2011 E92 M3 Stalls at start in the morning

[edsonreds]

Hi guys. I've been looking everywhere how to diagnose my problem. Some thoughts will be deeply appreciated.

First. My car: 2011 BMW E92 M3 with 30k miles. About a year ago I had a battery service (replacement).

Problem: Every morning since last month, I started the car and the RPMs went a little bit crazy (unstable idling), after less than a minute it normalized above 1k RPM.

Yesterday my problem got worse. At start, the car stalled after a first high revving surge. It did not idle. I tried a second time. The idling was a little bit unstable but normalized.

Today I tried something different. I got into the car and pressed the ignition button (without the foot on the brake). Afterwards, I started normally the car without sudden spikes at idling.

My best guess: At first I thought that the fuel pump was not holding pressure overnight. I normally turn off the car at 8pm and start it a 8am the following day. I drive it twice a week.

I wonder if it has something to do with the battery not holding charge. But I my stealer(ship) just replaced the battery less than a year ago? Could it be the fuel pump? But starting the car without my foot on the brake at first seemed to solve the problem.

I am little bit confused.

Edson.

[byroncheung]

Idle control valve?

[Shiza]

Is this very weird. I’ve seen at least 4 people, including myself, have this exact problem while starting up their cars in the last 2 day. I would suspect it’s related to either your fuel tank breather valve or idle control valve.

[RedScytheM3]

I'm sure the service shop might give you a more exact answer than some randos on a forum.

I hope it's nothing too serious, good luck!

[deansbimmer]

You need to have it diagnosed by a professional with the proper software. Total waste of time to guess at all the possible causes. Stored fault codes are necessary to troubleshoot.

Normally the car won't start unless you hold the brake. Sounds like yours is coded to allow it. Nevertheless holding the brake shouldn't have any effect to the way the engine runs unless you have a vacuum supply or leak issue. If fault codes are related to vacuum supply then you know where to start.

If the fuel system is losing pressure overnight it would result in a long crank before starting, not really a start followed by a stumble and stall. Again, software is required to verify fuel pressures.

[jcolley]

Originally Posted by deansbimmer

You need to have it diagnosed by a professional with the proper software. Total waste of time to guess at all the possible causes. Stored fault codes are necessary to troubleshoot.

Normally the car won't start unless you hold the brake. Sounds like yours is coded to allow it. Nevertheless holding the brake shouldn't have any effect to the way the engine runs unless you have a vacuum supply or leak issue. If fault codes are related to vacuum supply then you know where to start.

If the fuel system is losing pressure overnight it would result in a long crank before starting, not really a start followed by a stumble and stall. Again, software is required to verify fuel pressures.

I had to read it a couple of times, but I think what he's trying to say is he left his foot off the brake to turn on the ignition (terminal 30) and let it sit for a second before foot on brake and pressing start for the engine.

I have to agree though, see if any codes are stored first. If not, I would suspect something in the cold start routine (unplugged / broken secondary air line connector) or a stuck open tank vent valve as mentioned (quite common actually).

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by jcolley

I had to read it a couple of times, but I think what he's trying to say is he left his foot off the brake to turn on the ignition (terminal 30) and let it sit for a second before foot on brake and pressing start for the engine.

I have to agree though, see if any codes are stored first. If not, I would suspect something in the cold start routine (unplugged / broken secondary air line connector) or a stuck open tank vent valve as mentioned (quite common actually).

Hi guys! Thanks for your thoughts. I will certainly take my car to the mechanic.

Weird thing is that I don't have faulty codes at all, and the problem disappears after the first start.

But I agree that a certified inspection should give me readings on fuel pressure. Just wanted to get an educated guess before going to the mechanic.

Thanks!

[byroncheung]

Originally Posted by edsonreds

Hi guys! Thanks for your thoughts. I will certainly take my car to the mechanic.

Weird thing is that I don't have faulty codes at all, and the problem disappears after the first start.

But I agree that a certified inspection should give me readings on fuel pressure. Just wanted to get an educated guess before going to the mechanic.

Thanks!

Keep us posted!

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by byroncheung

Keep us posted!

Will do!

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by edsonreds

Will do!

UPDATE: Hi guys. Just to let you know. Since I did not get error codes I checked the battery voltage using a multimeter. I was shocked when I found that the voltage was 10v when the car was turned off. With the alternator working the voltage increased to 14.4v.

I made some researched and found out that it is commont that the battery will not fully recharge if the car is not driven frequently, which is entirely my case. I drive it just 2 days a week for about 2hrs each time, which is not enough to completely recharge the battery through the alternator.

