Contemplating xjr575 as a change

[K-M3]

I know ... apples to oranges and I have not decided to pull the trigger yet , but , wanted to see if anyone here has a first hand experience driving a Jaguar XJR 575 and relate to their e92/93 experience OR even a 5/7 series experience. Don't want a Porsche and need a practical back seat (don't like the Panamera). So it's between the 550/M5/750 versus the xjr575 which I feel is an extremely good buy for the money . Plus all new jags are free maintenance for the first 5yrs/60k miles

[MrGatsby]

Originally Posted by K-M3

I know ... apples to oranges and I have not decided to pull the trigger yet , but , wanted to see if anyone here has a first hand experience driving a Jaguar XJR 575 and relate to their e92/93 experience OR even a 5/7 series experience. Don't want a Porsche and need a practical back seat (don't like the Panamera). So it's between the 550/M5/750 versus the xjr575 which I feel is an extremely good buy for the money . Plus all new jags are free maintenance for the first 5yrs/60k miles

I can't attest to the XJR575, I can however attest to the XFR which I owned for close to one long hellish year. It was an early model, 2010. I traded in my B5 S4 for it. After seeing the sleek styling and incredible power figures I couldn't believe i could get such a beast at the price I paid. I came to realize very quickly that "it's cheap for a reason" is the absolute truth.

Jaguar used to be the epitome of luxury back in its heyday with the E-type then on to the XJ12. When bought out by ford, they were econo cars dressed in faux wood and cheap leather. Now under Tata's ownership, they changed their strategy to making budget performance cars. Rather than adding features and reliability to their latest models, they are slashing prices down below competitors with the hope to attract the M/AMG crowd due to the cheap price, rather than the better car. To me, this doesn't appeal.

For the first few months my XFR car was a TON of fun -- fast, great looking, comfortable, and most importantly I got to say, "I own a jaaaaaaag". However this honeymoon phase wore off quickly. The car in its purest form is a lot cheaper than it appears. And it was very evident after I got used to the "gimmicks". Under the cloak of luxury is a cheaply built sedan. The car with just 32k miles would rattle over bumps, emitting strange noises from the suspension. The steering was sloppy and quite loose. The engine was fun and fairly quick, but felt considerably slower than a 500+ horsepower car should, and felt especially slower than its German counterparts.

It all went downhill when the radiator broke. It started leaking coolant so I took it to my local mechanic. He naturally won't touch jags with a 10 foot poll, so i took it elsewhere. The total bill for the radiator and some associated pipes was just over $1100. The next few months, my infotainment screen stopped working. The cost of repair? $3400. After this, I sold the car for a loss, and moved on back to a BMW.

Albeit, you won't have to deal with these repairs if you buy new with a warranty. (depending on how long you decide to keep it).

All in all, these "R" jag's are great looking and fairly quick, but that's really all they are.

Let me ask you this, if the car wasn't wearing a Jaguar badge, would you still be considering it?

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by MrGatsby

I can't attest to the XJR575, I can however attest to the XFR which I owned for close to one long hellish year. It was an early model, 2010. I traded in my B5 S4 for it. After seeing the sleek styling and incredible power figures I couldn't believe i could get such a beast at the price I paid. I came to realize very quickly that "it's cheap for a reason" is the absolute truth.

Jaguar used to be the epitome of luxury back in its heyday with the E-type then on to the XJ12. When bought out by ford, they were econo cars dressed in faux wood and cheap leather. Now under Tata's ownership, they changed their strategy to making budget performance cars. Rather than adding features and reliability to their latest models, they are slashing prices down below competitors with the hope to attract the M/AMG crowd due to the cheap price, rather than the better car. To me, this doesn't appeal.

For the first few months my XFR car was a TON of fun -- fast, great looking, comfortable, and most importantly I got to say, "I own a jaaaaaaag". However this honeymoon phase wore off quickly. The car in its purest form is a lot cheaper than it appears. And it was very evident after I got used to the "gimmicks". Under the cloak of luxury is a cheaply built sedan. The car with just 32k miles would rattle over bumps, emitting strange noises from the suspension. The steering was sloppy and quite loose. The engine was fun and fairly quick, but felt considerably slower than a 500+ horsepower car should, and felt especially slower than its German counterparts.

It all went downhill when the radiator broke. It started leaking coolant so I took it to my local mechanic. He naturally won't touch jags with a 10 foot poll, so i took it elsewhere. The total bill for the radiator and some associated pipes was just over $1100. The next few months, my infotainment screen stopped working. The cost of repair? $3400. After this, I sold the car for a loss, and moved on back to a BMW.

