Do not drive a GT3!!

[Black Gold]

^^

good post, and yes, the 997.2 was much better suspension wise, and the improvements from 997.1 to 997.2 goes for the gt3 as well (more changes like 3.6L to 3.8L etc) as far as I understand it. but 997.1, the gt3 is the car. no doubt.

[W///]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

I prefer the M3 as well. Not that its faster, because it probably isn't, but the handling of the M3 at it limit is very comfortable. No drama. The 911TT is the complete opposite. Although the 997.2s have been significantly improved from the 997.1's that I think Mark (KennyPowers) had.

I understand that the handling on the 911TT can be dramatically improved and handle like a GT2. I'm not going for a strict track car - I'm going for a multi-purpose car that will be fun in a straight line and at the track. So the 911TurboS is a good platform. How many cars can do 800 HP with just bolt ons with stock turbos AND have a warranty piggyback on top of Porsches from the tuner (think Dinan)?

That's cool that they have Dinan type programs, very cool. My dream garage was going to be an N/A M3 with a Turboed 997, RWD vs AWD. Best of both worlds! But my friend has a 991 with muffler delete and it just sounds so intoxicating! I have like 10 years to decide so I think I'm OK haha. Until then, more mods for M3!

Originally Posted by KennyPowers

^^

good post, and yes, the 997.2 was much better suspension wise, and the improvements from 997.1 to 997.2 goes for the gt3 as well (more changes like 3.6L to 3.8L etc) as far as I understand it. but 997.1, the gt3 is the car. no doubt.

Why a 997.1? Personally, I prefer the rear end of the .2, and who can argue against a 3.8 Mezger engine with muffler delete THe only drawback I can think of is the wheel center locks

But those are going to be so desirable that they'll hold their value like crazy

[Haywood]

Originally Posted by Soorena

Thank you for your kind words. Hala Madrid!
I fully agree with your first statement. I think there is a misunderstanding here, what i meant to say is that they probably lost a few potential buyers with not offering a manual option. I'm sure there are other people like me who rather to drive a GT3 with a stickshift. Whether i think manuals are more fun or not, that was my point sir, and i think it's a mistake.

BTW, Ronaldo is a ladyboy.

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by W///

Why a 997.1? Personally, I prefer the rear end of the .2, and who can argue against a 3.8 Mezger engine with muffler delete THe only drawback I can think of is the wheel center locks

But those are going to be so desirable that they'll hold their value like crazy

So does the 997.2 GT3 have a Metzger N/A 3.8?

I know that the 996s and the 997.1 Turbo's had the 3.6 Metzger and the 997.2 Turbo's got the new 3.8 DI motor which is also in the 991 Turbos.

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by Haywood

BTW, Ronaldo is a ladyboy.

True. Looks like a boy but gets all the ladies

[dmk08]

Why does no one ever mention the GT2? Just price?

[Black Gold]

Originally Posted by W///

Why a 997.1? Personally, I prefer the rear end of the .2, and who can argue against a 3.8 Mezger engine with muffler delete THe only drawback I can think of is the wheel center locks

But those are going to be so desirable that they'll hold their value like crazy

no clearly a 997.2 is better, what I was saying is that if my budget was a 997.1 gt3 or turbo (which mine was, 997.2 cars are over 100k) the gt3 is the better choice by far.

Originally Posted by Longboarder

So does the 997.2 GT3 have a Metzger N/A 3.8?

I know that the 996s and the 997.1 Turbo's had the 3.6 Metzger and the 997.2 Turbo's got the new 3.8 DI motor which is also in the 991 Turbos.

yes it has the mezger 3.8L. the 997.2 gt3 is a beast.

Originally Posted by dmk08

Why does no one ever mention the GT2? Just price?

probably, and also that it has probably too much power for a RWD car that weighs that much in a rear engine platform. from what I have read, it is very difficult to handle and drive.

it is a badass machine and I love the way it looks

[lsmkr01]

Originally Posted by W///

Why a 997.1? Personally, I prefer the rear end of the .2, and who can argue against a 3.8 Mezger engine with muffler delete THe only drawback I can think of is the wheel center locks

The 3.6 is apparently more elastic and faster revving and this isnt the first time I've heard someone prefer the .1 to the .2 (.2 is clearly a faster car). I agree the rear end of the .2 is way better looking but at this point I'd gladly take either

I'll be looking in 4-5 years for P-car... stay here in the States and you will too.

