Steering Wheel Vibration FAQ

[Dkhan23]

Nice write up!

[Mr. ///M3 RD]

Thanks for the great and well written original post

Recommend for the Administrator and or Moderators to make this a Sticky in the appropriate maintenance area of this forum so everyone (regardless of BMW make can benefit from this),

I like to add one item of note ... Vibration increases by the square of the speed (RPM) the result of course being the faster you go the more vibration you feel at the steering wheel ... and the longer you tolerate it the higher your repair bill will be eventually ... it goes without saying other related parts and components will wear and or fail.

[mlhj83]

Originally Posted by Mr. ///M3 RD

Thanks for the great and well written original post

Recommend for the Administrator and or Moderators to make this a Sticky in the appropriate maintenance area of this forum so everyone (regardless of BMW make can benefit from this),

I like to add one item of note ... Vibration increases by the square of the speed (RPM) the result of course being the faster you go the more vibration you feel at the steering wheel ... and the longer you tolerate it the higher your repair bill will be eventually ... it goes without saying other related parts and components will wear and or fail.

Cheers!

[Mr. ///M3 RD]

Originally Posted by bsiciliano

Add to the list-spacers. Took mine off, vibration stopped. Others have had similar experience.

Actually if you ask a well qualified BMW service technician or service assistant he will tell you "BMW does not recommend spacers on your car"

I tend to agree with this if you think about it anything that is machined (both sides of course along with matching spigots on your spacers) has a machining tolerance. So accumulated tolerances of the afore mentioned areas will add up along with the original parts may just contribute to wheel position misalignment that would be on and above the recommended OEM allowable tolerances.

The wheels being the most important part between our car and the road, I take this very seriously. Perhaps I'm overcautious due to my long engineering background, I see this from a different point of view.

Your removal of the spacers and eliminating vibration may very well have been exactly what I mentioned before ... vibration due to accumulated tolerances (adding up the face to face squareness and run-outs TIR [Total Indicator Readings] etc.).

[mlhj83]

Originally Posted by Mr. ///M3 RD

Actually if you ask a well qualified BMW service technician or service assistant he will tell you "BMW does not recommend spacers on your car"

I tend to agree with this if you think about it anything that is machined (both sides of course along with matching spigots on your spacers) has a machining tolerance. So accumulated tolerances of the afore mentioned areas will add up along with the original parts may just contribute to wheel position misalignment that would be on and above the recommended OEM allowable tolerances.

The wheels being the most important part between our car and the road, I take this very seriously. Perhaps I'm overcautious due to my long engineering background, I see this from a different point of view.

Your removal of the spacers and eliminating vibration my very well have been exactly what I mentioned before ... vibration due to accumulated tolerances (adding up the face to face squareness and run-outs TIR [Total Indicator Readings] etc.).

To echo, any runout anywhere on the wheel hub area is greatly magnified towards the outer circumference of the wheel.

[BimmerRob08]

Originally Posted by llis

78. You're driving on a crappy road.

NM has crap roads for sure, but for real though, even on smooth highway this happens.

[youngvedder]

great overview...thanks.

[4corners]

I get the vibration sometimes. Not every time. It makes me think it may be related to the braking somehow. Is it a rapid pulsing of the brake system vs. a vibration?

[mlhj83]

Originally Posted by 4corners

I get the vibration sometimes. Not every time. It makes me think it may be related to the braking somehow. Is it a rapid pulsing of the brake system vs. a vibration?

When are you getting the vibration?

What speed?
Accelerating, cruising or braking?
Do you feel vibration in the brake pedal?
Is the vibration rhythmic?
Any recent changes to the car?

[4corners]

Originally Posted by mlhj83

When are you getting the vibration?

What speed? Higher speeds above 75-80 mph, but not everytime
Accelerating, cruising or braking? Harder braking
Do you feel vibration in the brake pedal? Not in the pedal, pretty much completely the steering wheel, especially if I hit them hard going into a turn vs. a straight line. And fwiw my yawl/DSC comes on way to early IMO. Hoping restoring 1/2 inch stagger with new 265's in front resolves that
Is the vibration rhythmic? extremely rythmic vs. as the wheel turns, like the cow bell rock issue
Any recent changes to the car?EBC Green pads, turned rotors, added 12 mm spacers because I put 285's on the rear. When my fronts are worn, soon, front gets 265's so I'll eliminate the spacer. Spacer to reduce understeer until new tires. All these can be the culprit by themselves. Much less add them all at once.

But! the brakes are smooth as silk at lower speeds.

Thanks

[mlhj83]

Originally Posted by 4corners

Thanks

If it's only during hard braking (but smooth on cruising), then obviously, it's most likely brake related rather than anything to do with wheels, tyres or suspension.

ABS pulsation is quite obvious as you can feel (through the pedal as well) and hear the high frequency blunt knocking noise as the ABS pulses.

I would start by having your brake discs checked for excessive runout at your dealership or reputable mechanic. There is a good chance that your discs are/have (one or more of the following):

1) not sitting flush and flat with the wheel bearing
2) uneven pad deposits
3) warped due to wear and uneven skimming

Note that spacers and larger/wider wheels/tyres will exacerbate any form of vibration around the wheel area, due to the fact that the wheels (+ extra weight) are further out of the car, which increases the effect of centrifugal force on the spinning axis.

[4corners]

Personally I think if tire and wheel sizes are correct you should not use spacers except for temporary fine tuning.

Thanks for the info all.

Since I put new tires on my car and removed the spacers it is 1000 times better. It seems to be settling in and getting increasingly smoother.

[Miami11M3]

Very helpful

[slicer]

Originally Posted by mlhj83

Note that spacers and larger/wider wheels/tyres will exacerbate any form of vibration around the wheel area, due to the fact that the wheels (+ extra weight) are further out of the car, which increases centrifugal force.

