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      09-23-2018, 03:18 PM   #1
CSanto
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Price Check 2013 ZCP 6MT Mint 22k miles

Hey All,

So it looks like this just got listed as sold and it was removed from Cars.com

I plan on calling to make sure tomorrow, but what are your thoughts on the price.

More photos here

http://enthusiastauto.com/qsearch/?i...orm_display=51
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      09-23-2018, 05:06 PM   #2
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Every single car for sale on enthusiast auto is way overpriced. It's all up to YOUR specific appetite if you are willing to overpay, for the admittedly very quality product they deliver.
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      09-24-2018, 06:00 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PKL View Post
Every single car for sale on enthusiast auto is way overpriced. It's all up to YOUR specific appetite if you are willing to overpay, for the admittedly very quality product they deliver.
Okay so how far overpriced do we think this example is? 5k? 8k?
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      09-24-2018, 07:25 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSanto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKL View Post
Every single car for sale on enthusiast auto is way overpriced. It's all up to YOUR specific appetite if you are willing to overpay, for the admittedly very quality product they deliver.
Okay so how far overpriced do we think this example is? 5k? 8k?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSanto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKL View Post
Every single car for sale on enthusiast auto is way overpriced. It's all up to YOUR specific appetite if you are willing to overpay, for the admittedly very quality product they deliver.
Okay so how far overpriced do we think this example is? 5k? 8k?
Hard to say on a car like that, it's increasingly rare to see crazy low miles like that. There's a $46k e93 with twice as many miles for sale in Tampa right now.

I've been watching the e92 M3 market for about a year, daily (I bought one on Friday, hence the reason this is my second post and all). With miles like that, the seller can just set the price and cross their fingers that they'll sell it, and when it does- that the buyer wouldn't have been willing to pay $5k more.

We also don't know what it sold for- that was asking price. It could have sold for $38k. The fact that we all think it sold for $46k is good for owners, bad for shoppers. They've bottomed out in depreciation and we just don't really know what the market is going to do in the next couple of years. I suspect stabilize before slowly appreciating, but sellers seem to be getting a bit ballsy with their asking the last few months.

Compounding that- the market for a $46k used car is slim- Yes, its a special car, no, most banks won't care when determining how much they'll lend (they do to some extent). My guess is- the person buying that car as the market on e9x M3s bottom out, is a collector more than an enthusiast.

I was shopping the sub-30k market though. I can tell you I had to pay asking price for mine, which irked me, but I wasn't willing to let someone else have it, wanted it taken off eBay, hopefully to the dismay of it's 21 watchers.

I think with desired colors and/or low mile examples it's really tough to tell, especially with the odd state of the current market.
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      09-24-2018, 07:49 AM   #5
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doesn't seem overpriced at all, actually surprised that Enthusiast Auto hasn't priced it much higher.
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      10-02-2018, 06:11 PM   #6
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I got mine from Carmax... 26K miles with 5-year warranty for $47K after finance (3.74%, 0 down 60 months)

It's a 5 year old car... Carmax covers anything that breaks (not worn down) for the next 5 years or 100K miles.

i.e... 89k miles road bearing failures = new engine.

If these places don't offer warranty for such a high price, IMO it's not worth it. Ticking time bomb if you don't replace your RB as everyone says on this forum.
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      10-04-2018, 10:30 PM   #7
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$47k is about $9k overpriced for that 6MT coupe with black on black, no premium sound, and MOONROOF. The leather does look like it's in exceptional condition though but not worth that price.

I too bought a Carmax M3 and some would argue I even overpaid at $39k. Also bought warranty through 75k miles for $2200 and I got waaaay more car than the one in OP. 2012 E92, SSII, DCT, ZCP, CF roof, EPS, 35k miles.
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      10-05-2018, 12:05 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by areyouamac View Post

i.e... 89k miles road bearing failures = new engine.
I've never really understood the logic on this one. Nothing against areyoumac in particular. Seems a lot of people feel this way.

