DCT Leak Recurring Problem?

[SJL Custom]

The issue of the cause of leakage is simple. All the bolts that retain the pan and covers are aluminum. Aluminum bolts will stretch much easier over time than steel or stainless. Because the exhaust runs so closely to the actual pans, the heat transfers into the casing/pans and expands the parts. With this expansion, it stretches the aluminum bolts, and they become loose and lose their torque. Secondly, the casings twist a bit under hard acceleration, causing pressure again to those same stupid aluminum bolts, causing them to stretch. Two ways of fixing these issues. First, replace all the bolts with stainless fasteners and blue loc-tite them in. Second, increase the box rigidity by replacing the shitty plastic trans pan with a SSP billet pan. Not only will it add fluid, increase cooling ability, and look awesome, but it will also reduce the amount of flex through the transmission.

[rantarM3]

Originally Posted by SJL Custom

The issue of the cause of leakage is simple. All the bolts that retain the pan and covers are aluminum. Aluminum bolts will stretch much easier over time than steel or stainless. Because the exhaust runs so closely to the actual pans, the heat transfers into the casing/pans and expands the parts. With this expansion, it stretches the aluminum bolts, and they become loose and lose their torque. Secondly, the casings twist a bit under hard acceleration, causing pressure again to those same stupid aluminum bolts, causing them to stretch. Two ways of fixing these issues. First, replace all the bolts with stainless fasteners and blue loc-tite them in. Second, increase the box rigidity by replacing the shitty plastic trans pan with a SSP billet pan. Not only will it add fluid, increase cooling ability, and look awesome, but it will also reduce the amount of flex through the transmission.

Thank you for the information. I suspected that if I put back OEM parts, the problem would reappear in about the same amount of time. And it did not make sense to me that the seals would go bad so quickly. It does make sense that the bolts loosen and the lower pan warps.

Does anyone sell a stainless bolt kit for the lower pan and side cover? Also, do you know if the transmission has to be removed to replace the side cover gasket?

I have been led to understand that the bolts are stretch bolts and have to be replaced - i.e., one time use. What would be the torque spec for stainless fasteners as they would not be torque to yield?

I also found this pan, which would be a third alternative (to the Gintani and SSP pans): http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-E90-E92-...805825&vxp=mtr

I actually think the finish on the Taiwanese eBay piece is a bit nicer although it does not have the baffles that the SSP pan has.

[bakaneul]

Originally Posted by rantarM3

Thank you for the information. I suspected that if I put back OEM parts, the problem would reappear in about the same amount of time. And it did nit make sense to me that the seals would go bad so quickly. It does make sense that the bolts loosen and the lower pan warps.

Does anyone sell a stainless bolt kit for the lower pan and side cover? Also, do hou know if the transmission has to be removed to fix the side cover gasket?

I have been led to understand that the bolts are stretch bolts and have to be replaced - i.e., one time use. What would be the torque spec for stainless fasteners as they would not be torque to yield.

I'm curious to know as well.

[SSPKris]

We only use stainless fasteners for the pan. We only torque them to factory torque specifications. As you know they are still being torqued into an aluminum surface.

SSP

[dviolagis]

My car is 2011 with only approx 14,000 miles. I took the car for my final warranty service and asked them to check for leaks in the DCT and I had the same problem. I am the original owner. Car is well maintained - like new. Dealer will take care of the problem, but I think owners need to check this regularly. I think this is a real problem with these cars with these transmission. BMW should look to cover owners for this problem beyond 4 years similar to the the high pressure fuel pump issues they had with their turbo charged engines. My concern will it happen again.

[MPowerZ32]

I think this is probably a recurring problem. I had the dealership replace the side pan a month ago. Today i checked again while doing some exhaust work. Lo and behold, the bottom pan is also leaking. From what I can tell, the oil seeps through the bottom pan screws holes. I think the screws loosen themselves overtime. I don't want to try to torque the screws because of aluminum material. Going to have to take it in again.

[rantarM3]

I contacted BMW customer service, spoke with the dealer, and took the car back in. It's not yet fixed and will have to drop it off again on Monday. I was told by the dealer that they are waiting for BMW's response as to whether they will authorize the repair under warranty. This is turning into a ridiculous situation for something that thould be covered (and has been for others) without question or outdrawn review. This is supposed to be a luxury brand? Let's see what BMW comes back with on Monday.