Albeit, you won't have to deal with these repairs if you buy new with a warranty. (depending on how long you decide to keep it).

All in all, these "R" jag's are great looking and fairly quick, but that's really all they are.

Let me ask you this, if the car wasn't wearing a Jaguar badge, would you still be considering it?

Thx man for the input. That helps. As far as the final question you posed, I honestly don't know the answer to that. When I looked at the XJR575 in person , I was blown away by the quality of its interior, the soft touches and the simple , cohesive design. The shut lines, panel gaps, fit n finish was just beautiful. Compared to my e92, the build quality at least in my initial impression was phenomenal. I have to say that the M3 has fared well though .... a lill rattle n buzz here n there but nothing feels like it has shaken loose after 75K miles . But at the same time, I can say the same thing about my wife's LR4 that's been pretty solid over the last 6yrs/90k Miles except for the horrendous prices that Land Rover dealerships charge for routine maintenance .

I have to put one thing in perspective though - I do not like any other jag car or suv out of their current range. Every single jag loaner I've had (wife has a LR4) , xe/xf , I found the interior very mundane. I do find the older design of the xj's jnterior very appealing as compared to the Mercs n modern Bmw's . But like u said, no idea on how it will stand the test of time though . N then there's electronics , that's one part that scares me. And neither am I a fan of the new land rovers save for the full-size Range Rover

Being an engine guy, the one thing that made me take a second look at the 575 was that sweet 5.0L V8 that is a bit older design but has stood the test of time with good after market support.

[MrGatsby]

Originally Posted by K-M3

Thx man for the input. That helps. As far as the final question you posed, I honestly don't know the answer to that. When I looked at the XJR575 in person , I was blown away by the quality of its interior, the soft touches and the simple , cohesive design. The shut lines, panel gaps, fit n finish was just beautiful. Compared to my e92, the build quality at least in my initial impression was phenomenal. I have to say that the M3 has fared well though .... a lill rattle n buzz here n there but nothing feels like it has shaken loose after 75K miles . But at the same time, I can say the same thing about my wife's LR4 that's been pretty solid over the last 6yrs/90k Miles except for the horrendous prices that Land Rover dealerships charge for routine maintenance .

I have to put one thing in perspective though - I do not like any other jag car or suv out of their current range. Every single jag loaner I've had (wife has a LR4) , xe/xf , I found the interior very mundane. I do find the older design of the xj's jnterior very appealing as compared to the Mercs n modern Bmw's . But like u said, no idea on how it will stand the test of time though . N then there's electronics , that's one part that scares me. And neither am I a fan of the new land rovers save for the full-size Range Rover

Being an engine guy, the one thing that made me take a second look at the 575 was that sweet 5.0L V8 that is a bit older design but has stood the test of time with good after market support.

The biggest issue I see with buying a new jag is the depreciation. While you get the warranty and service for free, if you ever decide to sell the car I am certain you will take a HUGE loss. If you look at the depreciation curve, the M cars and AMG's hold their value very well with a steady decline from new usually over a 10 year period, then they remain steady for another 10 years or so until some select few start to increase and the other decline a bit more. The Jags on the other hand lose a massive amount of value within the first year or two, steady decline, and continue down to abysmal value.

And in response to the final question I asked: really think about if that car held a honda badge, or a toyota badge, would you feel the same way about the styling and the quality? I fell into this trap when looking at the XFR. The fit and finish when new looked absolutely fantastic. It was this gorgeous machine that screamed power and luxury. That soon faded once i realized the Jaguar name played heavily into this feeling.

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by MrGatsby

The biggest issue I see with buying a new jag is the depreciation. While you get the warranty and service for free, if you ever decide to sell the car I am certain you will take a HUGE loss. If you look at the depreciation curve, the M cars and AMG's hold their value very well with a steady decline from new usually over a 10 year period, then they remain steady for another 10 years or so until some select few start to increase and the other decline a bit more. The Jags on the other hand lose a massive amount of value within the first year or two, steady decline, and continue down to abysmal value.

And in response to the final question I asked: really think about if that car held a honda badge, or a toyota badge, would you feel the same way about the styling and the quality? I fell into this trap when looking at the XFR. The fit and finish when new looked absolutely fantastic. It was this gorgeous machine that screamed power and luxury. That soon faded once i realized the Jaguar name played heavily into this feeling.

