evo: New M3 is a "disappointment"

[davesaddiction]

From their car of the year comparison.

They all seem to really like the i8, but don't mince words when it comes to the M3...

13:00 mark for their thoughts.

Keep watching to the end to hear the 458 Speciale's wail!

[malrash]

Thankfully they did not ding it on sound in their summary, which is becoming somewhat of a scapegoat for M4 critique by fanbois. Their beef was with power delivery which is my gripe with turbo'ed anything that does not have AWD and too much power. at least its good for timeslips.

[thekurgan]

Too much power/torque down low perhaps. I've been trying to find the evo review of the E9x series ... searching anything on youtube always brings one to some grotesque medical procedure, so I gave up for now.

[BrewRifle]

That 458 sounds/looks absolutely beautiful. Poor M3 didn't stand a chance in that lineup.

[YolkyPalky]

Wow, saying a $300,000 car is better than a $60,000 car, way to step out on that ledge EVO!

[V8FunNaturally]

Great video. Not surprised by the low comments about the m4. I forgot which magazine i read the other day also running a comp on 2014 performance cars and they had dreadful comments about the m4 "a terrible nightmare to drive at the limit as the rear end slips out without warning it's requires inadequate use of the throttle which ruins the fun". Something along those words, i don't remember exactly the wording. As i said before , that boosted torque on the rear drive axle of the car was a terrible choice by bmw. All serious turbo'd performance cars have AWD. All. I said it last year already. Finally as the hype cloud is starting to settle and bmw is no longer influencing the articles by lending the car out to individual journalists we see more accurate reviews.

[s85e90]

People are complaining about too much power? Gimme a break. The e9x could use more, the f80 has it and now people bitch. I'll have fun w/ a 500hp RWD all day long!

[thekurgan]

Originally Posted by s85e90

People are complaining about too much power? Gimme a break. The e9x could use more, the f80 has it and now people bitch. I'll have fun w/ a 500hp RWD all day long!

I think it's where the power comes into play, not the overall total. Pushing near max torque at 1500 rpm, in the wet, is no bueño without some sort of AWD.

[s85e90]

Originally Posted by thekurgan

I think it's where the power comes into play, not the overall total. Pushing near max torque at 1500 rpm, in the wet, is no bueño without some sort of AWD.

Unless you know how to drive I guess. Didn't people drive fast cars before TC was even avail? My z06 made more power and was fine...

[s85e90]

Also my Evo was AWD and making big power and would also just spin all 4 tires.. For all those saying cars are getting too powerful w/ RWD they are truly not "car people" ... More power is always better.

[thekurgan]

Originally Posted by s85e90

Unless you know how to drive I guess. Didn't people drive fast cars before TC was even avail? My z06 made more power and was fine...

But we all know you're some type of superhero

Aaaaanyway ... Evo didn't like it, it wasn't fun to drive so there is something not right with the chassis setup for it's oh-so-incredible power.

[malrash]

Originally Posted by s85e90

Also my Evo was AWD and making big power and would also just spin all 4 tires.. For all those saying cars are getting too powerful w/ RWD they are truly not "car people" ... More power is always better.

...and everyone thinks they are a better driver than they actually are....

[jra85]

Apparently Car & Driver isn't too impressed either with their long-term sedan:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...rm-test-review

The last paragraph starts to describe what they dislike about it (aside from the white leather seats ), don't know if they plan to embellish more in a future article or not:

Initial logbook commentary on the M3 includes praise for its well-bolstered seats, although many have expressed concern about the upholstery. The off-white leather is pretty, but our staff is not known for exercising particularly meticulous care of anything and we fully expect that this interior will be far more off than white after 40,000 miles. We’re less sure what might happen to the consensus formed during our 10Best evaluation. As unanimously pleased as we were with the M3’s quickness and tenacity, we were also disappointed by the clinical nature of its thrills. The car is overbearing on a first encounter, and it remains to be seen if an extended stay will temper that impression.

[s85e90]

Originally Posted by malrash

...and everyone thinks they are a better driver than they actually are....

In the right hands I guess

[davesaddiction]

Originally Posted by thekurgan

Too much power/torque down low perhaps. I've been trying to find the evo review of the E9x series ... searching anything on youtube always brings one to some grotesque medical procedure, so I gave up for now.

