Car Magazine shootout: e92 M3 / GT-R / 911 turbo / R8 (16 page review)

[BKsBimmer]

Originally Posted by Xcellere

As I said in the other thread, you have three beautiful Germans and one ugly Nissan. The Nissan looks like something out of an anime magazine or Transformers. I don't care if it's a few seconds quicker around a track than the other cars. I would have to live with it's ugliness day-in and day-out. No thanks.

Yeah just too bad those three beautiful Germans got stomped all over by that ugly bad ass Nissan.

[BMW335icDDS]

Originally Posted by BKsBimmer

Yeah just too bad those three beautiful Germans got stomped all over by that ugly bad ass Nissan.

+1. And looks are subjective, I love the GTR looks. At least it is unique instead of the common place 3 series body on steriods.

[TwiBlueG35]

Even put price aside, I would still pick GT-R over the other three. I have never liked R8's styling, even I saw it personally in the auto show, I found its headlights weird looking. M3 coupe was very good looking, but it looks way too similar to the regular 3-series coupe. I rather take M3 sedan, at least it adopts the coupe's front end which would differentiate itself from the regular 3 sedan. Posche 911 Turbo is not the best looking 911 in my opinion, although the difference is very small, I would say GT3 has the best looking front end and spoiler. GT-R's styling is very unique, not handsome, but very sporty and one of a kind. I love its taillights too much up to the point that I think four circular lights are the best looking design when put on the rear of a sports car. Since I have not driven any of these super cars, I could only give opinion on their stylings, but I do trust the reviews and comparsions I have read so far from different magazines of different countries that GT-R is really that superior. It almost would not lose embarrassingly against anything of any price. So far I have read and seen it go head to head against: Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera(BEST MOTORING), Audi R8, BMW M3, Lexus IS-F(from a Japanese magazine named LE VOLANT), Honda NSX Type R(BEST MOTORING), chevrolet Corvette Z06(LE VOLANT), Porsche 911 GT3(BEST MOTORING), Porsche 911 Turbo(Several magazines), Aston Martin DB9(LE VOLANT), Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano(LE VOLANT), Audi RS4(LE VOLANT), Mercedes-Benz CLS63 AMG(LE VOLANT). I am very curious to see how GT-R do against Ferrari F430 Scuderia, BMW M5/M6, Bugatti Veyron, Pagani Zonda, Aston Martin Vantage, Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG, Nissan Skyline GTR R34/R33/R32, Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX/X, Subaru Impreza WRX STI(old and new), Dodge Viper SRT-10, and Elise Exige S. Now that would be fun.

[BMWCali]

Originally Posted by Xcellere

As I said in the other thread, you have three beautiful Germans and one ugly Nissan. The Nissan looks like something out of an anime magazine or Transformers. I don't care if it's a few seconds quicker around a track than the other cars. I would have to live with it's ugliness day-in and day-out. No thanks.

I agree. But the bottom line is Nissan made one hell of a car here with the new GT-R. I don't see how the M3 can be compared to these other cars though. It's the cheapest, by $30,000!

[skierman64]

The M3 is the most fun to drive. That's all I need to hear.

Bottom line is, everything, including the lap times and acceleration numbers are subjective. There are so many variables involved and the M3 clearly was put at a disadvantage by going out first to be the track drying car. WTF is that about, I'm sure there were other non-test cars at the track they could have used to do the drying. With that said, the driver makes the most difference. They should have run 4 or 5 drivers through each car and averaged the time to give a better feel for how fast the cars really were.

I ran faster at Watkins Glen in my nearly stock E36 than a guy in a GT3. Because he had no clue how to drive the car. He was so embarrassed he didn't even return for the 2nd day of the event.

[remydlc]

colors are made for one taste, may not be intended or other's taste. The GTR may not be the right car for many people. I still would pick the M3, R8 and 911TT over the GTR.

But as a car's fanatics, I'd love to drive the GTR because is a hell of a car. You must admit the car is damn fast regardless it designs, looks, and whatever you dont like about it.

Car and Driver pointed out that the GTR will produce VERY similar 0-60-100 times due to its quick shifting transmission, whereas the others cars cannot. This is a big advantage to the GTR. Other than that, I do think if the Porsche would have been driven properly, it would have been the fastest car. The M3 was out of place because its RWD, even though it performed good for being the slowest. As they mentioned, the M3 HAS the BEST engine!!!!!!!!!!!