You may have a huge point there .... about the Jaguar name. It does play into it. Although I didn't get my e92 because it carried a bmw badge either ( n I don't like any other Bmw currently other than their F90 M5), rather I got mine due to its bespoke nature, uniqueness as well as a beautiful motor ( no other road going Bmw of past or future has carried the NA S65 V8 motor other than the E9X generation, something I honestly think even Porsche cannot claim if my recent memory serves me right. The most unique Porsche for me of the current crop would be the 2017/18 GT3 with manual transmission , but that honestly is way out of my league price wise)

I guess I've got a soft spot for "end of an era" cars which the 575 surely is ... supercharged V8s are going to be a thing of the past .... next gen XJ will be electric .... speaking of the depreciation , I guess a good middle ground would be to wait a few years n pick one up as a certified pre owned example .... OR not ..... time will tell I guess

[kyrix1st]

Bad contemplation.

[SYT_Shadow]

OP, think about it this way

The 5.0 supercharged engine which is the base for the 575 version has been around since the dinosaurs roamed the earth. It is truly ancient. As I found out years ago when a Tahoe's 4 speed tranny pooped out, ancient does not mean reliable.

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

OP, think about it this way

The 5.0 supercharged engine which is the base for the 575 version has been around since the dinosaurs roamed the earth. It is truly ancient. As I found out years ago when a Tahoe's 4 speed tranny pooped out, ancient does not mean reliable.

U got a point. However, My point of reference is the same engine that we have in my wife's lr4 (not supercharged of course) which has been solid for around 90K miles.... my colleague has the older generation Range Rover with the supercharged 5.0L V8 (500/510hp) tune that he has had for almost 8-9 years now (150K miles on it) and it's been pretty reliable with regular maintenance. So I believe that it's not too bad a platform to start with. But I may be biased from the small number of people who have had luck on their side (albeit with fanatical adherence to maintenance schedules).

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

OP, think about it this way

The 5.0 supercharged engine which is the base for the 575 version has been around since the dinosaurs roamed the earth. It is truly ancient. As I found out years ago when a Tahoe's 4 speed tranny pooped out, ancient does not mean reliable.

So let me ask you this .... forget as a M3 replacement .... as a stand alone purchase OR to add to the stable, what would your opinion be of the 575??

[kyrix1st]

One of my family members owned 2013 XFR for 4 years.

Coolant leaked out of nowhere because the interconnecting pipe on the center of the engine is made of plastic (the revised version is also plastic)..in the dealership for two weeks.

Then turbine started to make strange noise, turned out inner bearing was toast and the whole supercharger had to be replaced not under warranty, which led him to sell the vehicle at this point. Given the car was driven a few times at the track, felt great with some negative cambers and very light for its class.

Fuel economy is crap at 25L/100km, but doesn't go much lower or higher than that. Very torquey cruising at 100km/h, it will pass 99.9% of cars with a touch of throttle in 8th gear.

Top end pull I feel is much better than F10 M5s as well. Being lightweight is a big advantage.

Verdict is, it's a great car for commute and probably is robust aside from coolant leaking issue which seems to be 100% failure rate within 3 years. Also looks menacing with white exterior + carbon fiber vent hoods.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by K-M3

So let me ask you this .... forget as a M3 replacement .... as a stand alone purchase OR to add to the stable, what would your opinion be of the 575??

I don't trust their mechanical reliability enough to own one. It's not like I look for super reliable cars but the enjoyment vs reliability equation has to be positive.

I love the E60 M5 6MT for example and don't have one because of reliability

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

One of my family members owned 2013 XFR for 4 years.

Coolant leaked out of nowhere because the interconnecting pipe on the center of the engine is made of plastic (the revised version is also plastic)..in the dealership for two weeks.

Then turbine started to make strange noise, turned out inner bearing was toast and the whole supercharger had to be replaced not under warranty, which led him to sell the vehicle at this point. Given the car was driven a few times at the track, felt great with some negative cambers and very light for its class.

Fuel economy is crap at 25L/100km, but doesn't go much lower or higher than that. Very torquey cruising at 100km/h, it will pass 99.9% of cars with a touch of throttle in 8th gear.

Top end pull I feel is much better than F10 M5s as well. Being lightweight is a big advantage.

Verdict is, it's a great car for commute and probably is robust aside from coolant leaking issue which seems to be 100% failure rate within 3 years. Also looks menacing with white exterior + carbon fiber vent hoods.

