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      10-21-2020, 06:28 PM   #23
Alfisti
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Thanks for all the responses, appreciate them all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by W/// View Post
Also, why not something in between a 991 and Mustang... ie a GT350
100% would do GT350, but must have 4 seats, must be a convertible and must be naturally aspirated. 1 from 3 or i'd have one in Avalanche grey or voodoo blue already.


Quote:
Originally Posted by marcw View Post
Sounds like you are already compromising with the 991 as what you really want is a 997.

To that end I bought a used V8 F-Type convertible and enjoying the heck out of it.
F-Type seems tons of fun but see strict requirements above.

991 Vs 997, I mean we could go on forever right? What I want is an Alcantara interior, I want sporty and the sea of leather reeks of GT too much for me. In saying that, I have an absolute hate on for 997 bumperettes, I am australian and do not have them there so the cars look odd to me here. Other issue is unless every box is ticked on the interior, such as leather dash, man it's a spartan look vs the 991 isn't it.

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Originally Posted by Humdizzle View Post
as others said. life is short. you don't want to eventually get your supercar at 50-60+ years old

I mean realistically a 997 GTS is not going to lose a ton of value right ? just think of it as 'moving money' rather than 'losing it'. You will get a large chunk of it back on sale. .
No supercar for me, have never desired them as they are just too much car for the road and if I am track daying it i'll just get a Caterham.

Yes i do expect the 997 GTS to continue appreciating but taxes in, i'm well over 100K for one here which is a bit silly when a 991 S is more compliant, handles better, is "faster" etc, I mean I really like them but man 110K? No.

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Originally Posted by chassis View Post
I’m sorry to hear of your loss.

Wait a year. It doesn’t seem like the right thing at the right time.
Appreciate the thought, dad was a hard man to like, had few friends including family. TBH he never should have had kids, he was just not suited to the responsibility, same with marriage TBH.

Waiting a year is likely the proper choice but a) likely means I miss the next driving season again, after missing two already and I am growing impatient, b) I fear prices rising further and C) I have very peculiar requirements for a 911, must be PDK, must have Sport+, must have PSE, must have black interior, must be white, red, blue or yellow. No exceptions OTHER than I seem to be fond of 997's in certain greys.

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Originally Posted by erickonphoenix View Post
A few years ago I was looking seriously at a CPO M3. After some hand wringing I just didn't feel comfortable spending that much for a used car so I bought a brand new 2016 Mustang GT performance pack and customized it. I won't say I didn't really enjoy the Mustang the four years I owned it however it was certainly not an M3.
More info please, what M3 were you cross shopping it against? I have rented 3 GT vert Stangs and thought they made a great noise and the engine was just perfect as it likes a few revs, i mean it's no race engine but she's not all torque. I feel the M3 is more DD than the stang, may be tough to DD the stang in winters here but not impossible.

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Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
I agree with the ‘life is short’ comments too, and that’s how I’ve lived my life for the most part. But the rest of this year and next year are going to be unprecedented times. I’m deferring a planned car purchase myself
Wife is 100pc leaning that way, she will not get in my way but I can sense her tension. It's probably the wise choice, I am just getting a bit impatient, been searching for so long.

One further wrinkle i forgot to add, there is a chance we move to Australia, not a high chance but a chance, and these cars are DOUBLE the price there so no way it's ever going to happen there.

Last edited by Alfisti; 10-21-2020 at 06:34 PM..
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      10-21-2020, 10:59 PM   #24
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If you get a Mustang, get PP2, Mach 1, GT350/R, and a little less desirable, the Bullet, those are the ones worth getting. All of those can punch pretty high and mostly have the traction to back up the power and chassis. Some don't have the best cooling for track duty, but if you are getting them for fun driving, they'll all fit the bill. The lesser models are fairly atrocious in terms of performance spec. A car needs suspension, brakes and tires/wheels to put the power down. Ford has a habit of severely handicapping their Mustangs with sedate and poor-performing suspension/wheels/tires, but not on the cars above.
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      10-22-2020, 02:23 AM   #25
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      10-22-2020, 07:41 AM   #26
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wow lots at play in your decision

If you are getting the car at a good price then I say go for it

it's a pretty reversible decision, a cpo 991.1S is a hot commodity, you won't have trouble reselling it and if you manage to resell it through a dealer facilitated transaction you won't lose much at all.

