BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Wash, Wax, Detail, Cosmetic Maintenance & Repairs
 
EXXEL Distributions
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      06-24-2009, 03:49 PM   #67
10M3MAN
Lieutenant Colonel
10M3MAN's Avatar
United_States
34
Rep
1,498
Posts

Drives: 2006 Nissan Altima SER
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wharton, TX

iTrader: (0)

Im sorry, newb question...WTF is orange peel???
Appreciate 0
      06-24-2009, 03:54 PM   #68
rominl
Second Lieutenant
17
Rep
278
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Orange County, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 10M3MAN View Post
Im sorry, newb question...WTF is orange peel???
did you look at post #48???

it's not a perfect mirror reflection. that's due to uneven paint surface, called orange peel
__________________
Appreciate 0
      06-24-2009, 03:58 PM   #69
Singletrack
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
Singletrack's Avatar
United_States
87
Rep
3,850
Posts

Drives: 09 SSII E92 M3; 19 FG M5C
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eclipse Motors View Post
My question is now that we know the orange peel can be safely removed, how many of you would be willing to take the plunge and have their entire car wet sanded?
Depends on cost...and if someone as skilled as you were around. I don't trust any of the local detailers in Pittsburgh. Anyone have a referral? : )

As for this thread:

-I have noticed that the orange peel on this car is worse than my:

$30k 2004 STi - except for the lower panels on the STi which were very bad.
$45k 2000 A6 2.7T - but then again, the paint did chip incredibly easily.

-Wet sanding will NOT screw up your paint if done properly
Appreciate 0
      06-24-2009, 04:05 PM   #70
rominl
Second Lieutenant
17
Rep
278
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Orange County, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NewM3driver View Post
This statement is coming from a guy that makes his living wet sanding unsuspecting folks cars. I know of several dark color cars... a Jag, a porsche, and a vette that were wet sanded, looked great, and 6 months later look like dog ass.

Don't even think about wet sanding your new car.
that has to be one of the most retarded posts i have read. know more friends and people who actually know how to detail and treat car paint.

do you realize almost all cars from factory, after going through the paint process, they still have to go through polishing process to get things to look shiny? those are the "NEW" cars that you refer to. do you see them going dull after months?

do you realize all cars coming out of body shops (accidents or whatever), after painting process they ALL go through polishing processes too? without that the paint will look like crap and horrendous orange peel effect? i guess you don't

wet sanding and polishing are necessary crucial steps in creating a pristine mirror finish on paint finish. it's the way to make a surface completely smooth and take out all the swirl marks. it does not "wear" out unless scratches are put on top.

the cars that you have seen, they were simply done by cheap shops or people who have no idea about what they do. the paint aren't correctly polished and cleaned before they put on greasy fillers and wax to "HIDE" the imperfections. that's why when the wax wear out in months you see it being dull
__________________
Appreciate 0
      06-24-2009, 04:09 PM   #71
10M3MAN
Lieutenant Colonel
10M3MAN's Avatar
United_States
34
Rep
1,498
Posts

Drives: 2006 Nissan Altima SER
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wharton, TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rominl View Post
did you look at post #48???

it's not a perfect mirror reflection. that's due to uneven paint surface, called orange peel
I tried reading through everything but I must have missed it.. Thanks for the info on #48...
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 03:57 PM   #72
eclipsisNA
Colonel
United_States
348
Rep
2,937
Posts

Drives: 2013 Estoril 328i M Sport
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Beverly Hills, CA

iTrader: (6)

Garage List
2014 BMW 428i  [7.76]
Wanted to bump this and say I'm going to wet sand my entire M3 when I get back from NY next week. Orange peel will be a thing of the past. Stay tuned for pics.
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 04:09 PM   #73
mPlasticDesign
Major General
mPlasticDesign's Avatar
684
Rep
5,069
Posts

Drives: BMW 230i Msport w/LSD
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Astral Projecting: ∞ 23.516 -122 02.625 0242.101 ĕv'rē-hwâr'

iTrader: (16)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by URBAN LEGEND View Post
Doesn't bother me one bit
In fact, I like the orange peel!
__________________
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 05:04 PM   #74
alpina527
Banned
United Kingdom
60
Rep
638
Posts

Drives: 2008 E92 M3 DCT JZB/FR
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London, England

iTrader: (1)