I fully expect that the leak will return and If I keep the car long term, which has been the plan, I'll go with stainless fasteners and aftermarket lower pan.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by dviolagis

My car is 2011 with only approx 14,000 miles. I took the car for my final warranty service and asked them to check for leaks in the DCT and I had the same problem. I am the original owner. Car is well maintained - like new. Dealer will take care of the problem, but I think owners need to check this regularly. I think this is a real problem with these cars with these transmission. BMW should look to cover owners for this problem beyond 4 years similar to the the high pressure fuel pump issues they had with their turbo charged engines. My concern will it happen again.

At least there is a 2 year warranty on the job so if it leaks again, hopefully keeps doing it within that time period...

[318TI made me do it!]

I purchased my 2012 e92 2 weeks ago, few days ago lifted the car and checked for leaks, exactly the same problem. Went to the closest dealership, they told me the same resiculous thing, "it depends how big is the sippage" what? $50+k with oil leaks on 21k miles, thats absurd. Made an apointment with a different dealership, will see whats gonna happen.

[vastano]

MY car is currently at the dealer to repair this leak as well as a few other things. Just an FYI, dealer price to fix this is ~$1086. I have a third party warranty through MPP so theyre covering it (again...).

[318TI made me do it!]

Originally Posted by vastano

MY car is currently at the dealer to repair this leak as well as a few other things. Just an FYI, dealer price to fix this is ~$1086. I have a third party warranty through MPP so theyre covering it (again...).

I am lucky the car is still under warranty! What do you mean again? How often does it happen?

[rantarM3]

Originally Posted by SSPKris

We only use stainless fasteners for the pan. We only torque them to factory torque specifications. As you know they are still being torqued into an aluminum surface.

SSP

Do the stainless fasteners prevent the pan and side cover from seeping again in the future?

Originally Posted by Helmsman

At least there is a 2 year warranty on the job so if it leaks again, hopefully keeps doing it within that time period...

But who wants to have to deal with this every couple of years? I am going to suggest it could be characterized as a design flaw. In this day and age, a transmission cover should not be leaking every couple of years on a mass produced street car.

Originally Posted by 318TI made me do it!

I purchased my 2012 e92 2 weeks ago, few days ago lifted the car and checked for leaks, exactly the same problem. Went to the closest dealership, they told me the same resiculous thing, "it depends how big is the sippage" what? $50+k with oil leaks on 21k miles, thats absurd. Made an apointment with a different dealership, will see whats gonna happen.

BMW NA told me that I should try to work it out with the dealer or try a different dealer. And this is for a car under warranty. If this is not fixed, I will not consider any BMW in the future. It is truly absurd. Maybe BMW is playing the warranty lottery and trying to avoid fixing things on cars that are nearing warranty end.

Originally Posted by 318TI made me do it!

I am lucky the car is still under warranty! What do you mean again? How often does it happen?

That's exacly why I started this thread. The replacement parts are the same so the leak will almost certainly reappear, every couple of years it looks like.

[318TI made me do it!]

Here is how mine looks like :
(last two are from the engine oil pan)

[vastano]

Originally Posted by 318TI made me do it!

I am lucky the car is still under warranty! What do you mean again? How often does it happen?

Post #17

[rantarM3]

Good news on my end. BMW approved replacement of the mechatronics cover gasket. Hope it holds up longer than the original.

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by rantarM3

Took the car into the dealer and got it back today. I was told that the leak/seeping is not bad enough to warrant a repair. As the transmission housing goes through heating cooling cycles, it may allow fluid to come out. I understand the dealer's hands being tied by the repair BMW NA will authorize under warranty. So my gripe at this point is with BMW. Does anyone else think that for a high-end car, this resolution is not acceptable? It's just amazing that it is leaking/seeping but for BMW just not badly enough. I would also like to hear from any folks who do think BMW not wanting to fix the seal is acceptable.

I just brought my car in to have the sneakers put back on, inspection, bla, bla, bla....but noticed the DCT has been shifting rough and just not behaving normally. Told my SA and mechanic to check for leaking.....what do you know, they call me shocked that I could feel the difference in the trans and that indeed there was a leak and there is a whole process that needs to be gone thru to ascertain if its just the pan or something that requires the unit be replaced.

My dealer is great so not worried as they will go to war with BMW. OF COURSE, they know if their hands get tied on this issue, I will be bringing a lawyer in before you can say BMW.

I'm still under original warranty and own her outright.

Cheers,
e46e92

[Helmsman]

Changes in behavor sound like it gone (too) if it is the oil leak mate? 9.5 liters in total so Id assume a good couple of liters still should be ok.