In my almost 5 years porsche ownership, which included 2 NA porsches (981S's) both bought new, I lost a total of $30000 in depreciation by doing sell throughs on the next purchase, that's only $500 bucks a month


I tried to compromise with a 2015 corvette after a 2014 cayman S, it wasn't nearly as enjoyable a car, it would be the same with a GT vs a 991.1 S


it's pretty clear you want the p-car experience, if you compromise with a mustang you will be left with that unfulfilled desire and who knows what's coming around the corner these days in our lives

go for it
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      10-22-2020, 07:50 AM   #27
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Oh didn't know it had to be a 4 seater convertible, that changes things

Hmm, I guess it depends what you're really looking for. An E93 M3 would be nice, but not sure if it's fast enough for you. They're the cheapest in the lineup, can be had with a good DCT and once bulletproofed, are very reliable. I think you'd be in under $35k USD all said and done, and you can do fun mods like exhaust (don't recommend test pipes on a convertible) and carbon plenum. I love the idea of being able the S65 in all its glory with the top down.

I think I'm on the same page as you though, I cannot justify the price of a 997 GTS either. It starts creeping up to some other seriously tasty used Porsches.
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      10-22-2020, 08:09 AM   #28
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Life is short. You don’t get an extra life or get to rewind for a redo. You’ll be 85-90 wishing you had done things that you kept yourself from doing. I paid the most I ever paid for a car for a 911 and haven’t regretted it.

Like most of us here, I always loved Porsches, had a poster of a 930 on my bedroom wall. Never thought I’d be in a position to have any Porsche, let alone a 911. I also tried to rationalize not owning one....they are expensive, another car can do what it does etc. However, I made the mistake of starting to test drive them, really look at how they are put together so to speak. I am also in the Corvette forum and you read all the hate about 911s in particular and how they (corvette owners) feel they have the better car and for half the money. However, go check out the C8 section and read about all the issues (like engine failure in a couple hundred miles) they are having and the base C8 can’t even be taken on a track.

I know I sound like a fanboy, but whatever, Porsches are special vehicles, even a base Macan. I’m on my third Porsche now (all purchased CPO) and now on the verge of contemplating special ordering one exactly to my tastes. There are things about a Porsche that are almost inexplicable or hard to measure. But you see the fit and finish, how things don’t really ever rattle, how you can drive it hard and it doesn’t go into heat sink mode, etc etc. And unlike people who own other higher end cars, people who own Porsches actually put miles on compared to Ferrari, Mclaren or Lamborghini owners.

There’s a Jay Leno video he just published on the 992 Targa 4S. He kind of sums things up nicely. Porsches are overall generally special vehicles and if you love cars and driving, and have the ability to own one, even for a short while....do it. You can always sell later and get your money back or at least a great portion of it.

Last edited by c1pher; 10-22-2020 at 08:15 AM..
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      10-22-2020, 08:18 AM   #29
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My recommendation would be to go for a 991.2. There’s a lot of refinement and the turbos make a huge difference in power delivery. However there are some nice generational considerations you make want to think about. Like a 991.1 is the last NA generation and the 997.2 has a hydraulic rack and is also NA. With that said, Porsche electric steering is light years ahead of other manufacturers and provides good feeling overall.

Depreciation rates are pretty low for 911s in general but I think the S and Targa depreciate the slowest.
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      10-22-2020, 08:58 AM   #30
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Twice the price of a used mustang still sounds cheap as shit unless mustangs are stupid priced where you are also.
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      10-22-2020, 09:11 AM   #31
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Do it. 911 prices are firm and it's a car that will always have a market. Worst case if your financial situation changes you will easily be able to sell it, likely without a crazy depreciation hit.
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      10-22-2020, 09:12 AM   #32
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Everyone knows cars are a depreciating asset overall and we are in Covid times where you can't go anywhere anyway. So it is not a good financial decision but you can't take it with you so its up to you.
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      10-22-2020, 10:07 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
Porsches are overall generally special vehicles and if you love cars and driving, and have the ability to own one, even for a short while....do it. You can always sell later and get your money back or at least a great portion of it.
If I wasn't planning to run the kids in the back for joy rides an older Targa would be great. You have a GTS Targa, man must be a beast.

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Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
My recommendation would be to go for a 991.2.
Absolutely no turbo, hard rule, I feel like in 10 years no one will be selling high performance NA engines to meet emissions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
Twice the price of a used mustang still sounds cheap as shit unless mustangs are stupid priced where you are also.
2015 to 17 stangs (before the refresh and more power) will set you back around 40K for GT vert with say 25000 miles. Maybe 37K if lucky. THat's regular GT no PP1 or PP2 so for my math I am adding in some suspension work.
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      10-22-2020, 02:07 PM   #34
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This may sound crazy but I tell everyone "My GT3 is the cheapest car I've ever bought" compared to past BMW Ms, WRXs, Audis, etc.

How does that make any sense? Because it's the first car that ever TRULY scratched the itch. I have no interest in buying anything else or jumping from car to car anymore. Therefore, not spending more money and taking all those depreciation hits etc. Is it an exaggeration...of course...but I stand behind the point.