[Haywood]

Originally Posted by dmk08

Why does no one ever mention the GT2? Just price?

That and it being a Turbo. I'd take that beautiful NA engine that revs to 9000 RPM's over a turbo any day of the week!

[W///]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

So does the 997.2 GT3 have a Metzger N/A 3.8?

I know that the 996s and the 997.1 Turbo's had the 3.6 Metzger and the 997.2 Turbo's got the new 3.8 DI motor which is also in the 991 Turbos.

Yea the 997.2 GT3 was more or less that last stand for the Mezger (I don't count the 4.0 because those are more or less untouchable). It truly is a special car. But honestly, I'd be happy with any 997 minus the base model haha.

Originally Posted by dmk08

Why does no one ever mention the GT2? Just price?

I love the way they look, but just not my thing really. If you are going to track one, might as well go NA. And if you are going to make a Turboed monster, might as well be AWD. There's a reason it's called the Widow Maker. Just IMO.

Originally Posted by KennyPowers

no clearly a 997.2 is better, what I was saying is that if my budget was a 997.1 gt3 or turbo (which mine was, 997.2 cars are over 100k) the gt3 is the better choice by far.



yes it has the mezger 3.8L. the 997.2 gt3 is a beast.



probably, and also that it has probably too much power for a RWD car that weighs that much in a rear engine platform. from what I have read, it is very difficult to handle and drive.

it is a badass machine and I love the way it looks

Understood. I actually saw an orange .1 GT3 with higher mileage for $60k, so they can be pretty reasonable. I'm looking pretty far into the future, so if I'm going to do it, it'll have to be perfect. Granted, this is a car I plan to hold on forever if I can (just like the M3), because as they say, they don't make them like this anymore. The only thing that would stop me is if in 5-10 years, there's still a giant price difference between the .1 and .2, then I'll "settle".

/daydream

Originally Posted by lsmkr01

The 3.6 is apparently more elastic and faster revving and this isnt the first time I've heard someone prefer the .1 to the .2 (.2 is clearly a faster car). I agree the rear end of the .2 is way better looking but at this point I'd gladly take either

I'll be looking in 4-5 years for P-car... stay here in the States and you will too.

I'll have to read into it then. The only complaints I've heard was the pain in the ass center wheel locks. I try not to go to 6speed too much because I get too jealous haha. We'll see what happens in 2 years, that'll determine a lot of things!

[Haywood]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

True. Looks like a boy but gets all the ladies

Yeah, I wouldn't complain if I had his looks, football skills, and bank account!

[lsmkr01]

Originally Posted by W///

I'll have to read into it then. The only complaints I've heard was the pain in the ass center wheel locks. I try not to go to 6speed too much because I get too jealous haha. We'll see what happens in 2 years, that'll determine a lot of things!

Not a big deal if you have the right tools for the job. They have torque multipliers too you can get but I'd scoop one of these bad boys up.

[USCTrojanMan29]

Originally Posted by W///

Why a 997.1? Personally, I prefer the rear end of the .2, and who can argue against a 3.8 Mezger engine with muffler delete THe only drawback I can think of is the wheel center locks

But those are going to be so desirable that they'll hold their value like crazy

You can convert the .2 to 5-lugs fairly easily and many .2 owners have done it (including me).

[USCTrojanMan29]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

So does the 997.2 GT3 have a Metzger N/A 3.8?

I know that the 996s and the 997.1 Turbo's had the 3.6 Metzger and the 997.2 Turbo's got the new 3.8 DI motor which is also in the 991 Turbos.

Yeah, the 997.2 GT3s and RSs have a 3.8 Metzger that was used in the 997.2 cup cars.

[Soorena]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

Interesting. This "floppiness" you speak of...I think I have that too. It's a combination of two things 1) the steering is very "light" and 2) steering wheel oscillation a few mm to the left/right/left, etc very quickly when corner at higher speeds. The second issue is mostly when PASM is on. Very distracting and unnerving.

Exactly. The modification you planned will get of rid this annoying feeling.

Originally Posted by Longboarder

True. Looks like a boy but gets all the ladies

Haha true.

Originally Posted by Haywood

BTW, Ronaldo is a ladyboy.

I really wouldn't complain if my GF was like his :

[krnnerdboy]

Don't forget all gt3's need to have the coolant pipes welded before hitting the tracks or at least drain the coolant for water and redlines water wetter. Welding the pipes requires dropping the motor....unless there's another option I missed?

[USCTrojanMan29]

Originally Posted by krnnerdboy

Don't forget all gt3's need to have the coolant pipes welded before hitting the tracks or at least drain the coolant for water and redlines water wetter. Welding the pipes requires dropping the motor....unless there's another option I missed?

The other option is to have your car looked over after every weekend to check for any weeping from the coolant hoses and then change them out. Labor and parts to change out the hoses is about $150-$200.

[krnnerdboy]

Originally Posted by USCTrojanMan29

The other option is to have your car looked over after every weekend to check for any weeping from the coolant hoses and then change them out. Labor and parts to change out the hoses is about $150-$200.

I wonder if that is ok....not sure if the coolant line failure is sudden or if there are leaks to spot it. Should be fairly easy if it does leak, since the sweet smell of coolant is hard to miss. If this is true I may have saved a few thousand.

Thanks

Water wetter will replace my coolant before the next event, regardless....cheap insurance

[USCTrojanMan29]

Originally Posted by krnnerdboy

I wonder if that is ok....not sure if the coolant line failure is sudden or if there are leaks to spot it. Should be fairly easy if it does leak, since the sweet smell of coolant is hard to miss. If this is true I may have saved a few thousand.

Thanks

Water wetter will replace my coolant before the next event, regardless....cheap insurance

From what I heard (guy that works on my car and many other Porsches) is that the coolant hoses will begin weeping a little coolant and they can see the streaks when they put the car on the rack. I had my hoses replaced after 8 track days. My shop works on full race cars and weekend warrior DE cars like mine so they know what to look for.

[krnnerdboy]

911design?

[USCTrojanMan29]

Originally Posted by krnnerdboy

911design?

GSR Autosport in Lake Forest. They work on BMWs too but they do a lot of work on Porsches, including full race ones.

[FormulaMMM]

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

PLEASE READ WHAT HIS LAP WAS! IT WAS BRIDGE TO GANTRY. THE DISTANCE OF THIS PORTION IS 19.1 km. THE FULL LAP OF THE RING DONE WHERE THE GT3 AND 991S RAN 7:37 IS 20.8 KM.

SO HIS LAP WAS ABLE TO MANAGE THE SAME TIME BUT HE WENT 1.7 KM LESS. So again, please check the details because had he run the full lap his time likely wouldn't have cracked 8 mins even with all those mods. And in actuality based in the time for the 19.1 it would have been an 8:29 times for the full lap so a couple lifetimes on the that track. So in the end, you just helped to prove the m3 isn't even close to a GT3 nor any 991 based 911 even with pretty extensive mods. Just goes to show why even the GTS wasn't on par with even a GT3 that was 5 years old when it came out.

I don't think Porsches or any car manuf are without fault but porsche seems to be most consistent at doing it right. The 991 is something very special to which it is Still the bar by which all cars are measured and very few compare at all.

Something's up with your math.

I'm no 'ring expert, so can't make direct comparisons between B to G times, full lap times, Sport Auto times, etc. but I am a winter time admirer of 'ring vids...

Have a look at the Yokohama bridge to gantry times in the three vids below. Why the Yokohama bridge? Because it's a readily identifiable landmark common to all laps with different start points, and in all three laps they're on it pretty much from that bridge to gantry. Kluck is going for it in both vids.

Lukester M3 2:14 - 7:46 (5:32)*
991 C2S 2:21 - 7:52 (5:31) Timo Kluck
997 GT3RS 4.0 () 2:18 - 7:46 (5:28)** Timo Kluck

*He hit traffic in a couple of spots. He's an incredible driver, but not Timo Kluck. PDK in the C2S, 6MT in the E92.
**Got off of it prior to gantry. Cut a few seconds off that time realistically.

So over a substantial portion of the lap, the modded M3 really is neck and neck with the 991 C2S, and therefore 997 GT3s.

I'm GT3 obsessed, by the way. I just thought you must be selling that absurdly quick lap by the M3 way short. Cannot be mid-8's and slower than the recorded stock E92 time.

Checked the 918 spyder time over that same distance for shits and giggles -- 4:57 . Demonstrates that if there is a massive performance difference between the cars being compared, it would certainly show over the "Yoko to gantry" lap.