E92 6MT buyer's remorse!

[///M Ryder]

Originally Posted by rye m3

Some good posts here. I live 25 mile north of NYC and I'd give you an hour driving lesson as well. I've driven manuals forever and can double clutch, heel toe, etc.
I had an SMG E46 M3. Thought it was the hot thing so I gave up my MT. As i would think with a DCT, it would be fun for 6 months then become a bore. Or if you like to drive on the track, it would be perfect, because you really learn to brake, apex, etc.
I often wonder how many people chose the DCT because they think its cool or simply because they can't drive a stick.
Oh, switching to a DCT instead, that will be a $10k event, don't underestimate it.

I don't understand how you guys think the DCT gets boring. If you keep it in S mode you have to change gears at the same time you would in a manual. The difference is, you can put it in D mode if you just want to take it easy and cruise (news flash....you don't get that option in a conventional manual)........Phil

[jmflukeiii]

Originally Posted by rye m3

Some good posts here. I live 25 mile north of NYC and I'd give you an hour driving lesson as well. I've driven manuals forever and can double clutch, heel toe, etc.
I had an SMG E46 M3. Thought it was the hot thing so I gave up my MT. As i would think with a DCT, it would be fun for 6 months then become a bore. Or if you like to drive on the track, it would be perfect, because you really learn to brake, apex, etc.
I often wonder how many people chose the DCT because they think its cool or simply because they can't drive a stick.
Oh, switching to a DCT instead, that will be a $10k event, don't underestimate it.

I think someone should make a poll. I bet a lot of us with DCT can drive a stick just fine if not incredibly well and I think its a ignorant conjecture to say that we would opt for a DCT because we are unable to drive stick.

[gthal]

I have a 6MT and have owned 6MTs (or 5MTs) for the last 20 years. I had one "adventure" into a traditional automatic with paddle shifters on my Infiniti G37 coupe and quickly went back to a 6MT... this, however, was a true automatic. It did have beautiful rev matching and was fast but a DCT it was not.

As much as I love the 6MT on the M3, I will likely go to a DCT in the relatively near term. This is for a few reasons... 1st, I have a bad left knee and it makes using the clutch painful sometimes (this is the primary reason)... 2nd, the notchiness and grinding of the M3s manual takes away some of the enjoyment of rowing gears (nominally though).... 3rd, because I had the chance to drive a DCT car and it was very enjoyable and fun. The DCT I drove felt much, much quicker off the line because power delivery was so smooth and constant. Here's what I mean... you are sitting at a stop light in the left hand land... you need to get in front of the guy in the right hand lane to take an exit shortly after the light... light turns green... in a 6MT, you need to accelerate quickly, rev high and shift fast to get a good jump on the guy next to you and you come across like you are racing. Contrast that to a DCT... light turns green... click, click and you are in front of him. Much easier. Off the line, there is really no comparison... on the highway no real difference IMO.

I agree with many here... learn to drive the 6MT and you will be happy you did. Someday, you may feel the itch to go DCT and, if so, scratch it. It may be because of a physical thing (like my knee) or because it is easier to drive fast or maybe just because you want a change.

For those that say the DCT is for lazy drivers, I say they are nuts. It is a different experience but not better or worse IMO. Better for some things (speed, efficiency) and worse for others (feeling of accomplishment, maybe a slight increase in involvement). BUT for me, one is not more "fun" than the other. They are both a lot of fun just different. Learn the 6MT... you won't regret it... but if you want the DCT and making the shift is financially doable, that is a really great option too.

[jmflukeiii]

Originally Posted by gthal

I have a 6MT and have owned 6MTs (or 5MTs) for the last 20 years. I had one "adventure" into a traditional automatic with paddle shifters on my Infiniti G37 coupe and quickly went back to a 6MT... this, however, was a true automatic. It did have beautiful rev matching and was fast but a DCT it was not.

As much as I love the 6MT on the M3, I will likely go to a DCT in the relatively near term. This is for a few reasons... 1st, I have a bad left knee and it makes using the clutch painful sometimes (this is the primary reason)... 2nd, the notchiness and grinding of the M3s manual takes away some of the enjoyment of rowing gears (nominally though).... 3rd, because I had the chance to drive a DCT car and it was very enjoyable and fun. The DCT I drove felt much, much quicker off the line because power delivery was so smooth and constant. Here's what I mean... you are sitting at a stop light in the left hand land... you need to get in front of the guy in the right hand lane to take an exit shortly after the light... light turns green... in a 6MT, you need to accelerate quickly, rev high and shift fast to get a good jump on the guy next to you and you come across like you are racing. Contrast that to a DCT... light turns green... click, click and you are in front of him. Much easier. Off the line, there is really no comparison... on the highway no real difference IMO.

I agree with many here... learn to drive the 6MT and you will be happy you did. Someday, you may feel the itch to go DCT and, if so, scratch it. It may be because of a physical thing (like my knee) or because it is easier to drive fast or maybe just because you want a change.

