A little tuner action: AA vs Stock vs Powerchip

[sales@ESSTuning]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

I think your assumptions of what work is performed during this so-called "custom tune" isn't entirely correct. Yes you get custom AFR -- but that's about as much actual custom work that you get. The rest is almost entirely boiler-plate and doesn't require your car to be on a dyno.

• Opening throttle bodies earlier and all the way: check.
• Modifying spark curve: check.
• Change the RPM limiter: check.
• Cat delete: check.
• Launch control: check.
• 91 octane tune: check.
• Air filter: check.

If we really want to get technical about it, your custom tune is really only "custom" on the day you get it. After that, it might as well be a shelf tune. On any other day, the air density is different; density altitude is different, dew point is different; fuel may contain slightly different oxigenation; tempuratures are certainly different. All of these things affect the dyno results and the AFR of your motor. Your custom tune may have been custom on the day you got it, but it's not so custom a week later.

Even with that said, I'd still recommend a custom dyno-tuned ECU by AA or PowerChip if one can afford it.

Much of what is said here is correct. People need to understand how the DME in this car works. First it is a target based system. Unlike older software systems that need independent timing and fueling data to be adjusted based on desired operation this system can be told what you want and it will do it on its own. The DME will auto tune on the fly based on fuel, temp, altitude etc.. The majority of the system is adaptation based not custom pre-set files. There are a few things that can be custom tuned like vanos control, trottle response, RPM limit and adaptation values but this is not a system that requires alot of custom tuning to perform at its potential with a stock car or a car with simple bolt on mods like a pully and a muffler. You can make power on a dyno by simply resetting adaptations after you dyno your car once as the DME will unlearn any negative adaptation values it might have picked up in the past few hundred miles like bad fuel or high temps. We have done this many times with cars durning testing and picked up 10-15hp.

With most of the E90 M3 tunes on the market "including ours" what you will notice is how well the car drives and depending on the fuel you run you will pick up a little extra power. But there is no secret sauce to making a bunch of extra power with a software flash on this car.

[aus]

Didn't someone make 25HP here with a tune?

So was that gain just for that day, or will the gains be carried over as long as he has the tune?

[DLSJ5]

Congrats Bro, wished you could have made it this morning! I would have loved to see what your car could do! I'm very impressed with the #'s.

Jeremy @ Powerchip from what I hear and witnessed is the real deal, he tuned my buddies Stage 3 C63 that is a monster, cleary he knows what he's doing.

I do have to say though that the AA #'s don't make any sense, and I don't believe they are an accurate reflection of their tune, lower than stock? I don't think there is foulplay here at all, but AA is a very capable BMW tuner and other dyno's have shown nice gains, either way good stuff Elden and Jeremy!

[mvagusta]

so for me to get the best tune for my car. Is to take the car to powerchip? I live in michigan and we are not lucky to have tuners for bmw's . I'd love to have someone to dyno my car and pull all the hp out of it. So does this mean that i would get a shelf tune? So basicly it doesn't matter for customers outside of the perimeters of these tuners, where stuck with out the shelf tunes. AA or powerchip same thing for me? I have a pulley AA and a afe filter and scoops and I am about to buy a fabspeed hjc cat x pipe with my stock muffler. I can't get a custom tune because my car is not there to dyno?

[BPMSport]

I agree that it is out of characteristic for the tune to have lost power on the dyno. But I've seen this happen before. AA is a well respected tuner and I was surprised to see the results.

mvagusta: Shoot me a PM and we'll discuss options for your car. There are options for us dyno tuning it remotely with our Powerflash kits. Thanks.

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

I agree that it is out of characteristic for the tune to have lost power on the dyno. But I've seen this happen before. AA is a well respected tuner and I was surprised to see the results.

mvagusta: Shoot me a PM and we'll discuss options for your car. There are options for us dyno tuning it remotely with our Powerflash kits. Thanks.

Agreed, Mike I apologize for not giving you props on the #'s as well, nice job!

[datbimmerdoe]

Sweet!!

[J08M3]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

I agree that it is out of characteristic for the tune to have lost power on the dyno. But I've seen this happen before. AA is a well respected tuner and I was surprised to see the results.

mvagusta: Shoot me a PM and we'll discuss options for your car. There are options for us dyno tuning it remotely with our Powerflash kits. Thanks.

+1

got almost the same setup as mvagusta, no pulley though.... and MS filter instead. Waiting to hear back on my options

[powertrip]

Agreed, but the reality is that the tune lost power up top . I can definitely tell that there is 40 extra horses up top, as the car has decided that it will chirp shifting into 4th gear under full throtte . Just an unbelievable amount of extra power gained considering it's not a forced induction engine .