Considering depreciation is slowing on these cars, it's the last 2 door M3, it's the only V8 M3, it's the last NA M car, there's a chance it could hold or even increase in value (I'm not putting any eggs in that basket, but it's surely a possibility, especially for special colors or configurations).

Quite frankly, I wouldn't want an e30, e36, or e46 that had an engine replaced.

Seems like a weird gamble. You're making $930 payments- clearly you'd want to protect the "investment" — why not do rod bearings for $1500. Just a bit more than your car payment.

Does anyone know of people are okay with buying M3s that have had engines replaced? Or are buyers generally apprehensive?

If someone is in the market for a $15k M3 as a track car, or just desperate for an M3, regardless of mileage or title, whatever on the engine replacement. But if someone is looking to add a perfect low mile $35k+ M3 to their garage, I'd imagine you'd be hard-pressed to sell them a car without the engine it rolled off the line with.

Just my opinion. "Eh, I'll let the engine blow and get it replaced" just seems like a bizarre, albeit common enough, approach to E9x ownership.
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      10-05-2018, 07:27 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by areyouamac View Post

i.e... 89k miles road bearing failures = new engine.
I've never really understood the logic on this one. Nothing against areyoumac in particular. Seems a lot of people feel this way.

Considering depreciation is slowing on these cars, it's the last 2 door M3, it's the only V8 M3, it's the last NA M car, there's a chance it could hold or even increase in value (I'm not putting any eggs in that basket, but it's surely a possibility, especially for special colors or configurations).

Quite frankly, I wouldn't want an e30, e36, or e46 that had an engine replaced.

Seems like a weird gamble. You're making $930 payments- clearly you'd want to protect the "investment" — why not do rod bearings for $1500. Just a bit more than your car payment.

Does anyone know of people are okay with buying M3s that have had engines replaced? Or are buyers generally apprehensive?

If someone is in the market for a $15k M3 as a track car, or just desperate for an M3, regardless of mileage or title, whatever on the engine replacement. But if someone is looking to add a perfect low mile $35k+ M3 to their garage, I'd imagine you'd be hard-pressed to sell them a car without the engine it rolled off the line with.

Just my opinion. "Eh, I'll let the engine blow and get it replaced" just seems like a bizarre, albeit common enough, approach to E9x ownership.
Lol yeah letting the engine blow is extremely nearsighted
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      10-05-2018, 09:47 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
I've never really understood the logic on this one. Nothing against areyoumac in particular. Seems a lot of people feel this way.

Considering depreciation is slowing on these cars, it's the last 2 door M3, it's the only V8 M3, it's the last NA M car, there's a chance it could hold or even increase in value (I'm not putting any eggs in that basket, but it's surely a possibility, especially for special colors or configurations).

Quite frankly, I wouldn't want an e30, e36, or e46 that had an engine replaced.

Seems like a weird gamble. You're making $930 payments- clearly you'd want to protect the "investment" — why not do rod bearings for $1500. Just a bit more than your car payment.

Does anyone know of people are okay with buying M3s that have had engines replaced? Or are buyers generally apprehensive?

If someone is in the market for a $15k M3 as a track car, or just desperate for an M3, regardless of mileage or title, whatever on the engine replacement. But if someone is looking to add a perfect low mile $35k+ M3 to their garage, I'd imagine you'd be hard-pressed to sell them a car without the engine it rolled off the line with.

Just my opinion. "Eh, I'll let the engine blow and get it replaced" just seems like a bizarre, albeit common enough, approach to E9x ownership.
Where are you getting rod bearings replaced for $1500.00?
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      10-05-2018, 09:47 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSanto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by areyouamac View Post

i.e... 89k miles road bearing failures = new engine.
I've never really understood the logic on this one. Nothing against areyoumac in particular. Seems a lot of people feel this way.

Considering depreciation is slowing on these cars, it's the last 2 door M3, it's the only V8 M3, it's the last NA M car, there's a chance it could hold or even increase in value (I'm not putting any eggs in that basket, but it's surely a possibility, especially for special colors or configurations).

Quite frankly, I wouldn't want an e30, e36, or e46 that had an engine replaced.