"superb poise and balance" when wet.

http://www.evo.co.uk/bmw/m3/8734/bmw-m3

Couldn't find a video for eCotY (other than a preview).

*** evo Car of the Year 2007: The Result ***

1st Porsche 997 GT3 RS = 95.7

2nd Ferrari 430 Scuderia = 94.9
3rd Audi R8 = 93.6
4th Mercedes CLK63 AMG Black = 91.4
5th BMW M3 = 90.9
6th Honda Civic Type-R = 89.4
7th Lambo Gallardo Superleggera = 88.2
8th Nissan 350Z = 87.6
9th Lotus 2-Eleven = 87.0
10th Mini Cooper S Works = 86.1
11th Vauxhall VXR8 = 83.8
12th Aston Martin DBS = 78.9

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by s85e90

People are complaining about too much power? Gimme a break. The e9x could use more, the f80 has it and now people bitch. I'll have fun w/ a 500hp RWD all day long!

But in 2008 did the m3 really need more power? Let me say a mustang v8 had 315 and a gt500 had 500hp.

People act like the e92 came out like 2 years ago and knock the car for not making the power. For the time the m3 came it was the best.

[Sebringjetta]

just so you all know you are all getting banned for talking bad about the new m3/4...lmfao

[V8FunNaturally]

"Moar power is better" is always true in the N.A. engines paradigm. But when you step into a small engine with the turbo being responsible for 40% of the power delivered it's no longer true. Power from boost is not as desirable as NA power because of the way it is delivered.

The evil is in the details. Max power numbers aren't sufficient.

[radiantm3]

Originally Posted by Ezio

But in 2008 did the m3 really need more power? Let me say a mustang v8 had 315 and a gt500 had 500hp.

People act like the e92 came out like 2 years ago and knock the car for not making the power. For the time the m3 came it was the best.

I still think the E92 has plenty of power to enjoy. Usually those who keep craving more and more power aren't the best drivers because the only thrill they get is going fast in a straight line. A good driver will have a blast even in an FR-S/BRZ. Going fast through corners and getting the rear to slip out is where the most fun in a car is and thankfully you don't need tons of HP for that.

[davesaddiction]

Originally Posted by s85e90

People are complaining about too much power?

Power is great, as long as you can use it.

Pretty much anyone who's ever driven a Cayman says that it could easily handle 100 or more horsepower, due to its ideal layout and perfect balance. The FR-S and BRZ are other examples, and even the insane horsepower numbers in the P1 and 918 aren't a problem because of the balance of the cars and the way that the power is delivered.

Honestly, I think the complaints probably comes down to power delivery in the M3/4. When you're at the limit, you want every input you give the car to deliver predictable, linear results. People are writing about the new M3 like they used to write about Corvettes. Fast, but a handful when approaching the limits.

[s85e90]

Originally Posted by radiantm3

I still think the E92 has plenty of power to enjoy. Usually those who keep craving more and more power aren't the best drivers because the only thrill they get is going fast in a straight line. A good driver will have a blast even in an FR-S/BRZ. Going fast through corners and getting the rear to slip out is where the most fun in a car is and thankfully you don't need tons of HP for that.

I agree with that on the street. It's much more exciting and realistic to wring out the e9x or a low powered car than trying to drive a car like a z06 that 1st, 2nd is useless and in 3rd you're going wellll into illegal speeds. The slower cars feel exciting on the DD metric.

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by s85e90

People are complaining about too much power? Gimme a break. The e9x could use more, the f80 has it and now people bitch. I'll have fun w/ a 500hp RWD all day long!

500hp no problem, 500tq different story!

My friend gave me a quick ride in his stock M4 the other day, mainly to show me how disapointed he was by the sound of the MPE I got him(bought it from IND at a good price and brought it back to Canada for him), it was a bit wet and all he could do was to get the TC light to blink, without the TC he would just spin badly. My +550hp E92 is far from having that much traction issue in similar condition, sure I'm running 295s PSS and he only has 275s but I still have 100hp more then him and my car grips better in the wet!

I'll say it again, a high hp/high torque turbo engine is not well suited with a front engine/RWD platform, this kind of engine needs AWD unless you want a drift car!!