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12-13-2019, 07:23 PM | #45 |
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I'm truly amazed not one person has mentioned the S85 V10 in the E6x M5/6. It's the one engine I want over my M3's V8. Heaven for me would be an S85 V10 shoehorned into my M3's engine bay.
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12-13-2019, 09:17 PM | #46 |
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People talk about the S65 like it's some magical power plant, cant say I agree. Yes it revs cleanly, has a nice rich tone and sounds great on the downshift, but it doesn't sound exotic to me. It's a comfortable 3rd behind a V10 or flat 6. The raw edge of a 90's VTEC unit is more thrilling in a lot of ways.
I moved from an E90 to an M2C, no regrets whatsoever. Dynamically its feels like a significant upgrade. I enjoyed the E90 but I had my fun with it, wouldn't go back. Sound wise the F8x has potential, there is some very interesting experimentation going on in the F8x exhaust section. Adding extra length to one side to even out the exhaust pulses and merging them completely removes the harsh 3 cylinder noise. |
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12-13-2019, 11:41 PM | #47 |
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I’m curious in what ways a 90s VTEC engine is more thrilling than an S65.
Haven’t heard a pleasant S55 to date. The M2 with the N55 sound far nicer, and still nowhere near as sweet as the S65. To some, sound plays an important role in the driving experience. For that alone, I wouldn’t buy an S55 equipped car (torque curve aside). Shove an E92 GTS 4.4L in an M2C or an F80 ZCP and I’d buy it yesterday. |
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12-14-2019, 12:44 AM | #48 |
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Then so does Gilbert Gottfried and Bobcat Goldthwait doing a duet of "Who Let the Dogs Out"
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12-14-2019, 03:54 AM | #49 | |
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12-14-2019, 08:41 AM | #50 |
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12-16-2019, 02:23 PM | #51 | |
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What is the point of a well balanced M3 for track duty? Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying, S65 sounds way better, I get that we all agree to this, but the M3 is 2nd best at everything and not the best at one thing. A GT3 as a track weapon is worlds better in every definition of the word. There simply isnt much to compare here. If you just want S65 platform because you like beating other GT3's with regular humans thats cool.
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12-16-2019, 02:27 PM | #52 | |
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I'm not sure where to start The GT3 can't be driven fast, which is why I crush all the fools who bought one thinking they'd now be able to keep up with a grocery getter. Stop comparing cars with excel sheets. Start spending some time at the track instead of excel-racing cars. |
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12-16-2019, 03:06 PM | #53 | |
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No one is comparing excel data, its already fact the GT3 is worlds faster. You are the one that is trying to argue that it isn't. Saying that you'd rather have an M3 over a GT3 track car is fine, thats your opinion. Adding 'a GT3 which regular humans seem to be unable to drive fast.' makes you sound like a prick. Barrier to entry is way higher in these cars, so chances of someone going ham and really being a 'track rat' is much lower. I dont even know why I am having to even say any of this, youre clearly a track guy, you of all should know this...
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12-16-2019, 03:18 PM | #54 | |
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12-16-2019, 04:23 PM | #55 |
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12-16-2019, 04:44 PM | #56 | |
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12-16-2019, 08:53 PM | #57 | |
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Porsche’s sound fantastic - particularly naturally aspirated ones. But note it’s taken Porsche nearly 12 years to make a series production engine (the GT4s 4.0) with the power of the s65. An s55 powered M3/m4 is an excellent, competent car that in many objective metrics is the best car bmw made. Having said that, it’s performance gain over the s65 powered M3 is all but meaningless off a track, and simply makes the car more conventional vs the v8 powered DTM car that proceeds it. |
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12-16-2019, 09:49 PM | #58 | |
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As for power, since the 997.1 GT3 Porsche has created equal (the 3.6 in the gen 1 is slightly lower) or more power from a lower displacement. This a GT car which sits at a higher price point though. Stock S55's are raw and aggressive but not particularly musical or rich compared to the S65. However there are some exhaust developments coming which equalise the exhaust lengths eradicating the dualing 3 cylinder sound you get from the stock setup. There are some good videos in this thread - https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1675268 Ultimately people should buy what makes them happy, I just don't subscribe to S65 'is the best engine ever' narrative. |
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12-16-2019, 11:16 PM | #59 | |
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12-17-2019, 04:05 PM | #60 |
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Had an M2 beside me yesterday when I turned a corner and I just do not like the sound it makes. They guy was not WOT or anything, but it just sounds bleh. Wish they would have put an all aluminum block variant of the S54 in the M2. Gussy up the rotating mass to get some more RPM, revise the heads to get rid of the valve shims and boom - sweet music.
Sadly, the new emissions rules will make NA engines hard to find. That, and the HP wars...
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12-18-2019, 11:25 AM | #61 |
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I sold my 2008 m three with manual transmission and I still miss it… I am getting a X.3 MC because I need the extra space and awd drive. If I were getting a Nother car I would get the M2 competition It reminds me a lot of my 2008 m three
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12-18-2019, 03:37 PM | #63 |
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Auto rev match should be banned.
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12-18-2019, 04:34 PM | #64 | |
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For me, I always thought the S55 sounded so close to S54 but with more muffling and resonances due to the turbos and exhaust limitations under the car that I skipped ever looking into F8X M's.
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12-18-2019, 05:32 PM | #65 | |
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On the other hand, the N55 and S55 both seem to sound like a slightly muffled box of rocks being tumbled in an industrial dryer. I honestly do not know what BMW did to make them sound so abrasive to my delicate ears. Perhaps with the right pipes, they sound better. But, I have never heard one that makes me turn my head and smile. In contrast, every V8 M3 or V10 M5/M6 I hear makes me look and smile. But so does every V10 R8... Go figure. And I just think there is something special about an engine running at 7500RPM+. FI cars do not need to rev to make power, and typically it is better to not run them to red line as their wee turbos far too often run out of lungs. On the other hand, NA engines need to spin baby spin!! Personal preference for sure. And to each their own. I am happy with my gas guzzling, noise making, hair raising V8 M3 and would not trade it for anything else with a BMW badge. And before it gets mentioned, I would trade my M3, my left nut and most of my fingers for the BMW S70/2 V12... But that had a McLaren badge on the car. Cheers,
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