S65 Glorious Sound Lacking with DCT?

[a5m]

God damn I must be the nth million guy posting a thread on this topic but hear me out. I tried searching for threads on this but couldn't find any, so gotta do a quick reality check to see if I'm making sense.

Looking to get a E90 M3 and initially wanted only a manual. Then watching vids of the DCT and it's quick shifts changed my mind. Also coming from driving a manual for 3 years I'm relieved by the prospect of not having to change gears.

But every time I watch an E90 video, especially one with a louder aftermarket exhaust (which I plan to get if not already on the car), I realize the manual sounds so much better. With the manual when you shift it allows the engine RPMs to drop, which is just as good a sound as revving out an engine. Then you grab the next gear and let the RPMs build up with that low end grunt sound of the S65 as it revs back up. For me at least that's a big part of the sound and it's missing in the DCT where it quickly grabs the next gear and is already high up in the revs.

Lexus took 10 years to make the LFA and intentionally gave it a slow shifting slush box in order to simulate a manual. I think they're thinking was similar to mine; the RPM drop and buildup is part of the enjoyment of a glorious engine and I feel I'll be missing that with a DCT. But everyone who "loves" manuals much prefer the DCT. So what gives?

Think I gotta go find one to drive...

[wyatth]

I've driven a handful of 6MT and DCT cars and can't really tell any audible difference between the two when banging out gears. I think it's the difference of videos (and why exhaust shopping via YouTube is tough) and not all that reflective of real life. but I don't know what you mean by "allowing the RPMs to drop, which is just as good a sound as revving out an engine." Regardless, I think DCT downshifts sound glorious and make DCT cars sound better than 6MT cars, speaking purely from a sound difference. Not that that's a metric for choosing your flavor of transmission, but since that's what you're asking.

[a5m]

I mean a manual is slower to shift, so the revs drop in between gears. I personally enjoy the sound of a motor winding down. Then the build up of revs in the next gear allows you to hear the S65's 'full range', and personally for me that's the biggest appeal of this car. Losing that makes me feel would defeat the purpose.

[leemik]

I owned both DCT and 6MT. The sound is the same. The DCT has an auto blip downshift which can be fun and sound great while the 6mt you have to blip it yourself.

[wyatth]

Originally Posted by a5m

I mean a manual is slower to shift, so the revs drop in between gears. I personally enjoy the sound of a motor winding down. Then the build up of revs in the next gear allows you to hear the S65's 'full range', and personally for me that's the biggest appeal of this car. Losing that makes me feel would defeat the purpose.

I get that, but to say it sounds better for it (let alone to the point of defeating the purpose of the car otherwise) is a very unusual take. Not sure I've ever heard anybody even talk about the sound of an engine winding down or dropping RPMs during a shift. If you like "full range" sound then just double shift the DCT, lol.

[GinTonic]

You can also let off the throttle when shifting DCT gears to get the effect you are talking about.

[a5m]

Originally Posted by wyatth

I get that, but to say it sounds better for it (let alone to the point of defeating the purpose of the car otherwise) is a very unusual take. Not sure I've ever heard anybody even talk about the sound of an engine winding down or dropping RPMs during a shift. If you like "full range" sound then just double shift the DCT, lol.

Well the wind down is half of it right, it's because you know the revs are about to climb back up. I find the S65 sounds best at lower RPMs. This is just missed with a DCT. Hope I'm not the only one who finds the sound characteristics better with a manual. I mean the main highlight of the S65 is sound right? People don't love it for the torque

Originally Posted by GinTonic

You can also let off the throttle when shifting DCT gears to get the effect you are talking about.

Ok interesting, thanks. I figured with how a DCT works this effect would be nullified. Will try and find a video of it, or just drive one try it myself.

[Brandoch]

Originally Posted by a5m

I find the S65 sounds best at lower RPMs

Are you trolling us?

[Oreo Cat]

Probably the dumbest thread i've ever seen on this site.