Seems like a weird gamble. You're making $930 payments- clearly you'd want to protect the "investment" — why not do rod bearings for $1500. Just a bit more than your car payment.

Does anyone know of people are okay with buying M3s that have had engines replaced? Or are buyers generally apprehensive?

If someone is in the market for a $15k M3 as a track car, or just desperate for an M3, regardless of mileage or title, whatever on the engine replacement. But if someone is looking to add a perfect low mile $35k+ M3 to their garage, I'd imagine you'd be hard-pressed to sell them a car without the engine it rolled off the line with.

Just my opinion. "Eh, I'll let the engine blow and get it replaced" just seems like a bizarre, albeit common enough, approach to E9x ownership.
Lol yeah letting the engine blow is extremely nearsighted
Thats not what Areyou said. If you have a warranty intact then you are prohibited from changing out the bearings. Any "modifications" to the engine can void warranty. Can you I do it anyway? Sure you can. But if you change the bearings out to let's say BE and those bearings blow, then when insurance does an inspection and finds out that the Oem bearings are NOT in the car that could void the warranty. This is why M3 owners make a decision to either have the bearings done OR obtain a warranty. This has been covered 100 times minimal in the threads. I'm not expecting you to know this I'm just letting you know that this is how this subject is covered in the forums. When his warranty runs out he can then either make a decision to change out the bearings or leave them in, but at this point in time it make almost zero sense to change them out under warranty.

And as UPSROD just said, $2,250 in the Tampa area where I am from for bearings.
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      10-05-2018, 09:51 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UPSROD View Post
the Where are you getting rod bearings replaced for $1500.00?
I'm not. I heard of people getting it for that low. I am, personally, under the impression it's about $1k more.

I guess that low number suited my argument better.
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      10-05-2018, 09:54 AM   #13
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i'm not a sunroof m3 guy but the car looks great
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      10-05-2018, 11:23 AM   #14
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How about this cool thing?

http://enthusiastauto.com/qsearch/?i...orm_display=51
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      10-05-2018, 11:29 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
Thats not what Areyou said. If you have a warranty intact then you are prohibited from changing out the bearings. Any "modifications" to the engine can void warranty. Can yo I do it anyway? Sure you can. But if you change the bearings out to let's say BE and those bearings blow. When insurance does an inspection and finds out that the Oem bearings are NOT in the car that could void the warranty. This is why M3 owners make a decision to either have the bearings done OR obtain a warranty.
Understood. I guess I hadn't considered you can't actually do the bearings with a warranty is it could affect your warranty. That makes sense.

And I realize, now, it's not a purposeful ignoring of the rod bearings with a "f*ck it" attitude about replacing the engine. It's a calculated risk, weighing the value of a warranty against the probability of a bearing taking a crap.

I'm so sick of talking about rod bearings, honestly. I've had this car for 10 days. I can't even imagine how the rest of you feel.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
And as UPSROD just said, $2,250 in the Tampa area where I am from for bearings.
I can confirm a Tampa Bay Area quote from a reputable shop, dated 10/5/2018 for $2,490 including new motor mounts. This includes OEM bearings, which the shop made a pretty legit case for.
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      10-05-2018, 11:45 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
Thats not what Areyou said. If you have a warranty intact then you are prohibited from changing out the bearings. Any "modifications" to the engine can void warranty. Can yo I do it anyway? Sure you can. But if you change the bearings out to let's say BE and those bearings blow. When insurance does an inspection and finds out that the Oem bearings are NOT in the car that could void the warranty. This is why M3 owners make a decision to either have the bearings done OR obtain a warranty.
Understood. I guess I hadn't considered you can't actually do the bearings with a warranty is it could affect your warranty. That makes sense.

And I realize, now, it's not a purposeful ignoring of the rod bearings with a "f*ck it" attitude about replacing the engine. It's a calculated risk, weighing the value of a warranty against the probability of a bearing taking a crap.