Take a look at this link from KDS in the UK. Look at the black truck in the video and tell me it's not worth doing

http://www.kdskeltec.co.uk/paint_correction.phtml
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 05:18 PM   #75
nusevad
O! So Sour!!
nusevad's Avatar
United_States
549
Rep
15,615
Posts

Drives: Fast 240z / Slow M3
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 'Merica!

iTrader: (24)

Garage List
1971 Datsun 240z  [0.00]
2008 M3  [9.60]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eclipsis View Post
Wanted to bump this and say I'm going to wet sand my entire M3 when I get back from NY next week. Orange peel will be a thing of the past. Stay tuned for pics.
nice! please keep us posted
__________________
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 05:59 PM   #76
mexicanmike
Captain
United_States
18
Rep
636
Posts

Drives: 09 E93 Jerez Black
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Morgan Hill, CA

iTrader: (0)

Good luck, keep us posted.
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 06:24 PM   #77
BobsM3Coupe
Brigadier General
BobsM3Coupe's Avatar
United_States
1429
Rep
3,881
Posts

Drives: X5MC
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: California

iTrader: (4)

My car is Alpine White and it has orange peel. Mostly only on the sides of the car. The front and rear bumper covers along with the side rocker covers don't have any. Go figure. Maybe it has something to do with the flex agent they put in the paint for the flexible parts?

Doesn't bother me to much but I'm certainly glad I didn't get a darker color since it would show through much easier and be much more noticeable. Just doesn't seem right to be on a 70K car, but as others have stated, just about all cars have it to some degree.
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 06:42 PM   #78
BCA
Captain
21
Rep
793
Posts

Drives: 2015 M3
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Houston, TX

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eclipsis View Post
Wanted to bump this and say I'm going to wet sand my entire M3 when I get back from NY next week. Orange peel will be a thing of the past. Stay tuned for pics.
Subscribed
__________________
2017 Porsche 911 Carrera S
2019 Porsche Cayenne

Past BMWs: 2015 M3, 2014 550i, 2013 M3 ZCP, 2012 535i, 2011 E90 335i, 2009 E90 M3, 2008 X5, 2006 330i, 2004 330i
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2010, 11:19 PM   #79
///V\3Dude
I Drive Slow To Save Gas :D
///V\3Dude's Avatar
United_States
26
Rep
464
Posts

Drives: 08 M3, MY11 STi
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: I <3 NY

iTrader: (2)

i like the orange peel, it smells good
__________________
Appreciate 0
      03-17-2010, 01:10 AM   #80
Envious Eric
Banned
United_States
37
Rep
1,168
Posts

Drives: nissan xterra, 335 soon
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: orange county, ca

iTrader: (1)

take measurements!!!! factory paint is about 40/40/40 or 30/30/30 = primer, base, clear sand too much and you are going through the clear!

only do this if you plan on having a tight wash regimen and only light polish every once in a while, not if you are a polish nut always trying to keep a swirl free finish!

There is a reason people say not to sand a factory finish!
Appreciate 0
      03-17-2010, 01:52 AM   #81
eclipsisNA
Colonel
United_States
348
Rep
2,937
Posts

Drives: 2013 Estoril 328i M Sport
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Beverly Hills, CA

iTrader: (6)

Garage List
2014 BMW 428i  [7.76]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Envious Eric View Post
take measurements!!!! factory paint is about 40/40/40 or 30/30/30 = primer, base, clear sand too much and you are going through the clear!

only do this if you plan on having a tight wash regimen and only light polish every once in a while, not if you are a polish nut always trying to keep a swirl free finish!

There is a reason people say not to sand a factory finish!
Who do you think you're talking to? I've done 100% wet sands on more than 30 cars in my life. Kindly stay out of my threads Eric.
Appreciate 0
      03-17-2010, 02:22 AM   #82
quality_sound
8 tracks of madness
United_States
62
Rep
2,735
Posts

Drives: Slowly
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: At home

iTrader: (1)

Not to mention, even a "polish nut" is only going to remove a micron or two at a time unless there is some serious correction needed. If you're using something like Klasse which is almost entirely chemical polish, not abrasive, it's even less. Sheesh, so many people think this is rocket science.
Appreciate 0
      03-18-2010, 06:42 PM   #83
Envious Eric
Banned
United_States
37
Rep
1,168
Posts

Drives: nissan xterra, 335 soon
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: orange county, ca

iTrader: (1)

well, to clarify since you are always taking everything I say out of context...

