with each member individually.
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      06-01-2018, 12:14 PM   #24
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CPO the way to go. 2 year old 340i goes for around $33k.
Maybe. Theoretically, the demand for CPO BMW's would be higher as fewer could afford new. That would drive up the cost of CPO's.
Works for me I could use a higher resale value on my F30.
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      06-01-2018, 12:17 PM   #25
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Buy one now, worst case keep it until 2021, the latest date when both Trump and any tariffs will be gone. That's if they go into effect, because the day after enacted Germany and all others hit by US tariffs will enact their own, causing the US balance of trade to fall off a cliff. Brinksmanship only works when the other guy has more to lose than you do, and that's not the case with regard to tariffs.
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      06-01-2018, 12:28 PM   #26
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I mean, my 328i had an MSRP of over $56,000 already.

But yeah, let's start a trade war with an ally whose companies employ more people in the US than the entire coal industry combined.

Truly the greatest people. I can't wait until this fucking muppet is out of office, ideally from impeachment.
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      06-01-2018, 12:29 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billfitz View Post
Buy one now, worst case keep it until 2021, the latest date when both Trump and any tariffs will be gone. That's if they go into effect, because the day after enacted Germany and all others hit by US tariffs will enact their own, causing the US balance of trade to fall off a cliff. Brinksmanship only works when the other guy has more to lose than you do, and that's not the case with regard to tariffs.
Couldn't agree more
Trump was obviously away from school on the day they did basic economics
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      06-01-2018, 12:38 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by bimmer456 View Post
Anyway, my stock portfolio is up 60% since I opened it in 2015 compared to 38% for the s and p 500. Seems the markets don't mind, or at least my portfolio is unaffected. Maybe this is just a negotiating tactic we shall see.
Cool story.
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      06-01-2018, 01:43 PM   #29
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It's funny...Americans have a tendency to blame others for their own shortcomings.
It's not just Europe that doesn't buy American cars, even Americans don't (at least not at the rate that they "should" be buying them, or we wouldn't be having this problem).
I mean, this forum itself is living proof that Cadillac, Lincoln, etc. aren't even on the bucket list or cross-shopping list for most when buying a BMW, or Mercedes.
Yeah, select vehicles like Vettes and CTS-V arouse some interest & discussion, but overall, not enough Americans (or Europeans) are cross-shopping say, an ATS with a 340i, or ATS-Vs with M3s.

Simply put, American cars suck(ed) for a long time.
They're still dealing with damage control for decades of shitty vehicles and poor planning.
Some models have gotten better in the last ten years, but overall, through the past few decades, they've gained a reputation for not having solid build quality, engineering/technological prowess, or safety/reliability/MPG...you know, things that normal car buyers actually want and care about.
Maybe if American car manufacturers actually made competitive products (vs. the Germans or even the Japanese) over the years then maybe:
1) Just maybe, the taxpayers wouldn't have had to bail-out GM & associates. What a shameful episode in America, that the company that was the world's largest automaker for over 70 years, was saved by lemon-socialism.
2) There would be more Cadillac's sitting in American driveways and garages instead of BMWs, Mercedes-Benz's, Audi's, and even Lexus's.
So really, it's not so much that Germany (or Japan) is taking advantage of American buyers; it's the American consumer, that consistently chooses (yes, by choice) German quality and engineering over poorly engineered, poorly designed, and poorly marketed domestic vehicles.

Vote with your wallet, they say.
In many ways, a market economy is like a democracy.
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      06-01-2018, 01:50 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
To go down that road, let's at least do it right and use the actual car (there were two - this being the second and inverse of the white one).

That being said, the article is a very inaccurate piece that takes certain statements that were used over a year ago and combined it with a statement to Macron about the frustration of not being able to circumvent the EU and impose separate trade deals with each member individually.
What I posted was inaccurate how?
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      06-01-2018, 01:58 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Railgun View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
To go down that road, let's at least do it right and use the actual car (there were two - this being the second and inverse of the white one).

That being said, the article is a very inaccurate piece that takes certain statements that were used over a year ago and combined it with a statement to Macron about the frustration of not being able to circumvent the EU and impose separate trade deals with each member individually.
What I posted was inaccurate how?
It wasn't. Simply added two pics of the last car he acquired before entering protective status. Article in the OP and belief that a "German car ban" is non-sense.