[remydlc]

Wow, just saw one of the vids posted here. I LOVE the GTR capability of displaying REAL TIME INFORMATION on the car's "navigation" display. Why the M3 doesn't have such useful function? I mean, it's supposed to be a track car, and as a track car driver you'd like to get all the information about your car. Wouldn't ya?

[d3l0n]

Originally Posted by remydlc

Wow, just saw one of the vids posted here. I LOVE the GTR capability of displaying REAL TIME INFORMATION on the car's "navigation" display. Why the M3 doesn't have such useful function? I mean, it's supposed to be a track car, and as a track car driver you'd like to get all the information about your car. Wouldn't ya?

+1 maybe next year? they should add more to that "car data" feature, instead of just miles...

[lvwirelessguy]

I recently had paperwork overnighted to me so I could get a GT-R for 10k over. I thought about it for a bit, especially since I never buy cars I haven’t at least test driven first plus this is Nissans first sports car in the 70k + range.

After seeing a lot of these reviews it seems like everyone has come to the conclusion that the car is very competent & insanely fast but not very driver involving, not very fun to drive.

I went ahead and tore up that paperwork. I have no desire to spend over 80k just to wind up disappointed

[lvwirelessguy]

Originally Posted by remydlc

Wow, just saw one of the vids posted here. I LOVE the GTR capability of displaying REAL TIME INFORMATION on the car's "navigation" display. Why the M3 doesn't have such useful function? I mean, it's supposed to be a track car, and as a track car driver you'd like to get all the information about your car. Wouldn't ya?

Its because the Germans are more concerned with the driving experience than with electronic gizmos.

This probably wont be changing anytime soon either and I am fine with that

[BM2006i]

In my opinion, I think the R8 is an ugly car, I just don't like the front and rear design. That's just my preference. GTR is a great car with an aggressive front end, got to love that tail as well. Porche 911 is nice but not much difference from previous designs. I have to agree with others that the BMW looks plain in comparison but still an amazing car.

[E82tt6]

Originally Posted by lvwirelessguy

I recently had paperwork overnighted to me so I could get a GT-R for 10k over. I thought about it for a bit, especially since I never buy cars I haven’t at least test driven first plus this is Nissans first sports car in the 70k + range.

After seeing a lot of these reviews it seems like everyone has come to the conclusion that the car is very competent & insanely fast but not very driver involving, not very fun to drive.

I went ahead and tore up that paperwork. I have no desire to spend over 80k just to wind up disappointed

I think that's a good call. I'd wait a year for hype to die down. At that point, you should be able to buy at a discount, not to mention get a test drive to decide what you think. The mythical "vpsec" or whatever they want to call it might even be on the table at that point. The only reason I ordered a 1 series without a test drive, is that I have some good friends in Europe who have driven the car, and I trust their opinions.

[mayno]

Originally Posted by E82tt6

Hmm, a bit suprised that the R8 was faster than the M3 in both a straight line, and around the twisties. Based on earlier test numbers, I would have expected the M3 to have an edge against the R8 in terms of power.

Also interesting to see that the 997TT is significantly faster than the GTR in a straight line. I think they should have run all 4 cars on a dyno, so we could get an answer on where HP for the GTR really is. Some have said 480whp, but if that were the case, it should have stayed ahead of the 997TT in a straight line.

who cares about dyno #'s at this point? just look at the track performance data...that's really all that matters.

[lvwirelessguy]

Originally Posted by E82tt6

I think that's a good call. I'd wait a year for hype to die down. At that point, you should be able to buy at a discount, not to mention get a test drive to decide what you think. The mythical "vpsec" or whatever they want to call it might even be on the table at that point. The only reason I ordered a 1 series without a test drive, is that I have some good friends in Europe who have driven the car, and I trust their opinions.

The great thing about a BMW is that from car to car the dna doesnt change. You know what you are getting even before opening the door of a new model.

[mojo]

Regardless Porsche is THE benchmark for all these cars. Nissan's claim to fame is "to be as fast as a Porsche!". Still a Nissan is a Nissan and a Corvette a Chevy. Its the same company that makes minivans to transport diapers and utility trucks to carry manure. The level of "driver involvement" is the same as are the part bins.

The GTR is very fast but a “revenge of the nerd kind of fast” judging by the posts above. It's tasteless and immature. The reason Porsche didn't make a faster car - is not because they can't but because the 997 TT is far beyond the capability of 99.999% of us already. I lost a good friend to the Carrera GT, a car that challenges human limits.