I viewed a report on the effects of wetsanding and compounding and polishing on a traditional factory clear coat a while back.

In that report, a total of 8-10 microns of paint were removed from the start to finish - sanding, compounding to remove sanding marks, polishing to remove compounding haze, fine polishing to get absolute clarity, NO wax. Now, if you take that 40/40/40 scenario, you are looking at about 30 safe microns left before you blow through the clear.

If you remove 2 microns of paint with minor polishing two times a year, then you have about 6 years of safe detailing on the car.

If you have a car with the 30/30/30 platform, then you only have 4 years of safe detailing....

just pointing things out that arent always talked about...not trying to take away from you man, relax.
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2010, 12:33 AM   #84
kc1337
Private
17
Rep
70
Posts

Drives: 4 wheels
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: internet

iTrader: (0)

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/foru...d.php?t=141365

Wetsanding
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2010, 03:43 PM   #85
bunnn
Colonel
bunnn's Avatar
86
Rep
2,266
Posts

Drives: like a grandma
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (12)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kc1337 View Post
that was amazing..i like!
__________________
Cheers
Ben
Appreciate 0
      03-19-2010, 05:34 PM   #86
BMRLVR
Grease Monkey
BMRLVR's Avatar
Canada
292
Rep
2,646
Posts

Drives: 2011 E90 M3,1994 Euro E36 M3/4
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta, Canada

iTrader: (3)

The only negative to having a totally flat orange peel free paint that I can see would be maintenance of the finish after it is complete. When the paint has some texture it is a little more forgiving and doesn't show fine scratches and swirls the same as if it is totally flat. My brother and I wetsanded and polished his 1993 VW Corrado VR6 about 12 years ago. The final product was amazing but you basically had to be very careful with any type of rubbing or polishing on the finish including wax and glaze application, even by hand. You even had to use some type of QD as a lube when drying the car, and remember these were in the days before QD's were intended to be used on a wet car.

I know the finished product will be amazing and Eric, you are an amazing detailer but maybe you should consider having the complete car covered in Ventureshield once it is completed. That way it will still look flat and awesome but you will never have to polish on the paint itself again.
__________________
2011 E90 M3 ZCP - Individual Moonstone/Individual Amarone Extended/Individual Piano Black With Inlay:LINK!!!
1994 Euro E36 M3 Sedan - Daytona Violet/Mulberry:LINK!!!

Last edited by BMRLVR; 03-20-2010 at 08:29 AM..
Appreciate 0
      03-20-2010, 10:26 AM   #87
eclipsisNA
Colonel
United_States
348
Rep
2,937
Posts

Drives: 2013 Estoril 328i M Sport
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Beverly Hills, CA

iTrader: (6)

Garage List
2014 BMW 428i  [7.76]
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMRLVR View Post
The only negative to having a totally flat orange peel free paint that I can see would be maintenance of the finish after it is complete. When the paint has some texture it is a little more forgiving and doesn't show fine scratches and swirls the same as if it is totally flat. My brother and I wetsanded and polished his 1993 VW Corrado VR6 about 12 years ago. The final product was amazing but you basically had to be very careful with any type of rubbing or polishing on the finish including wax and glaze application, even by hand. You even had to use some type of QD as a lube when drying the car, and remember these were in the days before QD's were intended to be used on a wet car.

I know the finished product will be amazing and Eric, you are an amazing detailer but maybe you should consider having the complete car covered in Ventureshield once it is completed. That way it will still look flat and awesome but you will never have to polish on the paint itself again.
Hey Jamie,

I agree with what you said; you definitely have to be extremely careful with maintenance once the wet sanding is finished. Technology has come quite a long way since the early 90s: the combined lubricity of QDs + foam pads allows for the prevention of swirling, even on wet sanded paint. 0 PPM water also aids in the process by sidestepping the drying step entirely, but I understand that very few people have ready access to a supply of such water. Its cost prohibitive for most, but the results are 100%. You can see a good portion of my filtering system in this picture:



Here's the driver side door on my E92 prior to correction:

Appreciate 0
      03-20-2010, 08:11 PM   #88
Envious Eric
Banned
United_States
37
Rep
1,168
Posts

Drives: nissan xterra, 335 soon
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: orange county, ca

iTrader: (1)

thats a massive amount of OP...will you show the readings you take with photos. i am curious as to how much you will be removing with OP that bad. Not saying you cant do it, btw, just curious as to how much paint you HAVE to remove.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:48 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST