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      06-09-2011, 05:53 PM   #45
mdosu
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the BMW survey do nothing. I was contacted by someone at corporate regarding my recent service. Even though I told them I had no complaints, I told them my dealer tried to strong-arm me into filling all positives for the survey.

BMW person told me there's nothing they can do about that, and that I should be honest, but that the dealer will not be contacted. This is all just BS, what's the point of the survey then when you're trying to "sway" opinion?
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      06-09-2011, 06:25 PM   #46
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But then that outcome is arbitrary. You are essentially leaving your fate for someone else to decide. That's never a good idea in my book, but of course everyone has their own approach to life, and YMMV.

The fact is that the lack of anonymity on the part of the customer means that the system is ripe for abuse on the part of the dealership. True, if it were anonymous for the customer then abuse would be possible in the other direction. But so what? That's not my problem, nor any other consumer's problem to solve - that's BMW's issue. The fact is that the survey system is broken. Other possible ways of handling feedback have been discussed on the forums at length before. And of course this is a business process issue that has been solved many times before in many other contexts anyway. The fact that BMW NA employs the system they do, and in the specific way they do, knowing all of the headaches it causes their customers clearly says that they aren't interested in something functional. They are merely interested in something that gives the appearance of being functional to customers who are already happy with their service anyway, but yet does little to benefit those who are not.

Since the survey is a voluntary, the sensible thing to do if you have issues is not answer it. Instead take your complaint straight to the dealership via the manager or owner or other direct approach. Answering the survey with negative remarks can't really help your cause at all. All it does it give the dealership a reason to treat you hostily. After all, it is beyond clear that many dealerships or dealership employees consider any mark on the survery other than "perfect" a hostile act on the part of the consumer. So why tip your hand? If I walked through life giving away the upper hand on a daily basis like that, I would not be sitting where I am today, that's certain.

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Originally Posted by llis View Post
OR... it gives the dealer the opportunity to make right. I had that experience after an unsatisfactory experience, and if anything the relationship ended up better afterwards.

The survey is not the problem. A dealer attacking a customer for being unsatisfied -- that's the problem.
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      06-09-2011, 07:24 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by signes View Post
What are you basing that on?

I worked as SA at a dealer. Thus im basing it on my experience.


Any business can deny you service, just as long as the reasons are not discriminatory under federal law.
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      06-09-2011, 07:25 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
But then that outcome is arbitrary. You are essentially leaving your fate for someone else to decide. That's never a good idea in my book, but of course everyone has their own approach to life, and YMMV.

The fact is that the lack of anonymity on the part of the customer means that the system is ripe for abuse on the part of the dealership.
You sound like your dealer is your evil stepfather ready to take a switch to you. I wouldn't be spending that kind of money with a dealer that is poised to abuse its customers. There are plenty of BMW dealers out there. I certainly wouldn't be taking my car in for service at a dealership that has been abusing me. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
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      06-09-2011, 07:39 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by VVG View Post
The way the world really works.....

When you get these surveys, you should always give the dealer raving reviews. Even if they did a shitty job. Do this a few times, and they will start to kiss your ass and treat you like a king.

On top of that, get your dealer to install all your mods (if applicable). It is pure cash business for them.

If they did a shitty job, pull the GM or service manager aside and tell them..."hey, you guys could have done a little better with this, but I gave you all high ratings on the survey because I know it affects you. Just please try to be a little more careful next time, okay"

Trust me on this. I know from experience. After a few years, they will be giving you free services, nice loaner cars, etc.

Everything in life is a game or a deal. You just need to know how to play.
I guess you never bothered to read his post, this was a new car delivery not some oil change service visit.
I believe if you are picking up a new car for the first time the experience should exceed your expectations, especially on a M brand purchase!
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      06-09-2011, 07:46 PM   #50
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I have delt with Seema Kumar and BMW NA on more than one occasion and I can honestly say BMW does not give a rats arse how many BMW's you purchased or to help you in any way. I'm not going to go into why I contacted BMW NA, but I will not be purchasing any more BMW's.
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      06-09-2011, 07:55 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTrey View Post
I sent an email to Norbert Reithofer at norbert.reithofer@bmw.de with all of the emails from the dealership attached. I explained everything I stated above. Hopefully I will receive a response. If not, I will place a call to him next week.
WTG!
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      06-10-2011, 02:01 AM   #52
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GL, let us know the outcome

Quote:
Originally Posted by MTrey View Post
I sent an email to Norbert Reithofer at norbert.reithofer@bmw.de with all of the emails from the dealership attached. I explained everything I stated above. Hopefully I will receive a response. If not, I will place a call to him next week.
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      06-10-2011, 07:45 AM   #53
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And you sound very green.

