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      06-20-2019, 12:29 PM   #1
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Roofing

We have a 21 year old home with a typical FL barrel tile roof. Over the past few years weíve had a number of leaks repaired and are starting to think about a replacement. . One of the surprising aspects of the first estimate is the differential in roof sq. ft. vs. home total sq. ft. Apparently, the overhangs and roof shape / pitch add about 40% to the home total sq. ft. in our case. I expected a difference but was surprised at how much of a difference.

For anyone who has done this before, how did you get comfortable or self calculate the roof sq. ft.? Other than the obvious reference checks and getting multiple quotes, how did you get comfortable that the roofer you chose was competent?
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      06-20-2019, 12:35 PM   #2
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Geometry my friend, rise over run, slopes, etc. Or you could climb up there with a long tape measure from HD (100'+ for like $20) and do it the manual way.

If you have the architectural/engineering drawings you could use those to easily do the maths.
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      06-20-2019, 12:44 PM   #3
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On a typical 4 in 12 pitched gable end roof. Roof area is approx 25% more than floor area.
Thats taking into account a 2' overhang for soffits both sides

Having a multi pitched roof will add to this substantially.
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      06-20-2019, 12:52 PM   #4
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Steepness.
How cut up is it. ie, a lot of valleys.
High number of valleys equals more waste.

Your insurance carrier 'should' have the number of total squares, 10x10, in their records.

Fyi: Be wary of the really low and high bids. Too low means they will likely surprise you later. The really high bid means he really doesn't want the job unless he can high gross you.

What is under the tiles?
Old composite over decking?
Decking only?
Slats?
Peek in your attic...
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      06-20-2019, 01:24 PM   #5
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Here are a few pics of front, rear and attic (each taken right before Hurricane Irma), as well as a pic of a valley issue that needed repair this week. It gives and idea of whatís under the tiles - plywood with some type of membrane. House is 2,645 under air, 3,641 total incl. garage and covered patio / entry. First estimate has us just above 5,000 sq. ft. (or 50 squares) for roof.

I am weary of any roofing contractor because I am pretty ignorant on roofing. Iíve been trying to read up but itís a bit overwhelming... This is not going to be a find-the-lowest-cost-guy project. I donít want to do this more than once or be dealing with preventable issues a few years down the road. At the same time, just picking the highest quote guarantees nothing. I need to figure out how to educate myself enough to get comfortable with who we select and how they will do the job.

Good tip on insurance. Iíll check paperwork. I hesitate to call them right now in hurricane season because if they get the idea we are thinking about replacing the roof the fuckers might try to drop us. Insurance in FL sucks.
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      06-20-2019, 01:27 PM   #6
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Man, I bet you get ALL the local channels.


Sorry, I have nothing but poor humor to contribute, I'll show myself out
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      06-20-2019, 01:32 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
Man, I bet you get ALL the local channels.


Sorry, I have nothing but poor humor to contribute, I'll show myself out
Yeah we can actually pick up local channels as well as those in Miami, which is nice because every once in a while they have different football games. We don't really use the antenna much anymore though. Mostly DirecTV and streaming.
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      06-20-2019, 01:33 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickFLM4 View Post
Here are a few pics of front, rear and attic (each taken right before Hurricane Irma), as well as a pic of a valley issue that needed repair this week. It gives and idea of whatís under the tiles - plywood with some type of membrane. House is 2,645 under air, 3,641 total incl. garage and covered patio / entry. First estimate has us just above 5,000 sq. ft. (or 50 squares) for roof.
That actually sounds a little low. Our house is 2,100 sq. ft. and it uses 51 squares for the roof, but we have four peaks.
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      06-20-2019, 01:36 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Steepness.


Fyi: Be wary of the really low and high bids. Too low means they will likely surprise you later. The really high bid means he really doesn't want the job unless he can high gross you.
In project management I try to explain this to the accountants damn near every project. They never listen. More often than not, the cheapest quote will put you over budget.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickFLM4 View Post
Here are a few pics of front, rear and attic (each taken right before Hurricane Irma), as well as a pic of a valley issue that needed repair this week. It gives and idea of whatís under the tiles - plywood with some type of membrane. House is 2,645 under air, 3,641 total incl. garage and covered patio / entry. First estimate has us just above 5,000 sq. ft. (or 50 squares) for roof.

I am weary of any roofing contractor because I am pretty ignorant on roofing. Iíve been trying to read up but itís a bit overwhelming... This is not going to be a find-the-lowest-cost-guy project. I donít want to do this more than once or be dealing with preventable issues a few years down the road. At the same time, just picking the highest quote guarantees nothing. I need to figure out how to educate myself enough to get comfortable with who we select and how they will do the job.

Good tip on insurance. Iíll check paperwork. I hesitate to call them right now in hurricane season because if they get the idea we are thinking about replacing the roof the fuckers might try to drop us. Insurance in FL sucks.
Oh holy shit! You're going to want to have a pillow close by to bite.