I purchased a smart battery and fully charged it in 24hrs. After doing this, problem solved. My best guess is that at coldstart the battery was not sufficiently charged to cope with the power needed for initializing all the components (including fuel pump).

I will continue testing in the following weeks, but just wanted to let know everyone that kindfully answered my post.

Regards!

[RC Post]

I drive my car every day and I'm having the exact same problem as you. Happens at random too but always mornings/cold starts...

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by RC Post

I drive my car every day and I'm having the exact same problem as you. Happens at random too but always mornings/cold starts...

Originally Posted by RC Post

I drive my car every day and I'm having the exact same problem as you. Happens at random too but always mornings/cold starts...

have you discarded it is a battery issue? there is a hidden menu to see the voltage when the car if turned off.

try this: put your key fob in the car. press te start button without you foot on the brake. you should hear all electrical sounds starting to work and the RPM outer ring (yellow and red round stripe) to go clockwise. wait 1 minute and the start the car.

for me, doing that was a signal of a battery issue because the problem disappeared.

[M3Comet]

Originally Posted by RC Post

I drive my car every day and I'm having the exact same problem as you. Happens at random too but always mornings/cold starts...

Figure out what it was?

[M3Comet]

Originally Posted by Shiza

Is this very weird. I’ve seen at least 4 people, including myself, have this exact problem while starting up their cars in the last 2 day. I would suspect it’s related to either your fuel tank breather valve or idle control valve.

Did you figure out what it was?

[M3Comet]

Originally Posted by edsonreds

UPDATE: Hi guys. Just to let you know. Since I did not get error codes I checked the battery voltage using a multimeter. I was shocked when I found that the voltage was 10v when the car was turned off. With the alternator working the voltage increased to 14.4v.

I made some researched and found out that it is commont that the battery will not fully recharge if the car is not driven frequently, which is entirely my case. I drive it just 2 days a week for about 2hrs each time, which is not enough to completely recharge the battery through the alternator.

I purchased a smart battery and fully charged it in 24hrs. After doing this, problem solved. My best guess is that at coldstart the battery was not sufficiently charged to cope with the power needed for initializing all the components (including fuel pump).

I will continue testing in the following weeks, but just wanted to let know everyone that kindfully answered my post.

Regards!

How has it been as a long term fix?

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by M3Comet

How has it been as a long term fix?

Hi, so far, so good.

[bmwlover0725]

I had this issue at one point, but it was after rod bearing failure where the vehicle would only be started once every month or two for a minute at a time and the battery was getting low. Doubt mine was related to whatever this is, but I've read quite a few posts like this.

[M3Comet]

Hi everyone, I drive my 2013 once or twice per fortnight, I tried the battery charger option with no results.
I then tried the ignition only (not the engine) technique for one minute prior to starting the engine. If it's been a few days, no issues, I started it yesterday for the first time in 14 days, a little burble or two, but stabilised almost straight away. Not a perfect fix, but enough for me.
Maybe a capacitor/battery within the ignition/computer module?

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by M3Comet

Hi everyone, I drive my 2013 once or twice per fortnight, I tried the battery charger option with no results.
I then tried the ignition only (not the engine) technique for one minute prior to starting the engine. If it's been a few days, no issues, I started it yesterday for the first time in 14 days, a little burble or two, but stabilised almost straight away. Not a perfect fix, but enough for me.
Maybe a capacitor/battery within the ignition/computer module?

Hi. In my case the technique solved the problem of stalls. But, this is still bugging me. I will perform a battery test to check SoC and SoH, to discard a battery issue. Keep you posted.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by edsonreds

Hi. In my case the technique solved the problem of stalls. But, this is still bugging me. I will perform a battery test to check SoC and SoH, to discard a battery issue. Keep you posted.

Seems like driving twice a week for two hours would keep the battery healthy?

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by akkando

Seems like driving twice a week for two hours would keep the battery healthy?

Is that sarcasm? Yeah, you are right. But, it doesnt solve the problem to the ones already suffering from it.

[edsonreds]

Originally Posted by M3Comet

Hi everyone, I drive my 2013 once or twice per fortnight, I tried the battery charger option with no results.
I then tried the ignition only (not the engine) technique for one minute prior to starting the engine. If it's been a few days, no issues, I started it yesterday for the first time in 14 days, a little burble or two, but stabilised almost straight away. Not a perfect fix, but enough for me.
Maybe a capacitor/battery within the ignition/computer module?

Hi, justo to give an update. I changed my battery and registered using INPA. It works like a charm.