Switch from F80/F82 to E92 M3

[ryank382]

Hey all, I know this has been discussed before but I'm curious if those who switched to E9x have any regrets after doing so. And if they did what was it that they regretted?

4.5 years ago when I had the opportunity to buy an E92 I was somehow convinced by friends and family to just go for the newer F80 rather then an older used car. The E92 had always been my dream car growing up and I feel as though I made a mistake missing out on that. and that S65 sound. I love my F80 but 4+ years of numb electric steering and a horrendous exhaust note that I hate more and more every day has caught up to me. I've always been a fan of high revving NA power, hydraulic steering and just generally more raw feeling cars with character so I ended up buying a Z4m roadster about a year ago and have fallen in love with it so much so that I prefer driving it to my F80. Unless im tired or going on a long trip and want a more comfy ride. The less powerful motor hasn't bothered me either since the s54 power delivery is just so exhilarating to me. so much more personality.

basically my plan is to sell the f80 within the next few months, buy an E92 m3 and go the whole 9 yards with new ESS g1 blower, BBK, coils etc. and am wondering if i'm being an idiot by technically downgrading and would love to hear others experiences

[Helmsman]

Never had a F80 so can't say really. Had my E90M for 6y thought, with no plans to replace.

Plenty folks on the board who came back to the E9xM, I'm sure you'll receive some good feedback.

Good luck

[bvrider1]

Try some locals that have a super charged M3 and see if that is something that you would like to pursue.

I've seen posts of guys w. supercharged cars that can't seem to sell them as a whole and then part them out.

Pending on condition this might check your box for you.

[aBMWfan]

The E9x is considered a downgrade from my experience.

Had a 2009 m3 one owner 50k miles, had nothing but problems with the electricals that made it undriveable, was a gas guzzler, and lacks torque.

The biggest difference is the sound but that’s going to improve soon on the F8x platform

[JPWEraser]

I had a Z4MR for a good while too, great car. My father in law loved it so much he bought it from me which means I have access to drive it whenever I'm visiting him (win/win). I don't have any real first hand experience with the F8x platform but I can say that there is something great about high strung high piston speed engines (also had a modified AP1 S2000) so I love the E9x too.

2 great cars - you've got great tastes in my opinion!

[tdott]

Drove many F8x, a few on track also, still have my E92 M3 and prefer it.

Don't plan to get rid of it until im ready for a GT3.

BMW is dead to me. Nothing newer I'd wanna buy.

[Redd]

People buy cars for their performance; people keep them for their soul.

Get that E9x M3. There won't be another like it.

[DRLane]

If you're considering the SC route, highly recommended the Harrop kit. Insatiable power and the whine is super complimentary to the exhaust.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by tdott

Drove many F8x, a few on track also, still have my E92 M3 and prefer it.

Don't plan to get rid of it until im ready for a GT3.

BMW is dead to me. Nothing newer I'd wanna buy.

In the same exact boat. Don't even think I could get rid of it for a GT3. I'd need both. Too modded to ever get rid of it now anyways haha.

[KevinGS]

I owned a beautiful tanzanite blue F82, complete with aftermarket exhaust, KWV3 coils and the big gold-caliper CCBs. It was gorgeous.

And I liked it, a lot, and tracked it about 8 times.

But I didn't love it. Not on the street. At the track, the car was sublime...was absolutely thrilling.

But on the road, at anything under 9/10, the sound was just blaahhhhh. For a fun, sports car, I just needed better sound. And I would have gladly sacrificed some speed on the road for a better overall experience.

So, someone offered me a ton of money for my M4, because it was indeed beautiful and well-modded...

And then I bought an E93 for the street, and a 2001 Mazda RX7 for track days. Couldn't be happier.

BMW is making nice vehicles, but there's something missing in their newer performance cars for me. I had my friend's 2016 X5 M all weekend, with 550+ hp. It's so effortlessly fast, but boring. A twin-turbo V8, and even THAT doesn't sound good. A V8 that sounds blahhh. I'd never spend $100,000 on that thing, because truthfully, the interior wasn't $100,000 luxurious for my taste. It's all functional and Teutonic, but not worth the $130,000 asking price for the fully loaded model that he bought (though he did buy it used last year).

