Need a honest answer about loudness of x-pipe!!!

[crash32]

On my first e92 M3 I had a Meisterschaft GT2 exhaust and loved it. Although, I loved it..... I was always longing for a bit more drama once I really got on it. It sounded great and powerful up until 4,000-5,000 rpms and then it just kinda leveled out even as the rpms climbed up near 8,000.
I am told that a x-pipe will fix the problem and give me exactly what I am looking for. With that being said I am excited about going with a x-pipe set-up, but some of you guys have gotten me nervous with comments which is making it sound like it is going to sound like a top fuel dragster!!!
I like loud and I am okay with louder (louder than my Meisterschaft GT2 catback only), but I do not want to turn something that I feel as is a fine example of automotive engineering into something akin to a Honda with a fart-pipe. Granted.... poor example, but you get the idea.
It was my understanding that the x-pipe did make it a bit louder at idle, but the difference was not too noticeable until you got on it WOT. Am I confused? Is it really going to sound like open headers at idle, because that is how some people on this message board is making it out to be!

[dparm]

At higher RPM, the engine sound will almost always overwhelm the exhaust.

If anything, I would expect the X-pipe to produce a smoother sound since it allows the exhaust gas pulses to "line up" and mix properly. The muscle car sound you are describing is typically produced with an H-pipe that intentionally misaligns the exhaust pulses.

If you are curious how the car really sounds from the outside, just setup a camera on a tripod and drive down the street. Or, borrow a GoPro and put an external mic on the rear bumper.

[CarlosDanger]

I have test pipes with the GT2 and it sounds amazing! A little rasp about 4500-5000 rpm but it sounds great and not obnoxiously raspy. Cold starts are very loud, so RIP to your ear drums if you're not in the car. Also, besides cold start, everything sounds the same until you decide on some spirited driving then it just wakes up!

[BrewRifle]

I ran the GT2 with the AA HFC X-pipe for a week and the sound increased 10x under WOT and it sounded horrible. It lost all of the GT2 uniqueness was just obnoxious. It was definitely the loudest exhaust I had ever heard and it didn't sound good.

Here is a perfect example of what it will sound like. It's insanely loud.

[335m]

Maybe you should consider a dual or quad resonated xpipe. Should increase the loudness but will cut down on a little bit of the rasp and clear up the tone.

I just installed a Gintani rear section with catless xpipe and it's crazy loud so I will most likely have to get a couple resonators put on.

[RoundelObsession]

I have a quad resonated ESS Tuning xpipe for sale, it is in excellent condition. The ESS xpipe is one of a very few that move the "x" farther forward. Please pm me if anybody is interested.

[MPowerZ32]

If you just want loud you could go with non-resonated x pipe. It's going to be loud and raspy though. Personally, i would go with at least a pair of resonators to smooth out the sound.

[crash32]

I don't mind loud, but I want it to sound GOOD!!!!

[335m]

Originally Posted by crash32

I don't mind loud, but I want it to sound GOOD!!!!

Are you going with another GT2 rear section or are you only considering upgrading an xpipe?

I would say if you liked the tone of the GT2 then get it again and pair it with a quad resonated xpipe if you want loud but not as raspy.

[asmazda]

Originally Posted by CarlosDanger

I have test pipes with the GT2 and it sounds amazing! A little rasp about 4500-5000 rpm but it sounds great and not obnoxiously raspy. Cold starts are very loud, so RIP to your ear drums if you're not in the car. Also, besides cold start, everything sounds the same until you decide on some spirited driving then it just wakes up!

Test pipes are quieter than an HFC xpipe and much much quieter than catless xpipe. Also, less raspy than catless xpipe, which is why if you go catless you should get 4 resonators.

[NickS65]

Same issue here crash32 , (but got the Eisenmann Race muffler), the test pipes need a tune though, to remove the CEL, correct me if I'm wrong please. I'd like to prevent a tune (and smell, etc), but still make my Eisenmann Race a tad louder, not obnoxiously loud. During WOT, not cold start nor lower RPM driving/cruising.

[asmazda]

Originally Posted by NickS65

Same issue here crash32 , (but got the Eisenmann Race muffler), the test pipes need a tune though, to remove the CEL, correct me if I'm wrong please. I'd like to prevent a tune (and smell, etc), but still make my Eisenmann Race a tad louder, not obnoxiously loud. During WOT, not cold start nor lower RPM driving/cruising.

Not sure it is possible to keep the Eisenmann Race and just go a tad louder. Maybe if you keep the primary cats and just remove the secondary cats you might achieve that, but I can't say for sure because never heard this setup.

Many people end up switching out of a "race" exhaust to a "sport" exhaust when they remove the cats or go HFC, which is one of the reasons why you see so many race exhausts for sale used. Just listen to the video posted by BrewRifle if you don't believe me.

[crash32]

A bit confusing here.... but I suppose it's all subjective hence the mixed answers I am getting.
If you get an x-pipe do you still get significant gains without the use of a tune? Not wanting to get a tune just in the case it decides to puke it's guts on the track and then BMW USA denies the warranty claim due to the fact it had a tune.
I understand if I do not have a tune that it will show the annoying cel light. When BMW hooks up the car to the machine will it show history of cel lights coming on in the vehicle? If so then I am guessing that would be grounds for them to deny a warranty claim?