Sure the 911 is twice the price of the mustang. But which would will still put a smile on your face in 5+ years?
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      10-22-2020, 04:06 PM   #35
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instead of paying all in cash can you invest some of the money and take a loan? Maybe 25% down and the rest invested to keep the cash reserve and offset cost. If you don't like it in a year or two sell it. I don't think you will take a financial hit short term.
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      10-22-2020, 05:13 PM   #36
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Didn't read responses, but if you are getting a solid deal, you can resell quick if necc.

Do it and thank us later lol

(why can't you try it ? Not gonna be near it ? I've driven MORE pleasure driving since March)
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      10-22-2020, 05:25 PM   #37
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at this point for me, price is somewhat irrelvent in a sense. all these cars perform and cheaper cars can be modded to performance and some expensive cars perform. its all about the car YOU want and will love. no need for compromises on toys....if we were car utilitarians we would all be in base model civics
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      10-22-2020, 06:16 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Hockey4 View Post
Didn't read responses, but if you are getting a solid deal, you can resell quick if necc.

Do it and thank us later lol

(why can't you try it ? Not gonna be near it ? I've driven MORE pleasure driving since March)
We don't really keep any cash so to speak, like traditional savings. We top up our RRSP when we can and invest some conservatively and some a little more bravely but I cannot justify cash as we borrow on our line at 1.75% and I can beat that even with really secure investments.

This is also a private sale but has 20 months left on the factory CPO.
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      10-22-2020, 06:47 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
We don't really keep any cash so to speak, like traditional savings. We top up our RRSP when we can and invest some conservatively and some a little more bravely but I cannot justify cash as we borrow on our line at 1.75% and I can beat that even with really secure investments.

This is also a private sale but has 20 months left on the factory CPO.
sure sure, it was more to the "if" you had to sell for some unforeseen situation, if its solid deal, then no worries. Buy it, enjoy it, and if shit hits fan for you guys, know you can sell quick
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      10-22-2020, 10:37 PM   #40
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I'm split on this but err on the side of caution. The premise of making such an expensive purchase on a depreciating item during such a bad economy doesn't sit right with me. You have to think about your job and livelihood first...

But at the end of the day it could be a risk that pays off as well. Nobody can predict what will happen.
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      10-23-2020, 08:31 AM   #41
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I passed.

I can REALLY feel the tension from the wife, she is 100pc in support of me buying a nice car but is super freaked about the pandemic and it's potential impacts. For e.g it's only 3 hrs drive away and i'd have to buy it sight unseen as we don't really go anywhere or see anyone.

It's also a super bright colour, which I thought I wanted but not sure I want to attract so much attention with a 991 as it looks brand new and may be a bit ostentatious.

I'm going to be grumpy today, I feel it is a very good with the options it has and that CPO in it's glove box but guy said to hold and see what happens.
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      10-23-2020, 10:17 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Humdizzle View Post
as others said. life is short. you don't want to eventually get your supercar at 50-60+ years old with back problems looking like a dummy trying to get out of the carbon buckets or complaining about a heavy clutch making your knee hurt

I mean realistically a 997 GTS is not going to lose a ton of value right ? just think of it as 'moving money' rather than 'losing it'. You will get a large chunk of it back on sale. .

you definitely get diminishing returns as you move up in car prices. Is a 458 3x the car my modded GTR was ? not really imo. But i have no regrets. Owning a supercar was definitely a bucket list item for me. The sounds, the nostalgia, seeing the plaque showing all of the companies F1 victories, the smell inside, the quirks, seeing people drop their jaws.

I probably wont get one again though. Especially a modern one that's turbo+DCT as they have no appeal to me. i find the 991.2 GT3 6 speed more appealing than a Ferrari f8 or 720s.

insurance isn't too bad if you go with specialty insurance like Grundy / Hagerty.
WTF. LOL. I bought my E86 Z4 Coupe 5 years ago when I was 53. Still not decrepit enough to need to sell it.
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      10-23-2020, 11:44 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
WTF. LOL. I bought my E86 Z4 Coupe 5 years ago when I was 53. Still not decrepit enough to need to sell it.
true. age is just a number.

Z4 is easy to get in and out of though. getting out of a lowered Ferrari/McLaren or GT3 with carbon buckets... without bracing yourself on the steering wheel or rubbing the side bolster of the seat is a bit of a balancing act though. even for a 5'10 160 pound dude like myself.
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      10-23-2020, 04:51 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorfast View Post
Do it. 911 prices are firm and it's a car that will always have a market. Worst case if your financial situation changes you will easily be able to sell it, likely without a crazy depreciation hit.
Agree. My brother recently picked up a 993 for a song. Mechanically in perfect shape, but needed a little love and there. He did this one purpose for a few reasons:
1) he'll be able to sell it for what he paid for it, and then some, without any issues, in case it comes to that
2) since the vehicle isn't perfect, not worried about it being daily
3) he's having a blast treating it as a project car, carefully and patiently fixing little things here and there.

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