My dealership is just fine, at least now. But I've dealt with ones that are not. Furthermore, while your statement that there are many BMW dealerships is true, but not everyone has multiple dealerships within driving distance. The reality is that some people are effectively stuck doing business with just one dealership if they wish to own a BMW and get it serviced regularly under warranty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by llis View Post
You sound like your dealer is your evil stepfather ready to take a switch to you. I wouldn't be spending that kind of money with a dealer that is poised to abuse its customers. There are plenty of BMW dealers out there. I certainly wouldn't be taking my car in for service at a dealership that has been abusing me. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
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      06-10-2011, 09:17 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
And you sound very green.
Suffice to say my current M3 is my third BMW. First was a used 320i. I am not at all green when it comes to dealing with dealers, BMW included. I would never take a car to a dealer for non-warranty service, for example. Too many wounds to the pocketbook.

However, I also would not do business with a company that treats customers like minions who must kowtow. I just don't need the added grief in my life. If a decent regional BMW dealer were not around, I'd either look further out (up to, say, a half-day drive) or get a different kind of car. This is a relationship, not a one-off deal. If you "marry" a dealer that sucks, well, that's on you imho.
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      06-10-2011, 10:21 AM   #55
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i work for a dealer straight nightmares dude its crazy, but this thread makes me go HOLY FUCK my mind is official blown
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      06-10-2011, 10:28 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by llis View Post
Suffice to say my current M3 is my third BMW. First was a used 320i. I am not at all green when it comes to dealing with dealers, BMW included.
Very clear. However you do appear to be green as far as experience with bad dealerships or employees, not to mention the stubborness of BMW NA themselves (see HPFP issue). Nevertheless, as you can see just from in this thread alone (nevermind the hundreds of other similar ones), such bad experiences are unfortunately not uncommon.

Quote:
I would never take a car to a dealer for non-warranty service, for example. Too many wounds to the pocketbook.
I would if they had the lowest price, and sometimes they do.

Quote:
However, I also would not do business with a company that treats customers like minions who must kowtow.
Unfortunately, since you own a BMW, you in fact do do just that, as do the rest of us here. Luckily for you, however, you have not been affected first hand. Hopefully you never have to go through it.

Quote:
If you "marry" a dealer that sucks, well, that's on you imho.
To some degree. But then all it takes is one employee to bring a place down, and that sort of situation could happen any time at any dealership, without any prior warning. And furthermore, the mere fact that the consumer has a choice does not make it alright for any place of business to adopt and maintain bad policies or to tolerate poor conduct from its employees.
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      06-10-2011, 11:50 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
And furthermore, the mere fact that the consumer has a choice does not make it alright for any place of business to adopt and maintain bad policies or to tolerate poor conduct from its employees.
I agree.
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      06-10-2011, 12:51 PM   #58
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We should be able to order cars off of a website configurator and have the car delivered straight to our doorstep, cutting off this scammer of a middle man. No haggling, no premium - straight up MSRP (lower price by removing dealer profit) that every state abides to. All that the dealer should take care of and get business for are maintenance and warranty work.
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      06-10-2011, 05:07 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inandout View Post
We should be able to order cars off of a website configurator and have the car delivered straight to our doorstep, cutting off this scammer of a middle man. No haggling, no premium - straight up MSRP (lower price by removing dealer profit) that every state abides to. All that the dealer should take care of and get business for are maintenance and warranty work.
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      06-10-2011, 05:10 PM   #60
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crazy - good luck OP. You may want to copy some directors or heads of customer relations in addition to the CEO; he probably won't read your email, or will forward off to an assistant who may or may not foward it to the appropriate party.
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