Little faster or slower makes no difference for most of the drivers out there. Buy the car you like because, its cheaper, more exclusive, better looking, more practical, but not because its faster on paper. Buy the GTR if you are the nerd seeking revenge on the rich boys with the Porsches, BMWs and Audis.

Most interesting things I found about this article:

* How much faster the 997 TT tested over the M3
* How slow the R8 was considering the price
* How ugly the M3 is in the bunch

I actually like the looks of the GTR and the performance but would never own one for totally different reasons - the service department nightmare. Just think about the used car salesman, the odor of sweat and illegal aliens in the service lounge. Nissan to me means retarded mechanics that can't figure out what's wrong with the car and the service manager that insists I broke the turbo since the computer shows a redline even though it really was some freaking manufacturer’s defect – but they don’t have the margins to take care of the problem. In contrast Porsche was totally cool with me tracking the GT3 and my dealer even did the track inspections.


The moral is you pay for what you get - there is no free lunch.

[mojo]

Originally Posted by 240ka

and a 911 is just a VW beetle and its design is boring do to extremely slow evolution in design, so much that its looks virturally the same.

fact of the matte ris that the 911 turbos limits are very much so in reach. the GT-Rs limits have yet to be seen

My point was the limits are ALREADY beyond the capability of most of us and the fact that you can reach higher limits is pointless. The fast VW is the most successful race car ever made - that gets pretty boring yes.

[spacemonkey1112]

Everyone be honest. The GT-R can't compare in looks against the M3, 911 Turbo, and the R8. All three German cars have a lines that just "flows" smoothly from the front to the back of the car. unlike the Gt-R, you have lines and a body shape of an upcoming bat mobile.

Take a look at the side profile of the GT-R. I HATE how from the fender to the door, you have this line that abruptly drops for no apparent reason and just ends. WTF is that???

Now, I'm not bagging on the performance of the car, but in looks, you do NOT get what you paid for. With the German Cars, they carry such class an luxury within every bend of the car and IMO, that is absent with the GT-R.

[mojo]

Originally Posted by 240ka

ok so basically thats a way of discrediting or not giving nissan credit for its a achievement. that was pretty cleaver but not cleaver enough

the fact that the GT-R has a higher threshold to get to its limit means that it will give more of a thrill than the 911 turbo. b/c you are going to be able to push the car harder than you could the 911 turbo.

there are plenty of people that will find enjoyment in being able to go faster than you could a 911 turbo. especally race car drivers. so eithr porsche will find a way to come back or the Nissan GT-R will now take the crown of bein gthe most succesful race car ever made from this point on. so the 911 will end up being a thing of the past while the GT-R becomes the Present

fact is the GT-R outperforms the 911 turbo. the excuses are old. the GT-R is the New King

LOL. I didn't mean to discredit the Nissan GTR, its a very fast car. My point is any sports car in this class is fast enough for most and the driver is often the more important factor. Regardless it would be stupid to approach the limits of these cars on public roads. If you track the GTR the Nissan dealer is going to have your ass and void your warranty. If you want the impress the girl - get a Mercedes. This GTR was designed by the nerds at Nissan between Xbox-360 games for the nerd that wants to feel like king. Credit goes to Nissan for that. It ain't no Porsche or BMW or Audi just because it has similar numbers.

[eclipsisNA]

Originally Posted by hansyes

Come on.. Just say "I have such a bias in favour of German cars"

OK, the Japs wouldn't know a good looking car if it fell on their heads. There, I said it.

[Keto]

Originally Posted by 240ka

i fyou are buying it to impress people thats sad. a guy buys a GT-R to beat up the track and all the other cars while having the poise and quality of a 911 turbo

Just like every other car in the article, I doubt most GT-R's ever see the track.

[MMMMM3]

If you want a luxurious fast car - get the Bentley Continental GT Speed, not the GT-R or the 911 turbo.

If you want a fast track car - there's plenty of choice around. Depends on your price range I suppose. Lotus, Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari... But the most fun you can have driving a Nissan around a track - is in a 350Z.

And in breaking news. Infinity G35 driver is a big fan of a faster car also made by Nissan. Meanwhile owners of German cars remain loyal to Porsche and BMW.

[M2MG17]

I dont understand how the new m3 0-60 is so slow?? I was expecting it to be 4.1-4.3 sec.

I hope to see a better review for the m3 tested with dkg.