So, at least for now, I'll have to spend money elsewhere when it's time for me to dive into the newer platforms. I could definitely see myself in a Cayman/Boxster or a 992, and even an E63s/C63s when I need a four-door. The M5 is godawful fast, but similarly kind of boring because it's so big and isolated. You almost have to straight pipe it, and the sound would still not be all that dramatic on the inside of the car unless you roll the windows down....though it would be hilariously loud for those outside the car. I don't love the burbles of the C63 either, but you can get rid of 90% of the burbles with a tune...and with an aftermarket exhaust, the C63's twin-turbo V8 sounds amazing (and sounds pretty good stock).

But back to your original question, go get acquainted with an E92, like try to find an E92 meet in your area and go for a few rides. You'll see that it's a thrilling car (like your Z4m), and outright fast when supercharged. The F8X - hard to fix that numb steering and the shitty exhaust note (and I tried with my aftermarket exhaust). Still sounded like an uninspiring vacuum cleaner when puttering around town.

Sometimes in life, less is more....

[neilum]

I went from a '15 white/orange F80 to my current car.

I miss the look, I think the F80 is prettier

I miss having more modern and nicer car. The F80 is a nicer car in and out hands down.

I miss the interior, the E90 is not very exciting. Nice but very subtle. My SK orange interior in my F80 was very classy.

That's it really I can't say I miss the extra power of the F80 because it's that exact attribute that ruins the balance of the car. It's faster but good luck putting it down in the real world. I had 295's Advan Ad08's out back with only a Jb4 and the car was very unsettled, I just couldn't get the power down. It had to be above 60 degrees, and under the right conditions and yeah it will sort of hook but even on the street it was obvious the car is a mess with chassis balance and power. I live in NJ and from months dec-april forget it putting the power down, if its below 40 or raining? Good luck.

Plus it sounded meh and just overall felt very numb as a whole.

So yeah the E90 feels older but I guess that's the absolutely beautiful thing about it, it's got a freaking N/A V8 and frankly for me the many many things the E90 does better obviously makes it a winner in my book.

I'm also 39 yrs old now, I want more feel and character opposed to caring, measuring whp and how fast it is.

Although I would bet a ton of amateur racers would actually be faster or really damn closer in terms of lap times in an E90 compared to even a Comp pack F80. The e90 is a progressive, linear car all around that is much much easier to drive fast and begin to approach the potential of the chassis.

[aus]

More importantly, did you get the VANOS fix on the 54?

My buddy has an E46 M3 and E92 M3, both manual. He loves them both but tracks the E92 more.
Dumbass hasn't fixed the VANOS or rear subframe on his E46.
.

[OG Shark]

It’s not a downgrade if it brings you more enjoyment...

Had an F80, awesome car but just didn’t have “it”. E9x has it for me. Turned an E92 M3 into a race car (so much fun to drive) and then added an E90 M3 for the street.

[ryank382]

Originally Posted by bvrider1

Try some locals that have a super charged M3 and see if that is something that you would like to pursue.

I've seen posts of guys w. supercharged cars that can't seem to sell them as a whole and then part them out.

Pending on condition this might check your box for you.

thanks for the suggestion but I think id rather have it stock first and go through the whole transformation experience

Originally Posted by aBMWfan

The E9x is considered a downgrade from my experience.

Had a 2009 m3 one owner 50k miles, had nothing but problems with the electricals that made it undriveable, was a gas guzzler, and lacks torque.

The biggest difference is the sound but that’s going to improve soon on the F8x platform

what do you mean by the sound improving soon? I have a remus catback and heard numerous other setups and they all sound like tin canny tractor trucks to me

Originally Posted by tdott

Drove many F8x, a few on track also, still have my E92 M3 and prefer it.

Don't plan to get rid of it until im ready for a GT3.

BMW is dead to me. Nothing newer I'd wanna buy.

haha totally agree with the bmw is dead to me comment. My plan after the F80 was keep that until I can afford a GT3 but then came a z4m and now I feel I need an E92 lol

Originally Posted by Redd

People buy cars for their performance; people keep them for their soul.

Get that E9x M3. There won't be another like it.

That's the kind of confidence inspiring feedback I was looking for. Very true

Originally Posted by KevinGS

I owned a beautiful tanzanite blue F82, complete with aftermarket exhaust, KWV3 coils and the big gold-caliper CCBs. It was gorgeous.

