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      12-15-2015, 01:07 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Move Over
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Originally Posted by M3 Number 86 View Post
which wheels are you guys getting in that et20?

I was running +25 with a 5mm spacer and it was fine with RS3. But with NT01 it was minimal spacing (dental floss' worth). Weird because it worked for some people but it didn't work for me.

But removing the helper spring has worked for me so far. Still nothing out of the ordinary. No more sounds or creeks or anything vs using the helper.
I'm running a 5mm spacer with a ET 25 up front. So, effective offset would be a 20.


Question...my CLubsports just came in, they are a 110 up front and 120 rear. Does that sound correct?
Good! I swapped mine before last event and it made a huge difference in reducing diving resulting in much easier weight management (technical). As a driver it was easier to control the car.
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      12-15-2015, 01:32 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m3SennA
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Originally Posted by Move Over View Post
I'm running a 5mm spacer with a ET 25 up front. So, effective offset would be a 20.


Question...my CLubsports just came in, they are a 110 up front and 120 rear. Does that sound correct?
yes....new ones come 110/120
Cool, wonder why they dropped the back spring rates so much
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      01-12-2016, 11:10 AM   #135
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For the guys with the newer clubsports

After brainstorming with Slicer a little bit, I have a similar solution for you since the spring rate and travel is different from the older kits.

The original new Kw clubsport spring has a spring rate of 110-170 and a travel travel of 86mm, and it is 6.6" Long (170mm).

I just got off the phone with Eibach, and the travel of the HRS-140-60-110 (110nmm, 140mm long) is also 86mm. This is due to the wire diameter and coil spacing being smaller.

So effectively, you can change to this shorter spring and gain 1.1" of clearance away from the tire, and technically not change the way the damper responds to the spring at all. They have the same exact spring travel. Which, is freakin awesome.

You can also scoop up a set of these springs for less than 140 shipped from Jegs. http://www.jegs.com/i/Eibach/369/140-60-0110/10002/-1

I will be installing mine this week, will report back if there are any issues (which i cannot see happening). Thought I would share!
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      02-14-2016, 11:33 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Move Over View Post
After brainstorming with Slicer a little bit, I have a similar solution for you since the spring rate and travel is different from the older kits.

The original new Kw clubsport spring has a spring rate of 110-170 and a travel travel of 86mm, and it is 6.6" Long (170mm).

I just got off the phone with Eibach, and the travel of the HRS-140-60-110 (110nmm, 140mm long) is also 86mm. This is due to the wire diameter and coil spacing being smaller.

So effectively, you can change to this shorter spring and gain 1.1" of clearance away from the tire, and technically not change the way the damper responds to the spring at all. They have the same exact spring travel. Which, is freakin awesome.

You can also scoop up a set of these springs for less than 140 shipped from Jegs. http://www.jegs.com/i/Eibach/369/140-60-0110/10002/-1

I will be installing mine this week, will report back if there are any issues (which i cannot see happening). Thought I would share!
Update?
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      02-14-2016, 12:57 PM   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exclusivs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Move Over View Post
After brainstorming with Slicer a little bit, I have a similar solution for you since the spring rate and travel is different from the older kits.

The original new Kw clubsport spring has a spring rate of 110-170 and a travel travel of 86mm, and it is 6.6" Long (170mm).

I just got off the phone with Eibach, and the travel of the HRS-140-60-110 (110nmm, 140mm long) is also 86mm. This is due to the wire diameter and coil spacing being smaller.

So effectively, you can change to this shorter spring and gain 1.1" of clearance away from the tire, and technically not change the way the damper responds to the spring at all. They have the same exact spring travel. Which, is freakin awesome.