Nice house btw!
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      06-20-2019, 01:36 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickFLM4 View Post
Here are a few pics of front, rear and attic (each taken right before Hurricane Irma), as well as a pic of a valley issue that needed repair this week. It gives and idea of what’s under the tiles - plywood with some type of membrane. House is 2,645 under air, 3,641 total incl. garage and covered patio / entry. First estimate has us just above 5,000 sq. ft. (or 50 squares) for roof.
That actually sounds a little low. Our house is 2,100 sq. ft. and it uses 51 squares for the roof, but we have four peaks.
Do you have a large covered patio area not included in the 2,100? Our covered patio area isn't that big.
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      06-20-2019, 01:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Now_Rudi View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Steepness.


Fyi: Be wary of the really low and high bids. Too low means they will likely surprise you later. The really high bid means he really doesn't want the job unless he can high gross you.
In project management I try to explain this to the accountants damn near every project. They never listen. More often than not, the cheapest quote will put you over budget.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickFLM4 View Post
Here are a few pics of front, rear and attic (each taken right before Hurricane Irma), as well as a pic of a valley issue that needed repair this week. It gives and idea of what’s under the tiles - plywood with some type of membrane. House is 2,645 under air, 3,641 total incl. garage and covered patio / entry. First estimate has us just above 5,000 sq. ft. (or 50 squares) for roof.

I am weary of any roofing contractor because I am pretty ignorant on roofing. I’ve been trying to read up but it’s a bit overwhelming... This is not going to be a find-the-lowest-cost-guy project. I don’t want to do this more than once or be dealing with preventable issues a few years down the road. At the same time, just picking the highest quote guarantees nothing. I need to figure out how to educate myself enough to get comfortable with who we select and how they will do the job.

Good tip on insurance. I’ll check paperwork. I hesitate to call them right now in hurricane season because if they get the idea we are thinking about replacing the roof the fuckers might try to drop us. Insurance in FL sucks.
Oh holy shit! You're going to want to have a pillow close by to bite.

Nice house btw!
Yeah first quote is $43K, which has an allowance for replacing some wood, but not all of it. So likely extra for more plywood and fascia that will inevitably be needed. That does not include removing and reinstalling the mosquito misting system or replacing gutters. Or fixing anything they accidentally break like light fixtures. Just first quote but was shocking considering I had $25K - $30K in my head somehow.

Numerous neighbors replaced roofs over past few years. I planning on talking to as many as I can.
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      06-20-2019, 01:42 PM   #12
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Rick,
Thats a 6 in 12 pitch and lotsa valleys etc. 40% more is fair for SQ/FT


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      06-20-2019, 01:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickFLM4 View Post
Yeah first quote is $43K, which has an allowance for replacing some wood, but not all of it. So likely extra for more plywood and fascia that will inevitably be needed. That does not include removing and reinstalling the mosquito misting system or replacing gutters. Or fixing anything they accidentally break like light fixtures. Just first quote but was shocking considering I had $25K - $30K in my head somehow.

Numerous neighbors replaced roofs over past few years. I planning on talking to as many as I can.
$43K for only the roof and doesn't cover damages? That seems high and odd. Don't get me wrong I deal primarily with industrial type projects and I'm learning about the costs of home ownership as I go. I have a friend that does residential remodels. A guy that works for him is notorious for accidentally bumping into expensive things and breaking them. His insurance covers him mostly. I would imagine they would be required to posses the same to cover any damages. I need to replace my roof in the next few years. Keep us posted. You have me curious (and nervous) now.
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      06-20-2019, 01:49 PM   #14
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Do you have a large covered patio area not included in the 2,100? Our covered patio area isn't that big.
No - our deck is uncovered.
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      06-20-2019, 01:54 PM   #15
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43k for a roof?!?! holy sh!t. thank god for shingles. and living out of hurricane zone I guess.
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      06-20-2019, 01:56 PM   #16
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Calm down lol.

They can't make you sign their contract, even though they'll probably hound you if they're slow right now.

Ding ding ding on neighbors. If there cost was lower, relatively same size home, don't freak out. Materials are basically commodities. Asphalt jumps the most but I'm guessing so do barrels. Decking bounces too. If they run into bad decking DO NOT LET THEM JUST COVER OVER. Having a few sheets in their order is peanuts. Don't let them convince you otherwise.

Fyi: Before seeing the house I guessed 40-50.
That shite is heavy and those guys have to get paid. Also have to take it all and unload at the dump...$ per pound.

I'm rusty but I think you'll want that old composition stripped off. Unnecessary weight and heat conductor.

All those ticky tac charges they mentioned sound squirrelly.

The sales rep should look you in the eye and you in turn trust he or she. If they give you the willys...think twice.

Get payment squared away BEFORE you sign. Some weasels will try and get start up payment, 1/3 usually, and then the balance immediately upon completion. You pay in full when completed, inspected by foreman and your yard is spotless.
If they can't afford materials and need start up monies...PASS.
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      06-20-2019, 02:09 PM   #17
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Definitely plan to talk to neighbors. We aren’t jumping into anything. It will either be this winter or next. Summer is a bad time to replace your roof here due to rain and storms. So we have time, although there is a long lead time to get the tiles.