And I liked it, a lot, and tracked it about 8 times.

But I didn't love it. Not on the street. At the track, the car was sublime...was absolutely thrilling.

But on the road, at anything under 9/10, the sound was just blaahhhhh. For a fun, sports car, I just needed better sound. And I would have gladly sacrificed some speed on the road for a better overall experience.

So, someone offered me a ton of money for my M4, because it was indeed beautiful and well-modded...

And then I bought an E93 for the street, and a 2001 Mazda RX7 for track days. Couldn't be happier.

BMW is making nice vehicles, but there's something missing in their newer performance cars for me. I had my friend's 2016 X5 M all weekend, with 550+ hp. It's so effortlessly fast, but boring. A twin-turbo V8, and even THAT doesn't sound good. A V8 that sounds blahhh. I'd never spend $100,000 on that thing, because truthfully, the interior wasn't $100,000 luxurious for my taste. It's all functional and Teutonic, but not worth the $130,000 asking price for the fully loaded model that he bought (though he did buy it used last year).

So, at least for now, I'll have to spend money elsewhere when it's time for me to dive into the newer platforms. I could definitely see myself in a Cayman/Boxster or a 992, and even an E63s/C63s when I need a four-door. The M5 is godawful fast, but similarly kind of boring because it's so big and isolated. You almost have to straight pipe it, and the sound would still not be all that dramatic on the inside of the car unless you roll the windows down....though it would be hilariously loud for those outside the car. I don't love the burbles of the C63 either, but you can get rid of 90% of the burbles with a tune...and with an aftermarket exhaust, the C63's twin-turbo V8 sounds amazing (and sounds pretty good stock).

But back to your original question, go get acquainted with an E92, like try to find an E92 meet in your area and go for a few rides. You'll see that it's a thrilling car (like your Z4m), and outright fast when supercharged. The F8X - hard to fix that numb steering and the shitty exhaust note (and I tried with my aftermarket exhaust). Still sounded like an uninspiring vacuum cleaner when puttering around town.

Sometimes in life, less is more....

thanks for response. My father had an X5m and totally agree. Hoping after a SC kit the e92 is significantly faster then a stock motor f80. Seen some highway pulls of ess kits pulling on 458s but "highway pulls" are not exactly a very scientific comparison lol

Originally Posted by OG Shark

It’s not a downgrade if it brings you more enjoyment...

Had an F80, awesome car but just didn’t have “it”. E9x has it for me. Turned an E92 M3 into a race car (so much fun to drive) and then added an E90 M3 for the street.

thats exactly how I feel about my f80. it doesnt have "it". but my z4m does and i lovvvve it

[ryank382]

Originally Posted by aus

More importantly, did you get the VANOS fix on the 54?

My buddy has an E46 M3 and E92 M3, both manual. He loves them both but tracks the E92 more.
Dumbass hasn't fixed the VANOS or rear subframe on his E46.
.

I have not done the Vanos fix. Car only has 36.5k miles and not a daily. Just kinda rolling the dice on that one tbh. previous owner was also an enthusiast and car gets very little miles on it since its not a daily. oil analysis came back clean regarding rod bearings. feel pretty confident about it (knock on wood) lol hopefully will hear it coming if it ever does

[14_deltaM3]

For the OP - you might want to consider going the full NA route as opposed to SC for the e90.

A number of people who have gone SC and then restarted the build (or built another e90) have claimed retaining natural aspiration is optimal for this car. May not be true for everyone, but I think if it’s just for getting a it more speed, going NA only can make sense

[ryank382]

Originally Posted by 14_deltaM3

For the OP - you might want to consider going the full NA route as opposed to SC for the e90.

A number of people who have gone SC and then restarted the build (or built another e90) have claimed retaining natural aspiration is optimal for this car. May not be true for everyone, but I think if it’s just for getting a it more speed, going NA only can make sense

Thanks for the suggestion

I hate the power delivery of turbo'ed cars and while I've never owned a supercharged car, my expectation is that it will retain the same power delivery as NA, except with 200+ more horsepower lol as in the power curve doesn't change but rather is just moved up.

The most common alternative for more NA power I'm going to assume is catless headers+cams+tune+diff? which is still plenty of money for minimal gains. Given what I know about the SC route though I'm pretty certain thats the way to go for a street driven car.

