HPDE experiments, results and observations

[dparm]

If you want to do research on the AS3, you can do it on CorvetteForum. It's a popular choice for the "weekend" guys because they don't push the car hard. I wouldn't bother with it on an M3 unless I needed something for a place that got mild winters (i.e. very occasional snow but plenty of days below 45 F).

For a wet track day, there will be way too much squirm and it'll overheat.

Wet performance tire champ right now seems to be the Conti ECS.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by dparm

If you want to do research on the AS3, you can do it on CorvetteForum. It's a popular choice for the "weekend" guys because they don't push the car hard. I wouldn't bother with it on an M3 unless I needed something for a place that got mild winters (i.e. very occasional snow but plenty of days below 45 F).

For a wet track day, there will be way too much squirm and it'll overheat.

Wet performance tire champ right now seems to be the Conti ECS.

Thank you.
I will look into the Conti ECS

I don't drive the M3 in the winter and it is not my daily.

Looked on Tire Rack
The MPS4S has better scores than the Conti ECS and I know that tires in the rain. These max summer tires hydroplane in rain. This is why I was thinking about the AS3

[rhyary]

I got two new Y2018 275/35/19 Ecsta V720 for less than $200.
has anyone try these tires?
.

[dparm]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Thank you.
I will look into the Conti ECS

I don't drive the M3 in the winter and it is not my daily.

Looked on Tire Rack
The MPS4S has better scores than the Conti ECS and I know that tires in the rain. These max summer tires hydroplane in rain. This is why I was thinking about the AS3

The Contis showed better wet performance than the PS4S in Tire Rack's tests. But this is just on their small autocross-like track.

Have you considered an actual wet race tire, like the Hoosier?

Originally Posted by rhyary

I got two new Y2018 275/35/19 Ecsta V720 for less than $200.
has anyone try these tires?
.

It seems to be a good value for the money. A tad behind the competition like RE-71R, but it's cheap.

[rhyary]

I only managed 1:01.82 at LRP yesterday.
Very close to my PB from last year 1:01.77.

Moved to the advanced group in the last two session and had a nice play with the various Porsches and track ready cars. Most importantly, did not run in to trains and had quit a few open laps. So first 2 session did 1:03-1:02 and constantly ran into cars.

The cap prepped Porsche went by me and I could not keep up. I timed it at 58sec when I was watching the Advance group earlier on.

Other than that car, I was not in the way of any other driver.

nicksm3 was kind enough to follow me for few laps and Datka was sharing tips in the paddock. Overall much better day than the first one few weeks ago.

Stats, tire report and video later

[nicksm3]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I only managed 1:01.82 at LRP yesterday.
Very close to my PB from last year 1:01.77.

Moved to the advanced group in the last two session and had a nice play with the various Porsches and track ready cars. Most importantly, did not run in to trains and had quit a few open laps. So first 2 session did 1:03-1:02 and constantly ran into cars.

The cap prepped Porsche went by me and I could not keep up. I timed it at 58sec when I was watching the Advance group earlier on.

Other than that car, I was not in the way of any other driver.

nicksm3 was kind enough to follow me for few laps and Datka was sharing tips in the paddock. Overall much better day than the first one few weeks ago.

Stats, tire report and video later

You kicked arse yesterday! I'll get the videos up shortly after work tonight.

[rhyary]

Stats
Date: June 29 2020
Organization: SCDA
Track: SCDA
Weather: mostly dry. occasion rain that dried out

Tires Front: Hoosies R7 take offs
265/35/19 eBay day 1 (and probably last)

Tires Rear: 2018 Proxa RR
2018 eBay new day 4

Brake Threshold: 600 psi (the tone you hear)

Best laptime: 1:01.82 (PB is 1:01.77)

DSC: On

Comments:
Toward the end of the day my MDM light was on a lot, yet I wanted to keep the safety margin and kept it on. I was focusing in not slowing to much into fast corners and learning slides was not my objective.

Video Link:

There is a video from @nicksm3 that hopefully I can link here and that will show the session from Nick's POV and mine.

[dparm]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I know, this is unconventional, but $113 per 140 tread tires? I'll take it.
Ordered 4
.

The RE050 is a really old tire and has since been surpassed by a lot of other tires. If you just want something cheap to beat the shit out of, go for it. Just watch for chunking and inner shoulder wear.

[Kelse92]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Three sets strategy.
So I went forward with buying a third set.
My thinking is one set for the road and two for the track.

1. street driving (in town)
2. Track (max/ultra performance)
3. Track (Slicks)

.......

Sample mounting would be:
1. Street-Rain A/S 3+ 275/35/19 275/30/19
2. Track learning - Any 200 Tread or less 295/30/19 265/35/19 (275/30/19 FFI500)
3. Track (LRP or NYST going for PB) slick 295/30/19 265/35/19.

.....
If you have/had three wheel sets, what would you do?

Owner of 4 Sets of wheels here. My uses are a bit different, but basic setup is the following:
1) 19" Daily Driver Wheels with PS4s to double as a rain or backup set if needed
2) 18x10 square setup with 265 Pirelli scrubs for HPDE
3/4) Two 18x10.5/18x11 Staggered sets (or to switch back to square if preferred) with 200tw Autocross-Only tire set and 200tw backup HPDE tire set.