For those that say the DCT is for lazy drivers, I say they are nuts. It is a different experience but not better or worse IMO. Better for some things (speed, efficiency) and worse for others (feeling of accomplishment, maybe a slight increase in involvement). BUT for me, one is not more "fun" than the other. They are both a lot of fun just different. Learn the 6MT... you won't regret it... but if you want the DCT and making the shift is financially doable, that is a really great option too.

Thank you for your response; coming from a 6mt driver who can also appreciate the DCT is a nice change from the general sentiment conveyed by 6mt drivers.

[///M Ryder]

Originally Posted by jmflukeiii

Thank you for your response; coming from a 6mt driver who can also appreciate the DCT is a nice change from the general sentiment conveyed by 6mt drivers.

[JusCruzin]

OP, how long have you had your car? It sounds like you just need more time to practice. Given your cautious attitude, I think there's almost no chance you will ruin you're car while learning stick. A number of us on this forum learned to drive stick on the M3, myself included. If you want advice on driving 6MT, you can ask that or take up the offer from someone here to teach you stick. If you've decided to get DCT, then you already know what to do, ie, suck it up and sell the 6MT and get a DCT.

Originally Posted by SeanR

Problem is, even if I practice, the only manual car I have access to is my M3, so it's going to end up exploding!

[gthal]

Originally Posted by jmflukeiii

Thank you for your response; coming from a 6mt driver who can also appreciate the DCT is a nice change from the general sentiment conveyed by 6mt drivers.

I don't wear my transmission choice as a badge of honor... it's just a way to shift gears on your car The 6MT vs DCT debate is not too disimillar to the RS5 vs M3, C63 vs M3 or even the 335 vs M3 debate... egos and personal preference turn into right and wrong debates.

They are both great and both offer something different yet are also both very well suited for this car.

[Prince_of_Persia]

Originally Posted by kpari09

6spd manual owners such as gthal and others who can admit to the technical brilliance of dct should be commended. They are very secure with what they drive whereas other stick drivers on this forum that take any opportunity to bash dct IMO have big insecurities when in comes to what they drive. I think those people who trash talk dct are just pissed that they're not driving one. The stick drivers who say good things about DCT are the ones who are perfectly content with what they are driving.

I think most of the 6MT owners know that DCT is a GREAT technology and it is FASTER! There is absolutely no debate about this. if you read most of the posts here, 6MT drivers even mentioned it. 6MT is more involving and more fun (again, it is my personal opinion from someone who learned driving manual in an M3).
At the end, both of them are great!

[gthal]

Originally Posted by kpari09

For some strange reason, the engine exhaust sounded beefier in the stick m3 than in dct. This could be because the gears are slightly taller in manual allowing for less shifts and more noise from that beautiful v8. I wonder if anyone else who's owned both feel the same.

I found that my exhaust got NOTICEABLY louder over time. Now that I have 23,000km on my M3, it is much louder and deeper. If your DCT is new, this could be the result of your 6MT's exhaust being broken in and louder and the DCT exhaust being quieter as it is newer.

[JCtx]

6MT is more fun and involved for those of us who still love driving (49 here), and with the light clutch, even heavy traffic is fine as I have nothing better to do (I don't text, talk, etc. while driving). Traffic shouldn't be an excuse not to drive a manual if you really like driving. If not, then I understand it can be a chore. In fact, to most owners IT IS a chore, since the ultra great majority of cars are automatics now, including all new Ferraris and many others.

But as many of us 6MT owners have always said (including me), it's a lot easier to drive the car aggressively with DCT, and it's quicker too. Since you have a lot less things to control and master, you can learn to drive a lot better much quicker. Best thing is to drive both, and make up your mind.

As a side comment, a friend who loves driving buys his Ferraris with F1, simply because all his other cars are manuals, and Ferrari has been designing its cars around F1 lately. In fact, his new 458 is not offered in manual anymore, and now comes in a proper DCT tranny (rather than an automated gated manual, which has an ultra-complicated shifting mechanism, and it's slower). He drives his Ferraris super aggressive, but not his other cars. With several cars in your stable, that choice makes sense for your weekend car then (his DD is an M3 6MT). Good day gang.

[ES_TRADER]

When I used to drive a 6mt, I would never drive aggressively with it like downshifts and such cuz i would always be worried of pulling a money shift. So everytime on the freeway, I would just leave it in 6th and just drive slow. If I have to shift I would make sure i go to n and then put it in the gear I want instead of directly into the gear. Amateur I know but couldn't ever get over it

[JCtx]

Originally Posted by richpuer

When I used to drive a 6mt, I would never drive aggressively with it like downshifts and such cuz i would always be worried of pulling a money shift.

You can SAFELY drive a 6MT as aggressive as you want, but if you want your tranny to last, you should avoid super quick shifts. And as far as 'money shifts', if you know what you're doing, the only possible one is the 5-4 downshift (doing 5-2). But yes, you'd NEVER do it as precise or as quick as a DCT.