Good luck

[lutfy]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Changes in behavor sound like it gone (too) if it is the oil leak mate? 9.5 liters in total so Id assume a good couple of liters still should be ok.

Good luck

I have had this situation at 22K first. zero track time (previous owner). On the warranty report (as printed by the dealer from the shared system) it read DCT oil leak with shifts being slow. Then the second time around it happened at 65K (2K miles ago and 3 months back). No shift issues but just a leak. Repaired under warranty and while at it I gave the dealer 7 liters of DCT fluid (they were going to only top off as its a lifetime fluid).

Am subscribing as this is a real issue and spread across a bunch of cars.

So far to date issues:

1) Steering rack to go (happening to others, I am getting a new rack under CPO as we speak)
2) DCT leak (no real fix)
3) Power steering leak on track (fixed with a breather catch bottle)
4) Rod bearings (am taking precautionary fix before CPO expires next month).
5) Engine mounts fatigued (understandable given the stress).

Otherwise the car has been fairly stout given the abuse on track.

Cheers,

Lutfy

[rantarM3]

Originally Posted by lutfy

I have had this situation at 22K first. zero track time (previous owner). On the warranty report (as printed by the dealer from the shared system) it read DCT oil leak with shifts being slow. Then the second time around it happened at 65K (2K miles ago and 3 months back). No shift issues but just a leak. Repaired under warranty and while at it I gave the dealer 7 liters of DCT fluid (they were going to only top off as its a lifetime fluid).

Am subscribing as this is a real issue and spread across a bunch of cars.

So far to date issues:

1) Steering rack to go (happening to others, I am getting a new rack under CPO as we speak)
2) DCT leak (no real fix)
3) Power steering leak on track (fixed with a breather catch bottle)
4) Rod bearings (am taking precautionary fix before CPO expires next month).
5) Engine mounts fatigued (understandable given the stress).

Otherwise the car has been fairly stout given the abuse on track.

Cheers,

Lutfy

I'd add the MPE issue for cars so equipped but at least they revised the design of the cans. Most of the issues in your list have no actual fix because the replacement parts are the same as the originals. So it's just a matter of whether one wants to deal with these issues on a recurring basis. I love the car but am on the fence about keeping it beyond 5 years because of that.

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by rantarM3

I'd add the MPE issue for cars so equipped but at least they revised the design of the cans. Most of the issues in your list have no actual fix because the replacement parts are the same as the originals. So it's just a matter of whether one wants to deal with these issues on a recurring basis. I love the car but am on the fence about keeping it beyond 5 years because of that.

It's a performance / sports car (I will let others argue semantics) and with it comes items that simply will wear out over time. It happens on P- cars, GTRs and would happen on exotics if people drive them enough.

What everyone forgets to realize is this is an engine that revs to 8400 and produces 414, N/A and is designed to last as a daily. Almost every other car even close to its capabilities simply are not designed for that type of use.

All these issues could be rectified with more heavily engineered parts, but everyone already bitches now at the price tag....BMW is never given credit and all people generally do is complain. If I was BMW, I would ignore us.

Cheers,
e46e92

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Changes in behavor sound like it gone (too) if it is the oil leak mate? 9.5 liters in total so Id assume a good couple of liters still should be ok.

Good luck

I will come back here and update, my mechanic is a friend, and I used to work at he deal some 14 years ago, so they got my back. The only delay is they are underwater with the TU63 recalls or they would have already started the process.....so process starts Monday and will update everyone.

The rough shifting is not something the tech could tell, but as he said, "you know your car, so not shocked if there is a slight change you would notice". So good chance it's just that the DCT is sensitive to oil level, even a small drop and that its just a leaky gasket and stretched screws and not a full unit replacement.

Cheers,
e46e92

[rantarM3]

Originally Posted by e46e92love

It's a performance / sports car (I will let others argue semantics) and with it comes items that simply will wear out over time. It happens on P- cars, GTRs and would happen on exotics if people drive them enough.

What everyone forgets to realize is this is an engine that revs to 8400 and produces 414, N/A and is designed to last as a daily. Almost every other car even close to its capabilities simply are not designed for that type of use.

All these issues could be rectified with more heavily engineered parts, but everyone already bitches now at the price tag....BMW is never given credit and all people generally do is complain. If I was BMW, I would ignore us.

Cheers,
e46e92

Most of the items outlined have nothing to do with a high revving engine. It seems you are ok with several transmission seals failing in three years or less, or 30,000 miles (in some cases far less). How about mufflers cracking or baffles coming loose inside? Is that part of the performance car experience?