It's way worse than that.
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      06-01-2018, 02:02 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer456 View Post
Anyway, my stock portfolio is up 60% since I opened it in 2015 compared to 38% for the s and p 500. Seems the markets don't mind, or at least my portfolio is unaffected. Maybe this is just a negotiating tactic we shall see.
Mine has been way up since 2008. Any credit to Obama for that?
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      06-01-2018, 02:10 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F80zcp View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer456 View Post
Anyway, my stock portfolio is up 60% since I opened it in 2015 compared to 38% for the s and p 500. Seems the markets don't mind, or at least my portfolio is unaffected. Maybe this is just a negotiating tactic we shall see.
Mine has been way up since 2008. Any credit to Obama for that?
2015 was during Obama as well. I credit my portfolio to Tim Cook.
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      06-01-2018, 02:19 PM   #34
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I think the way Trump threatens and then backs off shows he's more interested in breaking down barriers to American exports like the 10% tariff on US automobiles in the EU.
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      06-01-2018, 02:23 PM   #35
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how the fuck yall paying 0ver 60k sticker for a 340i, when i got my m3 for 69k and its well equipped
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      06-01-2018, 03:40 PM   #36
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start looking for leases in May of that model year and you'll get a great deal... reason being is a 2018 is initially released in September+/- of 2017 so they have to dump stock fast for the new model year release...
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      06-01-2018, 03:42 PM   #37
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My salesman told me that a lot of his customers actually pay MSRP, we both had a chuckle at that (him probably more so than me) - it blows my mind that anyone would pay M3 prices for a 3 series, but I guess PT Barnum was onto something
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      06-01-2018, 05:06 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Law View Post
It's funny...Americans have a tendency to blame others for their own shortcomings.
It's not just Europe that doesn't buy American cars, even Americans don't (at least not at the rate that they "should" be buying them, or we wouldn't be having this problem).
I mean, this forum itself is living proof that Cadillac, Lincoln, etc. aren't even on the bucket list or cross-shopping list for most when buying a BMW, or Mercedes.
Yeah, select vehicles like Vettes and CTS-V arouse some interest & discussion, but overall, not enough Americans (or Europeans) are cross-shopping say, an ATS with a 340i, or ATS-Vs with M3s.

Simply put, American cars suck(ed) for a long time.
They're still dealing with damage control for decades of shitty vehicles and poor planning.
Some models have gotten better in the last ten years, but overall, through the past few decades, they've gained a reputation for not having solid build quality, engineering/technological prowess, or safety/reliability/MPG...you know, things that normal car buyers actually want and care about.
Maybe if American car manufacturers actually made competitive products (vs. the Germans or even the Japanese) over the years then maybe:
1) Just maybe, the taxpayers wouldn't have had to bail-out GM & associates. What a shameful episode in America, that the company that was the world's largest automaker for over 70 years, was saved by lemon-socialism.
2) There would be more Cadillac's sitting in American driveways and garages instead of BMWs, Mercedes-Benz's, Audi's, and even Lexus's.
So really, it's not so much that Germany (or Japan) is taking advantage of American buyers; it's the American consumer, that consistently chooses (yes, by choice) German quality and engineering over poorly engineered, poorly designed, and poorly marketed domestic vehicles.

Vote with your wallet, they say.
In many ways, a market economy is like a democracy.
truth here. i drove a high end Lincoln a year ago and it was a POS.
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      06-01-2018, 06:10 PM   #39
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My understanding is President Trump asked his Commerce Secretary to explore tariffs on foreign automobiles. No numbers on tariffs have been officially proposed. It appears as though some are transferring the 25% tariff on foreign steel to automobiles as click bait and/or a scare tactic.
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      06-01-2018, 07:16 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdarwin View Post
China currently has a 25% tariff on imported American cars. A total ban is hyperbole but a tariff of some sort is a political possibility, IMO.
Australia has a 33% luxury car tax.

https://www.ato.gov.au/rates/luxury-...nd-thresholds/

Why a 2018 X5M retails for AUD206k (USD156k).

https://www.carsales.com.au/bnc/deta...-5779825/?Cr=7
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      06-02-2018, 01:14 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrboulder View Post
I think the way Trump threatens and then backs off shows he's more interested in breaking down barriers to American exports like the 10% tariff on US automobiles in the EU.
No one buys US cars in Europe, apart from US diplomats based here. No amount of changes to tariffs will change that
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      06-02-2018, 01:57 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TodmordenLad View Post
No one buys US cars in Europe, apart from US diplomats based here. No amount of changes to tariffs will change that
Doesn't matter

President Trump controls foreign access to a quarter of the world's economy. If you're some country that wants open access then you have to reciprocate.

Last edited by 3A53; 06-02-2018 at 02:08 AM.
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      06-02-2018, 02:22 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrboulder View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TodmordenLad View Post
No one buys US cars in Europe, apart from US diplomats based here. No amount of changes to tariffs will change that
Doesn't matter
Agreed
However, as Trump will realise, there are no winners in trade wars, in spite of his rhetoric to the contrary
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      06-02-2018, 02:37 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TodmordenLad View Post
Agreed
However, as Trump will realise, there are no winners in trade wars, in spite of his rhetoric to the contrary
Well we'll have to wait and see what happens. Hopefully our so-called allies will come to their senses and drop their protectionist tariffs and other trade barriers. Countries we run a strong trade deficit with have a lot more to lose than we do if they want to go the trade war route.
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