[1cleanm6]

i sometimes drive a friends dct m3, it feels real good not always shifting..

but when i step into mine and drive it...i fall back in love all over again

[Possible Hero]

I really do think there is something to be said for rowing through the gears in a 6-Speed gearbox and doing perfect down shifts with your heel.
YES it does take a good while before you can figure it out, then get yourself tuned into exactly how your gear ratios work so you can match revs. But in the end you will feel like Lewis Hamilton (Who is actually winning lately) and it certainly is rewarding. The ONLY thing I can think of that you might do to damage the gearbox is shift into the wrong gear. But if that happens you will have much more then the gearbox to worry about haha. The M3 is built like a tank, I'm sure you will be fine, give it a month or 2. Teach yourself, watch youtube videos to see how others are doing it.

[sameh]

Some of you 6MT guys talk about DCT thinking mostly the D setting that is fully automated and not counting much the S setting that most of M3 DCT drivers use 95% of the time (I use D for coffee and occasionally long straight empty boring hwys- I'd use it in traffic too but I don't get much here) and fell in love with..terms like "rowing through gears" and "being involved" don't apply just to 6MT but to S setting DCT as well..We do up shift at the same time you up shift and same with down shifting so if the "involvement" means using your left foot to do that just say ( I love to use my left foot when I shift, which would be a valid point, however, old news for people who drove stick for years in the past)
You can argue:
-More predictable 2 gear down shift (6MT with good driver would be more consistent)
-Easier to drift with 6MT
But the rest of your cliché “lazy” “in control” Etc just don’t make any sense and probably mean you’ve never drove a DCT and just talking from pure imagination.
How can you call me with my DCT lazy if I go through gears many times more than you since I have 7 gears to play with..so technically in a 30 mile drive I will shift more times than you not just because of the 7 gears but also because of the ease of doing it..I drove stick before and to be honest, there were those times when I stayed on 3rd while optimally I should’ve downshifted to 2nd..in a DCT that is not an issue at all. I am sure some of you will say “Oh no I’m always in the right gear blah blah blah, but the honest ones who drove MT long enough they know what I’m talking about).
I had my share in the past in DCT vs MT threads and fights but this post is different, this post is just trying logically to reach out to the “hardcore” MT drivers to step back a little and reconsider what they think of DCT. No one here is trying to convince anyone that DCT is better or MT is better, they are apples and oranges.

[ES_TRADER]

Originally Posted by sameh

Some of you 6MT guys talk about DCT thinking mostly the D setting that is fully automated and not counting much the S setting that most of M3 DCT drivers use 95% of the time (I use D for coffee and occasionally long straight empty boring hwys- I'd use it in traffic too but I don't get much here) and fell in love with..terms like "rowing through gears" and "being involved" don't apply just to 6MT but to S setting DCT as well..We do up shift at the same time you up shift and same with down shifting so if the "involvement" means using your left foot to do that just say ( I love to use my left foot when I shift, which would be a valid point, however, old news for people who drove stick for years in the past)
You can argue:
-More predictable 2 gear down shift (6MT with good driver would be more consistent)
-Easier to drift with 6MT
But the rest of your cliché “lazy” “in control” Etc just don’t make any sense and probably mean you’ve never drove a DCT and just talking from pure imagination.
How can you call me with my DCT lazy if I go through gears many times more than you since I have 7 gears to play with..so technically in a 30 mile drive I will shift more times than you not just because of the 7 gears but also because of the ease of doing it..I drove stick before and to be honest, there were those times when I stayed on 3rd while optimally I should’ve downshifted to 2nd..in a DCT that is not an issue at all. I am sure some of you will say “Oh no I’m always in the right gear blah blah blah, but the honest ones who drove MT long enough they know what I’m talking about).
I had my share in the past in DCT vs MT threads and fights but this post is different, this post is just trying logically to reach out to the “hardcore” MT drivers to step back a little and reconsider what they think of DCT. No one here is trying to convince anyone that DCT is better or MT is better, they are apples and oranges.

Hell sometimes I start the car off in 2nd gear to avoid that extra 1-2 shift. I know exactly what you are talking about. Sometimes driving a mt long enough you eventually figure out ways to cut corners and do less as possible lol

[B R A N D X®]

OP,

Forget about instant gratification and learn to drive the manual well. IMO, until you can drive a manual transmission properly you shouldn't be driving at all!

Honestly, I don't think a manual tranny is ever a wrong decision on a high-performance car.

Have fun with it!

[creepy coupe]

The MT6 just gets better with age, mine has done 9k miles and it like night and day from when I first bought the car.

[tma1c]

I drove a DCT and it is faster. But 6MT gets my vote. There is a huge fun factor shifting through gears.

[ksoze]

Originally Posted by tma1c

I drove a DCT and it is faster. But 6MT gets my vote. There is a huge fun factor shifting through gears.

An experience that can also be had with DCT by simply tapping the shifter into "S"

[///M Ryder]

This thread needs to be the standard for how we discuss the differences in our cars. This is by far the best thread I think I've read and participated in where we share a different but respectable opinion ..........Phil

[sameh]

Originally Posted by richpuer

Hell sometimes I start the car off in 2nd gear to avoid that extra 1-2 shift. I know exactly what you are talking about. Sometimes driving a mt long enough you eventually figure out ways to cut corners and do less as possible lol

My point exactly..Thank you