Maybe I'm missing something but isn't centrifugal force associated with something that is spinning? Isn't it increased when you increase your distance or weight from the center of the spinning object? Isn't that increase something that would occur as you increased the distance and/or the weight from the center of the wheel/hub toward towards the direction of the tire? A spacer doesn't increase that distance at all, it only moves the center of the rotating object (the wheel) horizontally outward which is not the direction of the centrifugal force.

Incorrectly installed or poorly constructed spacers can definitely cause vibrations but I don't see how centrifugal force has anything to do with it. I do realize that centrifugal force is in play as part of the vibration but having a wider wheel or moving the horizontal position of the wheel is not a factor on its own. The source of vibration from a spacer would be due to it not being installed flat against the hub and wheel (due to debris or tightening the lugs with weight on the tire/wheel), not allowing the wheel to be hub-centric (aka not centered on the hub), or not being of uniform thickness (same affect as not being installed flat against the hub or wheel).

[mlhj83]

Originally Posted by slicer

Maybe I'm missing something but isn't centrifugal force associated with something that is spinning? Isn't it increased when you increase your distance or weight from the center of the spinning object? Isn't that increase something that would occur as you increased the distance and/or the weight from the center of the wheel/hub toward towards the direction of the tire? A spacer doesn't increase that distance at all, it only moves the center of the rotating object (the wheel) horizontally outward which is not the direction of the centrifugal force.

Incorrectly installed or poorly constructed spacers can definitely cause vibrations but I don't see how centrifugal force has anything to do with it. I do realize that centrifugal force is in play as part of the vibration but having a wider wheel or moving the horizontal position of the wheel is not a factor on its own. The source of vibration from a spacer would be due to it not being installed flat against the hub and wheel (due to debris or tightening the lugs with weight on the tire/wheel), not allowing the wheel to be hub-centric (aka not centered on the hub), or not being of uniform thickness (same affect as not being installed flat against the hub or wheel).

Perhaps I didn't explain clearly enough. When there is existing imbalance (for whatever reason) in the wheel/tyre, the centrifugal force is obviously unequal, this imbalance is made worse when the wheel is pushed further away from the car by the spacer. This is because, when the wheel is further away from the hub, the suspension arms and spring/damper will be less effective at damping the vibration - much like if you held a metal rod at one end with a spinning lob-sided weight at the other end, whereby, the closer you move your grip to the spinning weight, the better you will be at controlling the vibration, vice versa.

[slicer]

Originally Posted by mlhj83

Perhaps I didn't explain clearly enough. When there is existing imbalance (for whatever reason) in the wheel/tyre, the centrifugal force is obviously unequal, this imbalance is made worse when the wheel is pushed further away from the car by the spacer. This is because, when the wheel is further away from the hub, the suspension arms and spring/damper will be less effective at damping the vibration - much like if you held a metal rod at one end with a spinning lob-sided weight at the other end, whereby, the closer you move your grip to the spinning weight, the better you will be at controlling the vibration, vice versa.

I see what you are saying. Thanks for clarifying.

[ChrisK]

^

Another fact, you are more likely to have vibration issues with ZCP (359) wheels than the 220 wheels because of the offset.

[ChrisK]

I never had vibrations until i switched from 359->220 wheels

[flea333]

I got new PSS's on my car and upped the size by 1 and now my steering wheel has a minor vibration. I got it done at America's tire and they have lifetime balance for free. Problem is, everytime I took my car there, they f'd up my rims and scratched up my lugs. Even after I asked for hand removal some clown didn't use a breaker bar and f'd it up hard after yanking on it.

So the question is... do I risk them f'in up my rims and lugs again, and a hideous job removing the old weights and putting on theirs?

[patrick smith]

Good info thx , working on fixing my issue. Had tires rebalanced and still getting wheel shake around 75-80 mph on and off. It's weird I'll be driving it will be nice and smooth, then itll start shaking a little bit and then go away.

Interesting I have noticed that when I lower my tire pressures a little bit that the shaking is a lot less I was running 39 to 40 PSI and I lowered it to about 37 1/2 to 38 psi and the shaking was a lot less today interesting

UPDATE: so after inspecting my suspension, and it all looked new, ive narrowed it down to the tires. went and got two new tires and issue fixed. my old tires ( 15000 miles from the factory ) still had about %50 left on them, never had a patch, never beat one. not sure why they had issues. they were out of round, but just a little. it was enough to make my wheel shake at 70+ mph. maybe the sidewall was coming apart, flat spots, who knows. so i turned them into perm spare for the front, still good to drive on in a pinch.

but the new tires feel great, back on the road i go.....

[Peertwelve]

Originally Posted by mlhj83

Yes, vibration after a track day is common due to the following:

Flat spots from sitting at the pits when the tyres are hot
Tyres out of balance due to wear
Tyres out of balance due to pick up of hot tyre marbles
Wheel bolts may have also come slightly loose during the track day
Wheel weights have fallen off
Tyres may have slipped on the wheel due to cornering and braking forces

I was just about to ask this very question. Thanks to OP for outstanding thread resource!

[s26singh]

I had a annoying steering wheel vibration at 120+ KPH....with Avant Garde M359 19's and Continental ContiSportContact 3 tires; and spacer set-up 15mm front and 20mm rear (hubcentric).

I put on new rubber - Michelin PS A/S 3's all 4 corners, properly balanced, and kept the spacer set-up the same. And now, my E92 rides smooth as hell, good grip in the corners, AND NO steering wheel vibration - EVEN with a bent front driver side rim (which I am getting repaired later this week).

The Conti's were over inflated and the lug nuts were severely over tightened - cause of vibration and shitty ride quality.