[asmazda]

Originally Posted by crash32

If you get an x-pipe do you still get significant gains without the use of a tune?

I understand if I do not have a tune that it will show the annoying cel light.

You will get most of the HP gains from the xpipe with HFC or catless. A tune just optimizes things but definitely not required. I ran my xpipe for a while without a tune and then later added a tune for the hell of it. I really didn't feel a gain in power from the tune itself.

I did a lot of research to figure out an xpipe setup that would not throw a CEL but still make some real HP. But I had a different concern than you - to make sure I pass the OBDII part of CA smog test since no tune I'm aware of can trick CA smog and I didn't want to keep swapping xpipes back to stock every 2 years.

Anyway, the only two xpipes that will probably get you by are the ESS or Fabspeed with HFC and O2 extenders. By themselves O2 extenders don't work, but when paired with 200-cell or 300-cell HFC in the primary cat location you should be able to squeeze by. Gintani tried to build an xpipe that was CEL friendly but their sales staff told me their xpipe will still throw a CEL.

Fabspeed is much more expensive than ESS but that is because they use the expensive HJS cats. HJS cats are supposed to theoretically clean better and last longer, but if you want to keep costs down the ESS one should work fine. The only heads up about Fabspeed is that their crafstmanship is shoddy. I got a Fabspeed xpipe and the x-joint wasn't welded cleanly and they weren't willing to send me a replacement.

Others will tell you that you really don't have to worry about a tune affecting warranty claims as long as you don't remove the top speed governor or raise the rev limit. But you should do what you feel comfortable doing.

You will definitely not have to worry about warranty with just an xpipe because you could easily swap out the xpipe back to the stock if ever something catastrophic happened and no traces left behind.

[NickS65]

Thank you for your honesty asmazda
Basicly there are not many people running secondary cat remove + ERace, the fact that the pipes will have to be cut and modified for only 2nd cat removal, i'd rather go for a HFC x-pipe in that case.

I still have the M Performance muffler (I believe it was standard on the ZCP M3), maybe I should consider putting that muffler back on + challenge Street or Fabspeed.

The sample GT2 Meister muffler + sport x-pipe as shown above is wayyyy too loud for my taste.

PS. anyone know where I make a proper introduction page? I feel like I'm leeching without contributing
Thanks

[asmazda]

Originally Posted by NickS65

Thank you for your honesty asmazda
Basicly there are not many people running secondary cat remove + ERace, the fact that the pipes will have to be cut and modified for only 2nd cat removal, i'd rather go for a HFC x-pipe in that case.

Yes, this is one reason to go with an HFC xpipe and the other reason is that only removing 2nd cats doesn't add much power.

The only upside I can see of hacking up your OEM xpipe to remove the 2nd cats is that you are guaranteed no CEL. But if you pick the right HFC xpipe with O2 extenders and a little luck you should still be able to avoid CEL without a tune.

Just remember an HFC xpipe with ERace will be really loud and drone like hell. If you like the sound of ERace I would suggest you pair the HFC xpipe with an ESport. As another poster mentioned in this thread, when you have an aftermarket xpipe paired with an aftermarket exhaust the sound is like 10X louder under WOT than just the aftermarket exhaust.

[NickS65]

Can't be clearer than that.. Cheers!

Still.. I can be a stubborn guy sometimes.. Should I only remove secondary cats, do you think this will actually result in the few dB's extra loudness I'm looking for? (I really love the Erace sound)

I've read before that it should not result in extra smell so that's good.

[pooyab]

I'm running GT2 with M3World X-pipe. (3" pipe with Res+HFC, no primaries). Probably one of the loudest cars in my area, especially when you really get on the gas. I have really heard it from the outside but I usually only get compliments.

[NickS65]

Wow, yeah.. I think here in Holland you'd get alot of fingers and the police.

Not to mention all the babyboomers here, who need the rest..

Still awesome sound though dude.

[e92_mike]

i have a non-resonated x pipe paired with gintani race. words cannot describe how loud it is, bassy and raspy but it still has that scream its intoxicating lol. personally though, i think the m performance exhaust sounds the best

[crash32]

Thanks a ton guys. Trust me if anything castrotrophic happened my local BMW shop will look at the car inside and out and go above and beyond to see if I had a tune. I am pretty sure that even if you did not remove/raise the speed limiter that there would still be indication that the software has been tampered with.
After seeing a practically brand new M5 at VIR blow out the bottom end..... it has certainly made me cautious in regards to my warranty especially that I push it pretty hard on the track.
Getting a HFC x pipe with O2 sensor extenders looks like that is my only option if I decide to go with the x-pipe.
I am surprised that the x pipe is still that loud with cats on it although they are hfc!

[kiln]

The solution to this thread is easy. Get a Meisterschaft GT (not a GT2) and pair it with either a hfc or catless xpipe and u will have the best and cleanest sound.

Ryan