You can also scoop up a set of these springs for less than 140 shipped from Jegs. http://www.jegs.com/i/Eibach/369/140-60-0110/10002/-1

I will be installing mine this week, will report back if there are any issues (which i cannot see happening). Thought I would share!
Update?
They work awesome and give me an adequate amount of clearance. Happy I did this, especially since I lost no suspension travel.
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      02-15-2016, 10:59 AM   #138
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Originally Posted by Move Over View Post
They work awesome and give me an adequate amount of clearance. Happy I did this, especially since I lost no suspension travel.
Have been looking into going this route, recently came across this

Not a KW coilover (Arogosta) W/ an Eibach/Swift (helper spring?) conversion. Interesting non the less as this was done on an 3-way coil-over built track car.

Those interested take a look and chime in



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      10-10-2018, 07:16 AM   #139
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Hi everyone! A great thread indeed, much appeciate all the shared experience! I just got my new tire&wheel setup and I fell in the same described situatuation at the front - BMW M3 E92, 265/35-18 MPS Cup2, 18x10, et25 - where the tire is touching the spring, may I ask the following:

What is the minimum clearance that should be kept between the spring and the tire in order to be on the safe side?

I am afraid that a tire may break in critical situation under heavy load and I understand that "the more distance, the better", but I am also trying to stay as close to the "et25 setup" as possible. So far I tried with 5 mm spacer and it still touches, while with a 12 mm spacer it clears, but i would prefer to use the thinnest spacer that would do the job.

I will be placing my order for Eibach springs - most probably the ERS-140-60-110, since my KW CS came with 110 front springs - but before that I am waiting for the KW input on the matter, hoping that they have come up with a solution, since this issue is around for quite a while.

Thank you very much for any attention!

PS: I am attaching a pic of the rubbing and a pic with the 12mm spacer installed.
Attached Images
  
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      10-11-2018, 02:02 PM   #140
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Just sharing, that after considering a couple of solutions such as helper spring removal or replacement with a shorter one, hub extenders + spacers, hub lip shaving + spacers, I decided to go with a main spring swap. Too bad that KW don't give this option at the very beginning of purchasing such a kit, since this particular issue has been arround for quite a while.
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      10-11-2018, 05:49 PM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj33cj View Post
Just sharing, that after considering a couple of solutions such as helper spring removal or replacement with a shorter one, hub extenders + spacers, hub lip shaving + spacers, I decided to go with a main spring swap. Too bad that KW don't give this option at the very beginning of purchasing such a kit, since this particular issue has been arround for quite a while.
What spring did you go with?


You Mentioned considered the shorter Eibach (I'm not a fan). Curious what you decided on.
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      10-19-2018, 07:56 PM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
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Originally Posted by Wendall View Post
My thought also. If you go with anything other than KW you will probably need to machine the spring perch/collar. Also, wouldnt you need a new camber plate or and adapter for any spring with a different diameter than the KW?

Let me know how this works. I am heading the same route as you. I have been thinking about this problem for a while.
I'm going with a KW spring in the same rate as my original spring (90nm). KW does have different spring rates available but I have observed that different spring rates result in different travel ranges. I presume it is because the higher spring rate requires a thicker wire diameter which thereby reduces the travel range of the spring. For example:
  • The KW Clubsport 3-Ways come with 90nm / 170mm springs which have a travel range of 92mm.
  • 90nm / 140mm spring has 80mm of travel (10.50mm wire diameter)
  • 100 nm / 140mm spring has 74mm of travel (11.00mm wire diameter)
  • 110 nm / 140mm spring has 73mm of travel (11.25mm wire diameter)

My understanding is that the greater the travel range of the spring the better considering I'm reducing that range. Plus I have not been dissatisfied with the stiffness of my current spring. My goal is to make this change while maintaining the same performance characteristics of my suspension.
Bumping an old thread ...

Curious @Slicer where, you were able to locate the KW spring travel range?
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      10-19-2018, 08:49 PM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exclusivs View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendall View Post
My thought also. If you go with anything other than KW you will probably need to machine the spring perch/collar. Also, wouldnt you need a new camber plate or and adapter for any spring with a different diameter than the KW?