Thx for ur input !!! Yeah ... that must be infuriating to see a good platform ruined by cheap cost cutting measures like a plastic coolant line in the vicinity of hot parts. Funny how the exact same engine proves to be more reliable on the same company's other arm (Land Rover) but so unreliable on the Jaguar side when it is in fact a Jaguar sourced V8!!!!

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I don't trust their mechanical reliability enough to own one. It's not like I look for super reliable cars but the enjoyment vs reliability equation has to be positive.

I love the E60 M5 6MT for example and don't have one because of reliability

That right there answers a lot of my questions !!!! Still ... the idea of owning a big jag thou ..... I guess I need to have a stronger will to resist :-)

[Soden82]

Originally Posted by K-M3

Thx for ur input !!! Yeah ... that must be infuriating to see a good platform ruined by cheap cost cutting measures like a plastic coolant line in the vicinity of hot parts. Funny how the exact same engine proves to be more reliable on the same company's other arm (Land Rover) but so unreliable on the Jaguar side when it is in fact a Jaguar sourced V8!!!!

I'm sure you could find an aftermarket replacement coolant pipe to ease your mind. Kind of like the charge pipes on the N5X cars

[K-M3]

I'm sure I can ... however ... the issue is then u wonder what else they may have cheaped out on OR what other weak links may exist in the design.... whatever I get , it's going to be my daily , so I do need it to be reasonably reliable for 4-5 years and preferably longer . We do tend to keep our cars longer in our family .

Also, with bmw's I'm fortunate to have a good local resource in deansbimmer (another forum member on here) to help me out not only with regular maintenance but also with repairs , so I don't have to run to the dealership anymore. With jags i don't know of a good local Indy jag specialist , so I'm pretty much stuck with the dealership . That would be okay for maintenance but as far as out of warranty repairs , I'm outta luck afaik.

Also for what it's worth ... it appears that the coolant leak issue was pretty consistent on The XF series of cars upto 2015. Mind you guys, this is just from a quick online search. Not a whole lot shows up when searching on the same topic for XJs. I don't know if the different price points or design ages that these cars sit at may have any bearing on this issue (case in point would be the plastic timing chain issue in earlier generation XK8s that was remedied in the subsequent generation ).

[MrGatsby]

Have you considered the Alpina B7?

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...7-photos-info/

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by MrGatsby

Have you considered the Alpina B7?

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...7-photos-info/

I've never really been a fan of Alpina styling ... or brabus for that matter on the Benz end

[K-M3]

Originally Posted by K-M3

I've never really been a fan of Alpina styling ... or brabus for that matter on the Benz end

Allrite people ... something popped up at my local jag dealer ... a 2018 xjr575 that is CPOed with Jaguar with jag extended warranty till 2024/100K and jag complimentary maintenance till 2023/60K. Car has 25K miles on it ... I know high mileage for a year old car but it's been maintained at this dealer and the service records check out. They have new front and rear tires on it. What do u guys think .... I'll be checking this one out ... will keep u guys posted

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I don't trust their mechanical reliability enough to own one. It's not like I look for super reliable cars but the enjoyment vs reliability equation has to be positive.

I love the E60 M5 6MT for example and don't have one because of reliability

Counting days till you put an S85 on your E90.

[K-M3]

Just a quick update ... did pull the trigger on that xjr575.... biggest practical consideration was the extended jag warranty till 100K miles/2024. So even if it throws up gremlins, at least it'll be on jag and I have essentially 70K to decide on how the car performs and lasts.

It's been with us for about 3 months now and we've put about 4K miles on it ... so far so good. Rides pretty sweet , power and throttle response is phenomenal and it's Very comfortable but nimble at the same time . So far , I like it ... time will tell if we continue to do so ....

Thx everyone for their input !!!

BTW .... kept the M3... just ... could ... not ... let ... it .... go!!!!

[wfdeacon88]

Originally Posted by K-M3

Just a quick update ... did pull the trigger on that xjr575.... biggest practical consideration was the extended jag warranty till 100K miles/2024. So even if it throws up gremlins, at least it'll be on jag and I have essentially 70K to decide on how the car performs and lasts.

It's been with us for about 3 months now and we've put about 4K miles on it ... so far so good. Rides pretty sweet , power and throttle response is phenomenal and it's Very comfortable but nimble at the same time . So far , I like it ... time will tell if we continue to do so ....

Thx everyone for their input !!!

BTW .... kept the M3... just ... could ... not ... let ... it .... go!!!!

pic please!

[K-M3]

Here u go ... only have I-phone pics... looks better in person