I'm so sick of talking about rod bearings, honestly. I've had this car for 10 days. I can't even imagine how the rest of you feel.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
And as UPSROD just said, $2,250 in the Tampa area where I am from for bearings.
I can confirm a Tampa Bay Area quote from a reputable shop, dated 10/5/2018 for $2,490 including new motor mounts. This includes OEM bearings, which the shop made a pretty legit case for.
Yes we are all tired of the bearings lol. But most of us understand when new members come on they want questions answered. And they should have that right. Some of the old timers will shake their heads but I never see anything wrong with the question coming up. There is a thread going right now based on do I get the bearings done or go with a warranty that will cover them.
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      10-07-2018, 11:36 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
I've never really understood the logic on this one. Nothing against areyoumac in particular. Seems a lot of people feel this way.
It’s more of driving the car for another 5 years knowing everything is still under warranty. Basically bumper to bumper warranty. It’s a peace of mind knowing if rod bearings is a known issue, I don’t have to spend money for preventive measures. I know warranty will cover the repairs. And at 70K+ miles - I would definitely love a new engine. 😀


The warranty is also transferable if I wanted to sell before the 5 years are up.
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      10-07-2018, 05:22 PM   #18
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I'd love it a lot more with M3 body work and better seats. Still has to be a blast
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      10-07-2018, 06:36 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
Thats not what Areyou said. If you have a warranty intact then you are prohibited from changing out the bearings. Any "modifications" to the engine can void warranty. Can yo I do it anyway? Sure you can. But if you change the bearings out to let's say BE and those bearings blow. When insurance does an inspection and finds out that the Oem bearings are NOT in the car that could void the warranty. This is why M3 owners make a decision to either have the bearings done OR obtain a warranty.
Understood. I guess I hadn't considered you can't actually do the bearings with a warranty is it could affect your warranty. That makes sense.

And I realize, now, it's not a purposeful ignoring of the rod bearings with a "f*ck it" attitude about replacing the engine. It's a calculated risk, weighing the value of a warranty against the probability of a bearing taking a crap.

I'm so sick of talking about rod bearings, honestly. I've had this car for 10 days. I can't even imagine how the rest of you feel.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
And as UPSROD just said, $2,250 in the Tampa area where I am from for bearings.
I can confirm a Tampa Bay Area quote from a reputable shop, dated 10/5/2018 for $2,490 including new motor mounts. This includes OEM bearings, which the shop made a pretty legit case for.
I just re read the end of that. The shop said to go with OEM bearings? This is frowned upon in M3post but what was the reasoning from the shop?
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      10-07-2018, 06:43 PM   #20
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Every single car for sale on enthusiast auto is way overpriced. It's all up to YOUR specific appetite if you are willing to overpay, for the admittedly very quality product they deliver.

I really hate people who rail against EAG when they've never bought a car from them. All you and others do is look at the price and have no clue about their business practices and their vehicles. Do some homework or contact them before telling others not to buy vehicles from them.
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      10-08-2018, 08:13 AM   #21
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I just re read the end of that. The shop said to go with OEM bearings? This is frowned upon in M3post but what was the reasoning from the shop?
Alright- so I thought about this a bit more after I posted it the other day. When the shop told me this, it sounded good, but the more i thought about it the more I wasn't really able to justify it.

They said if there is an issue with the rod bearings using genuine OEM BMW parts, they have some sort of warranty against defects. I guess this shop is some sort of authorized BMW shop. Basically- if the part fails (not normal wear/tear) but if, say, after a couple thousand miles one of the bearings fails because of a defect, BMW is liable to fix the car, in this case likely having to replace the engine because of a faulty part.

After I thought about it for a while and poking around the forums, I couldn't find anything about a new bearing simply failing. It would seem I'd be better taking my chances with the improved aftermarket part so I'm not questioning the integrity of the bearings again in 20k miles.

They did say I was welcome to purchase aftermarket bearings and they'll put those in, so I'd didn't really question their motive for pushing OEM at the time, except for the fact they're marking the price up from what they can be bought for on FCP Euro by $7.11 per for a total of $113.76 markup.
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      10-11-2018, 10:01 AM   #22
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CSanto

Check this one out: 2013 26K White/Black $43K (less than the one you posted)
https://www.carmax.com/car/16049107
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