Let me know how this works. I am heading the same route as you. I have been thinking about this problem for a while.
I'm going with a KW spring in the same rate as my original spring (90nm). KW does have different spring rates available but I have observed that different spring rates result in different travel ranges. I presume it is because the higher spring rate requires a thicker wire diameter which thereby reduces the travel range of the spring. For example:
  • The KW Clubsport 3-Ways come with 90nm / 170mm springs which have a travel range of 92mm.
  • 90nm / 140mm spring has 80mm of travel (10.50mm wire diameter)
  • 100 nm / 140mm spring has 74mm of travel (11.00mm wire diameter)
  • 110 nm / 140mm spring has 73mm of travel (11.25mm wire diameter)

My understanding is that the greater the travel range of the spring the better considering I'm reducing that range. Plus I have not been dissatisfied with the stiffness of my current spring. My goal is to make this change while maintaining the same performance characteristics of my suspension.
Bumping an old thread ...

Curious @Slicer where, you were able to locate the KW spring travel range?
There was (is?) a pdf spreadsheet on their web site.
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      10-19-2018, 08:54 PM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exclusivs View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendall View Post
My thought also. If you go with anything other than KW you will probably need to machine the spring perch/collar. Also, wouldnt you need a new camber plate or and adapter for any spring with a different diameter than the KW?

Let me know how this works. I am heading the same route as you. I have been thinking about this problem for a while.
I'm going with a KW spring in the same rate as my original spring (90nm). KW does have different spring rates available but I have observed that different spring rates result in different travel ranges. I presume it is because the higher spring rate requires a thicker wire diameter which thereby reduces the travel range of the spring. For example:
  • The KW Clubsport 3-Ways come with 90nm / 170mm springs which have a travel range of 92mm.
  • 90nm / 140mm spring has 80mm of travel (10.50mm wire diameter)
  • 100 nm / 140mm spring has 74mm of travel (11.00mm wire diameter)
  • 110 nm / 140mm spring has 73mm of travel (11.25mm wire diameter)

My understanding is that the greater the travel range of the spring the better considering I'm reducing that range. Plus I have not been dissatisfied with the stiffness of my current spring. My goal is to make this change while maintaining the same performance characteristics of my suspension.
Bumping an old thread ...

Curious @Slicer where, you were able to locate the KW spring travel range?
There was (is?) a pdf spreadsheet on their web site.
Interesting. I'll look again , post link or pm if it's still up please! Appreciate it!
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      01-30-2019, 10:42 PM   #145
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Thank you Slicer for the write up. Doing this for the e46.
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      03-09-2019, 01:20 PM   #146
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Thanks for everyone doing the work to find what shorter springs are available and confirming what works. It made my decision to get the clubsports and run wide front wheels easy. This my first coilover.

It looks like there are a couple of ways to replace the springs, but the camber adjustment plates with the 4 torx bolts definitely need to be removed first. Are you guys using wrenches and sockets on the strut nut, or are you running the strut nut off with an impact? I like impacts, but prefer to use hand tools...I think I just answered my own question....
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      03-09-2019, 01:23 PM   #147
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Double post woopsies....