When we have a significant repair, generally the plywood is cut out and replaced and that section is effectively new. So I was expecting ALL plywood and fascia to be replaced. I’ll find out how neighbors have seen it handled, but it seems odd to me to not replace it everywhere, other than in spots that were recently repaired and therefore the plywood is new.
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      06-20-2019, 02:11 PM   #18
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$18 gets you satellite pic measurement

https://www.eagleview.com/?from=adwo...BoC54AQAvD_BwE

More details costs more
Call em up, I'm a contractor, I use them

Notes: rule of thumb on payment schedule here in Massachusetts, no money up front, 1st 1/3 check when material is on site, 2nd 2/3 (remainder) after all work and cleanup is finished
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      06-20-2019, 02:14 PM   #19
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If the majority of the decking has not felt water, there's really no reason to replace it. It would be nice and comforting, but add another 2ish to 3 grand. Decking is spensive.
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      06-20-2019, 05:40 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Calm down lol.

They can't make you sign their contract, even though they'll probably hound you if they're slow right now.

Ding ding ding on neighbors. If there cost was lower, relatively same size home, don't freak out. Materials are basically commodities. Asphalt jumps the most but I'm guessing so do barrels. Decking bounces too. If they run into bad decking DO NOT LET THEM JUST COVER OVER. Having a few sheets in their order is peanuts. Don't let them convince you otherwise.

Fyi: Before seeing the house I guessed 40-50.
That shite is heavy and those guys have to get paid. Also have to take it all and unload at the dump...$ per pound.

I'm rusty but I think you'll want that old composition stripped off. Unnecessary weight and heat conductor.

All those ticky tac charges they mentioned sound squirrelly.

The sales rep should look you in the eye and you in turn trust he or she. If they give you the willys...think twice.

[Get payment squared away BEFORE you sign. Some weasels will try and get start up payment, 1/3 usually, and then the balance immediately upon completion. You pay in full when completed, inspected by foreman and your yard is spotless.
If they can't afford materials and need start up monies...PASS.

I've owned two contractor companies for 15 years now and if you aren't willing to put money down then I automatically assume YOU are the weasel. I can afford to float jobs and do all the time for regular clients but never for new. There are way too many scammers out there on both sides. I fully research clients before starting by checking county databases, saved me many times when you see multiple contractor liens against them. This all said some people pay their deposits with credit cards, most of the time they don't even clear before the job is done. This rule just saved me two weeks ago. Potential client kept ignoring the deposit requirements so I passed, county showed liens. I give current clients 30 days to pay.
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      06-20-2019, 05:55 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEfan508 View Post
$18 gets you satellite pic measurement

https://www.eagleview.com/?from=adwo...BoC54AQAvD_BwE

More details costs more
Call em up, I'm a contractor, I use them

Notes: rule of thumb on payment schedule here in Massachusetts, no money up front, 1st 1/3 check when material is on site, 2nd 2/3 (remainder) after all work and cleanup is finished
Thanks for that link. Pretty interesting report.
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      06-20-2019, 06:01 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Our03z4 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Calm down lol.

They can't make you sign their contract, even though they'll probably hound you if they're slow right now.

Ding ding ding on neighbors. If there cost was lower, relatively same size home, don't freak out. Materials are basically commodities. Asphalt jumps the most but I'm guessing so do barrels. Decking bounces too. If they run into bad decking DO NOT LET THEM JUST COVER OVER. Having a few sheets in their order is peanuts. Don't let them convince you otherwise.

Fyi: Before seeing the house I guessed 40-50.
That shite is heavy and those guys have to get paid. Also have to take it all and unload at the dump...$ per pound.

I'm rusty but I think you'll want that old composition stripped off. Unnecessary weight and heat conductor.

All those ticky tac charges they mentioned sound squirrelly.

The sales rep should look you in the eye and you in turn trust he or she. If they give you the willys...think twice.

[Get payment squared away BEFORE you sign. Some weasels will try and get start up payment, 1/3 usually, and then the balance immediately upon completion. You pay in full when completed, inspected by foreman and your yard is spotless.
If they can't afford materials and need start up monies...PASS.

I've owned two contractor companies for 15 years now and if you aren't willing to put money down then I automatically assume YOU are the weasel. I can afford to float jobs and do all the time for regular clients but never for new. There are way too many scammers out there on both sides. I fully research clients before starting by checking county databases, saved me many times when you see multiple contractor liens against them. This all said some people pay their deposits with credit cards, most of the time they don't even clear before the job is done. This rule just saved me two weeks ago. Potential client kept ignoring the deposit requirements so I passed, county showed liens. I give current clients 30 days to pay.
I've never asked for money upfront, 1st check I get is when my supplier delivers the material pallet on site, customer gives me the 1st 33% check, if the job is complex the progress payments are in 1/4's and so on

Check data base? No way, I see a customers face and I make the decision if I'm going to work for him/her lol, I'm not sears, I'm not looking for headaches

Doing this all my life, since before I could drive, I've had 1 job and 1 job only, people skills is a good part of it

To OP, when you hire someone be smart, first check references (visually) ask if they've done work around you, Trust your gut, plan B is go to a supply house near, hangout for an hour, talk to some customers (roofers) give them your details for a price, it's nice to get 3 bids minimum
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