My only concern is temp issues if I ever hit the track but considering I'm a novice thats not doing anything competitive or worried about lap times (prob just HPDE type stuff 1-3x a year) I don't expect it to be a significant problem. Also heard reliability is fantastic for the ESS kits

[Montaver]

I moved from an E9x to an M2C, love it. There are certain area's where its not as good (the stock sound system is crap, less 'natural' steering feel, exhaust note) but in terms of chassis its massively ahead. The way the diff hooks up, shell stiffness, eagerness on turn in, and overall tossable dimensions are a highlight. Lots of modern BMW's may lack character but the M2C certainly doesn't.

S55 sound will soon be solved, a wave of equalized and merged exhausts are about to hit the F8x market over the next few months... they sound fantastic to my ears. Doesn't fix the lack of induction sound (obviously!), but the equalised and merged pulses completely removes the dueling 3 cylinder sound.

This is a AA one currently in development (sounds like it has no primary cats to me given the raspiness) -



Here's the Milltek version for the M2C -

https://www.facebook.com/milltekspor...8613082806282/

There is a 30 page thread in the F80 exhaust section, real game changer in my view and removes one of peoples biggest gripes about the f8x platform.

[TriniBoy]

I sold my F80 back in Oct last year, I had it for 2 years from new, and it was my first M car.
It was a 2018 zcp 6mt in mineral white.

It was a sexy looking thing, I must admit, had all the creature comforts I wanted, but for some reason I could never really fall in love with it.
I accomplished everything I wanted to on the car, but something was still missing.

I also have a S50 swapped E30. Both cars were garage queens, well the E30 still is, but only one of them put a big smile on my face when I drove it, and it wasn't the F80. So I decided it was time to sell it.

I picked up an E92 M3 last week, after searching for a few months, its not my 'perfect' spec M3, but its pretty close, I'll continue my search though, till that perfect one pops up.

My initial impressions, the E92 is much more civilized and composed, and is no where near as stiff, I find it to be a much more comfortable ride, and in my opinion the sound the S65 produces is simply intoxicating, same can't really be said for the F, those farts get old quick...

Do I miss the F80? No not really, what I miss the most is sitting in the garage and drooling at it, but the E92 also has the drool factor

Would the E92 make me smile when I take it out? I guess time will tell, but initial signs are promising.

What I would say tho, is when you're ready to make the switch you'd know... I kinda knew the F had to go when I dreamt my wife drove it to work and I was ok with it

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by TriniBoy

It was a sexy looking thing, I must admit, had all the creature comforts I wanted, but for some reason I could never really fall in love with it.
I accomplished everything I wanted to on the car, but something was still missing.

Yep, felt the same...

My initial impressions, the E92 is much more civilized and composed, and is no where near as stiff, I find it to be a much more comfortable ride, and in my opinion the sound the S65 produces is simply intoxicating, same can't really be said for the F, those farts get old quick...

I had a '15, so no farts...and the newer F8Xs with all the farts, that's soooo not me.

Do I miss the F80? No not really, what I miss the most is sitting in the garage and drooling at it, but the E92 also has the drool factor

LOL yep, stared at my F82 A LOT, but I drool all over my E93 as well so...

I kinda knew the F had to go when I dreamt my wife drove it to work and I was ok with it

[Redd]

Originally Posted by Montaver

I moved from an E9x to an M2C, love it. There are certain area's where its not as good (the stock sound system is crap, less 'natural' steering feel, exhaust note) but in terms of chassis its massively ahead. The way the diff hooks up, shell stiffness, eagerness on turn in, and overall tossable dimensions are a highlight. Lots of modern BMW's may lack character but the M2C certainly doesn't.

Totally agree. Stock E9x M3 chassis is sloppy. Try one with solid rear subframe bushes and front monoballs. You'd be surprised what a difference these two mods make. I was.

[Jive]

Never owned an F8x but I did get a good amount of seat time at the track during a full day at BMW M school. After a full day of driving one 10/10, I can safely say I have no interest in replacing my e92 with one. While the F8x is the faster car, it certainly lacks soul. I’ll be holding onto the e92 until it rots. Nothing else interests me from the BMW camp, i would only replace it for a GT3.