Last edited by chalbe; 03-20-2019 at 12:36 PM..
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      03-10-2019, 01:45 PM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chalbe View Post
It looks like there are a couple of ways to replace the springs, but the camber adjustment plates with the 4 torx bolts definitely need to be removed first. Are you guys using wrenches and sockets on the strut nut, or are you running the strut nut off with an impact? I like impacts, but prefer to use hand tools...I think I just answered my own question....
I figured something out; here's what I am doing. Break the nuts and bolts loose with an impact and run the top nut off. Reinstall with hand tools, and torque to spec with a torque adapter on a torque wrench and a box end.....or whatever. For anyone that lost their manuals the torx bolts for the camber plates are 22 Nm (17 ft-lbs) and the top nut torque is in a boxed note on page 6 listing sizes M10, M12, M14, etc. The nut appears to me to be M14 and lists 50 Nm (37 ft-lbs).
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      03-20-2019, 06:54 AM   #149
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This is a quick follow up to my posts above. I did the spring swap. I used an impact to break the torx bolts and strut nut loose and I also ran those fasteners off with the impact. Reinstallation was as I posted above except I didn't have a torque adapter that was large enough for the 22mm strut nut. I used the boxed end of a combination wrench holding the strut shaft with a 10mm socket, and I guessed at torque. I am going to torque the torx bolts when I install the coilovers this weekend. I am using 18x10 SM-10 wheels with 275/35 RE-71. I can post a pic of the clearance if anyone wants to see it.
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      04-06-2019, 03:49 PM   #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chalbe View Post
This is a quick follow up to my posts above. I did the spring swap. I used an impact to break the torx bolts and strut nut loose and I also ran those fasteners off with the impact. Reinstallation was as I posted above except I didn't have a torque adapter that was large enough for the 22mm strut nut. I used the boxed end of a combination wrench holding the strut shaft with a 10mm socket, and I guessed at torque. I am going to torque the torx bolts when I install the coilovers this weekend. I am using 18x10 SM-10 wheels with 275/35 RE-71. I can post a pic of the clearance if anyone wants to see it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chalbe View Post
This is a quick follow up to my posts above. I did the spring swap. I used an impact to break the torx bolts and strut nut loose and I also ran those fasteners off with the impact. Reinstallation was as I posted above except I didn't have a torque adapter that was large enough for the 22mm strut nut. I used the boxed end of a combination wrench holding the strut shaft with a 10mm socket, and I guessed at torque. I am going to torque the torx bolts when I install the coilovers this weekend. I am using 18x10 SM-10 wheels with 275/35 RE-71. I can post a pic of the clearance if anyone wants to see it.
Sure, post a pic. Would like to see how much play you have in terms of height adjustability.
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      04-08-2019, 07:43 PM   #151
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Sure, post a pic. Would like to see how much play you have in terms of height adjustability.
Sorry for the late reply. This is my first set of coilovers, and I have been pretty focused with setting ride height and alignment....I am learning. I haven't test fit the 18x10 wheels yet. My 219's with stock sized tires are almost at the top of the threaded adjustment collar. Since 275/35 is a shorter tire than 245/40 I am guessing they will probably clear and the car can go lower than it is currently. I will test fit the wheels this weekend and post a photo.
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      04-14-2019, 04:04 PM   #152
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This is a follow up to my above posts. The information I posted above about my stock wheel in relation to the adjuster collar was incorrect. I test fit the front wheel to verify if I could get enough clearance with shorter Eibach spring with the helper spring. Because of my ride height I am not able to get full clearance. The collar is above the sidewall of the tire, but right on the shoulder of the tire. The wheel is Apex SM-10 18x10 et25 with RE-71R in 275/35/18.

I know it seems like a little bit of a wasted effort, but that is mainly due to my ride height. Also, I feel that I was able to learn something and make a contribution to the information here. If you set the ride height a little lower than stock, say around ZCP height, there will likely be better clearance. I am between 16mm and 17mm lower than my stock saggy assed 90k mile suspension with flat hard rubber bushings.....so, I may be more like 20mm+ lower than stock.

Below I have posted photos without any spacers and with a 5mm spacer. I have signed up for autox the next two weekends and will be running the spacer.

....I know the lock nut on the adjustable end link needs tightened.

Without 5mm spacer


With 5mm spacer

Last edited by chalbe; 04-14-2019 at 04:06 PM.. Reason: correction
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      04-14-2019, 11:41 PM   #153
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I think you have sufficient clearance without a spacer based on those pictures.
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      04-15-2019, 08:12 PM   #154
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Thanks slicer, I appreciate it. It's tough for me to know what is good enough since this is a work-around. At this point I am more comfortable with the added clearance with the spacers. I will try both.
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