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

I agree that it is out of characteristic for the tune to have lost power on the dyno. But I've seen this happen before. AA is a well respected tuner and I was surprised to see the results.

mvagusta: Shoot me a PM and we'll discuss options for your car. There are options for us dyno tuning it remotely with our Powerflash kits. Thanks.

[AMPowerJ]

Originally Posted by powertrip

Agreed, but the reality is that the tune lost power up top . I can definitely tell that there is 40 extra horses up top, as the car has decided that it will chirp shifting into 4th gear under full throtte . Just an unbelievable amount of extra power gained considering it's not a forced induction engine .

Chirping 4th gear is impressive!

[stylinexpat]

I think I want to try one of these tunes on my car It's stock now..

[rAdzM]

congrats! strong dyno bro! HFC's means cat delete?

[powertrip]

Originally Posted by radz182

congrats! strong dyno bro! HFC's means cat delete?

No, I'm running Encore Innovation high flow cats .

[mixja]

powertrip - Given you have a DCT any tips for getting the DCT to work correctly on the Dyno? I'm assuming Dyno Dynamics is a roller dyno? Are Roller dynos easier than hub dynos to get DCT going correctly on the dyno? Because I had real issues on a dynapack hub dyno - see http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...light=DCT+dyno

[powertrip]

Good question, Mixja. I haven't had my car on a Dynapack, but she did give us a hard time on this same dyno once before. For some reason it didn't want to shift out of 2nd gear on one run. We've gotten the best results by starting out in 1st and being aggressive with the throttle when accelerating through the gears on the dyno. Hope this helps .

Originally Posted by mixja

powertrip - Given you have a DCT any tips for getting the DCT to work correctly on the Dyno? I'm assuming Dyno Dynamics is a roller dyno? Are Roller dynos easier than hub dynos to get DCT going correctly on the dyno? Because I had real issues on a dynapack hub dyno - see http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...light=DCT+dyno

[mvagusta]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

I agree that it is out of characteristic for the tune to have lost power on the dyno. But I've seen this happen before. AA is a well respected tuner and I was surprised to see the results.

mvagusta: Shoot me a PM and we'll discuss options for your car. There are options for us dyno tuning it remotely with our Powerflash kits. Thanks.

powerflash kit? How does that work?

[stylinexpat]

Originally Posted by powertrip

No, I'm running Encore Innovation high flow cats .

Is that with the titanium or steel ones??

[BPMSport]

Originally Posted by mixja

powertrip - Given you have a DCT any tips for getting the DCT to work correctly on the Dyno? I'm assuming Dyno Dynamics is a roller dyno? Are Roller dynos easier than hub dynos to get DCT going correctly on the dyno? Because I had real issues on a dynapack hub dyno - see http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...light=DCT+dyno

We ran into this issue as well on the dyno. Powertrips car would refuse to shift up from second. You just have to keep driving it with varying throttle and it will eventually throw all of the malfunctions, which will unlock the rest of the gears.

mvagusta: Let's not get off topic with the Powerflash kits, you can PM regarding this. Sorry for still not posting the writeup yet, I haven't had a chance. It's coming soon.

[powertrip]

Originally Posted by stylinexpat

Is that with the titanium or steel ones??

Stainless steel.

[mixja]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

I agree that it is out of characteristic for the tune to have lost power on the dyno. But I've seen this happen before. AA is a well respected tuner and I was surprised to see the results.

mvagusta: Shoot me a PM and we'll discuss options for your car. There are options for us dyno tuning it remotely with our Powerflash kits. Thanks.

Would this be something Powerchip Australia could do? I've had the car flashed twice now, each time they sent me a flashing unit.

I'm assuming it requires some form of Internet connection whilst the car is on the dyno?

Also can you put the car in a special mode via flashing unit whilst on the dyno to disable ABS sensors et al that make DCT dynos hard?

[roycemek]

Not sure if this is related or not but has anyone tried pulling the tail light fuse. I haven't tried it myself but read a couple posts a while ago about a procedure to do a burnout with a dct tranny. From what I recall without doing anything the abs would freak out and prevent any sorta burnout. I know burnouts and dyno pulls sound very different but the abs errors sound similar.

[Eugene-TAIWAN]

Originally Posted by powertrip

Agreed, but the reality is that the tune lost power up top . I can definitely tell that there is 40 extra horses up top, as the car has decided that it will chirp shifting into 4th gear under full throtte . Just an unbelievable amount of extra power gained considering it's not a forced induction engine .

chirping is a sign of RAW POWER!