Most racers I know do Rains, Practice, and Sticker sets if they do 3 sets so your thoughts are right in line I would say. Glad you pulled the trigger! You'll definitely be happy on the long weekends having the spares around.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Kelse92

.....
Glad you pulled the trigger! You'll definitely be happy on the long weekends having the spares around.

Selling the Ducati 996s made that happen.

[rhyary]

Dilemma:
I have R7 take off of unknown origin that I did 4x25min at LRP in addition to driving to and from the track 70 miles. The two fronts were less then $400 total and served me well at LRP.

The question is, can I push these one more track day at NYST. While one tire is not great, I can put it on the driver side which does little at NYST. The other does not show the same issues but is used the same.

The more I think about it, I realized these served their purpose. Even if I survive the day, I am not sure if they are going to be any fast, defeating the need to be on R7.

It is my policy to drive tires to the cords, but there is alway room for exceptions.

The slit is on the outside
the "lakes" are on the inside.

The dimples are still there

[ThunderMoose]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Dilemma:
I have R7 take off of unknown origin that I did 4x25min at LRP in addition to driving to and from the track 70 miles. The two fronts were less then $400 total and served me well at LRP.

The question is, can I push these one more track day at NYST. While one tire is not great, I can put it on the driver side which does little at NYST. The other does not show the same issues but is used the same.

The more I think about it, I realized these served their purpose. Even if I survive the day, I am not sure if they are going to be any fast, defeating the need to be on R7.

It is my policy to drive tires to the cords, but there is alway room for exceptions.

The slit is on the outside
the "lakes" are on the inside.

The dimples are still there

Based on what you've posted with respect to abrasive nature of NYST, I wouldn't use them there. Save your good tires for LRP.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by ThunderMoose

Based on what you've posted with respect to abrasive nature of NYST, I wouldn't use them there. Save your good tires for LRP.

I am, slowly, coming to this sad conclusion.

The Cap2 and R7/A7 are just too damn expensive for that track.

I think the FFI500 is not the fastest, but is the appropriate tire for NYST. I have one more set of the FFI500 275/30/19 in the inventory and will push these to see what lap times I can get.

[ThunderMoose]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I am, slowly, coming to this sad conclusion.

The Cap2 and R7/A7 are just too damn expensive for that track.

I think the FFI500 is not the fastest, but is the appropriate tire for NYST. I have one more set of the FFI500 275/30/19 in the inventory and will push these to see what lap times I can get.

Cup2 man! It's Cup not cap. Carry on.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by ThunderMoose

Cup2 man! It's Cup not cap. Carry on.

got it

[rhyary]

I have 3 trackdays coming up at NYST, and that would be my mid season.

The car is going to ACM for the usual all fluids replacement. Nothing exciting here.

Mid season adjustments I am excited about are.

1. We are installing a automatic brake pedal I bought on eBay a while back

2. I am replacing the 900 rear spring with 1000. This is to compensate for the H&R 50% compares to the Hotchkis 70% I have had last year. While I like how the car lean at a turn, the quick slalom like sequence at NYST 100mph-90mph-75mph (8-9-10) left right left can use a bit more stiffness. It is inexpensive to try.

3. I found a new V720 ACR 295/25/19 cheap on eBay and I will try to fit them on the front. Using 22 offset and 10mm spacer theoretically clears the helper spring. Since the 295/25/19 are smaller diameter than the 295/30/19, I am hoping it will clear the inner fender. Mounting these tires on a 9.5" rim is obviously not going to optimized this size but if these ACR tires clear the fenders, I am curious to see what times I can do at NYST.

There is no future for this solution. They are specialized tires that availability is in doubt and at full price I rather buy something else. But at $303.00 new for two, I wanted to give them a try on the front. I can always burn them on the rear. They are made specifically for the front 2016 Viper ACR and mated to a rear 355/30/19.

Also, I feel like putting 295 on the E92 M3 front is cheating.

[OG Shark]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Also, I feel like putting 295 on the E92 M3 front is cheating.

Errr, what?

[rhyary]

Turn 8-9-10 at NYST with Got Track Long Island

[rhyary]

So the idea of 295/25/19 Ecsta V720 ACR is dead. Does no fit.

But... the Ecsta PS91 285/30/19 does. And for $150 a tire it will be tried tomorrow at NYST.

So the setup for open track tomorrow is
PS91 285/30/19 on the front and
Proxa RR 295/30/19 on the rear.
Total setup $700

Last two trackdays at NYST the PS91 275/30/19 survived two days (14 x 20min sessions) with excellent wear at 1:38 - 1:39 pace.

For reference used MPSCup2 265/35/19 was good for 1:37.2

I want to see if a $150 285/30/19 tire can be at the same pace as $380 tire 265/35/19

[rhyary]

Well the PS91 285/30/19 were good for 1:37.02. This is faster than the MPSCup2 265/35/19 1:37.2

Temp hot off the track was 162 162 162 across so good distribution. PSI hot was 38

Of course comparison in two different days and conditions may not mean much.

The issue was that after two laps on 1:38 and two laps on 1:37 (1:37.8 and 1:37.02) they got hot and the rest of the session was on 1:40-1:41.

[tlrid3r]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Changes to this year are minimal
The only planned change is to install Rogue solid bushing number 553 and 829 in the diagram. I already have 092 installed in 2018.

What web source you use to get the suspension diagram. Thanks

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by tlrid3r

What web source you use to get the suspension diagram. Thanks

I got it from Autocouture, but I am sure it is on the Internet someolace