[amrazM]

manual has a better sound because you get the normal note of the engine operating, whether its an upshift or downshift, bringing the revs up with the clutch, etc. the dct has a big effect on engine speed, while it is unique you wont be trapped by the dct clunking along at low speed gear changes or searching for the right gear as I typically refer to it.

[Soden82]

Normally I would rev match my downshifts for spirited driving, unless your intentionally trying to slow down and downshift and letting the RPMs drop.

Every bmw I’ve owned before this one has been a stick but I find the S65 pairs so well with the DCT.

[Bucki14]

this has to be the dumbest thread I've ever stumbled into... I'm at a complete loss at wtf we are discussing

[amrazM]

Originally Posted by Bucki14

this has to be the dumbest thread I've ever stumbled into... I'm at a complete loss at wtf we are discussing

someone is voicing their opinion that a manual car sounds better than a dct, chill bro.

[VR1]

I understand what OP is saying. You can achieve what you're stating in the DCT if you let of the gas for a split second when changing gears, so this shouldn't be a concern imo.

Also what exhaust system did the M3 you drove have when you said the S65 sounds better at lower RPMs?

[DanMpower]

I had a guy who I used to commute with that owned an Auto G37, he would let off the gas every time he clicked the paddle shifter. I asked him why he did that and he said he "liked" the way the car sounded when it revved up through the RPM range. I always thought he wanted to make the world think he's driving a manual.

[a5m]

Thanks to all those who replied and understood where I'm coming from. Not always easy to convey one's thoughts in words but I think I got my point across. But those who didn't understand man, savage

Originally Posted by amrazM

manual has a better sound because you get the normal note of the engine operating, whether its an upshift or downshift, bringing the revs up with the clutch, etc. the dct has a big effect on engine speed, while it is unique you wont be trapped by the dct clunking along at low speed gear changes or searching for the right gear as I typically refer to it.

Thanks for the support

Yes exactly, you hear the full operating RPM range of the engine in a manual. See the benefits you mention of the DCT are what's making me consider it. Seeing how so many coming from manuals love it and actually prefer it. Speaks volumes.

Originally Posted by VR1

I understand what OP is saying. You can achieve what you're stating in the DCT if you let of the gas for a split second when changing gears, so this shouldn't be a concern imo.

Also what exhaust system did the M3 you drove have when you said the S65 sounds better at lower RPMs?

Yes somebody else mentioned the same thing, which I thought wouldn't really work in a DCT. Will have to drive one now to see for myself but this is great news. The convenience and everything else that comes with it makes DCT a viable option.

I haven't driven an E9x M3 yet. Again, suck at writing but I meant the low RPM growl of the S65 sounds so much more intoxicating to me than the super high RPM redline scream. Not that that's bad in any way. Just love me some short shifted V8 symphony.

[Brandoch]

Go drive one................

[TheMechanic]

Nothing beats a good manual shifter and trying to heel and toe ,downshifting from 3rd to 2nd on a tight track... especially when you get it right. Nothing. noise be damned. But I am old, what do I know.

[Drv4fun]

Originally Posted by a5m

Thanks to all those who replied and understood where I'm coming from. Not always easy to convey one's thoughts in words but I think I got my point across. But those who didn't understand man, savage


Thanks for the support

Yes exactly, you hear the full operating RPM range of the engine in a manual. See the benefits you mention of the DCT are what's making me consider it. Seeing how so many coming from manuals love it and actually prefer it. Speaks volumes.



Yes somebody else mentioned the same thing, which I thought wouldn't really work in a DCT. Will have to drive one now to see for myself but this is great news. The convenience and everything else that comes with it makes DCT a viable option.

I haven't driven an E9x M3 yet. Again, suck at writing but I meant the low RPM growl of the S65 sounds so much more intoxicating to me than the super high RPM redline scream. Not that that's bad in any way. Just love me some short shifted V8 symphony.

Well if you haven’t driven one (man or m-dct) then are you taking about the sound as it drives by, and if so how do you know if it was man or m-dct?
M-dct shifts quickly into higher gears at low drive logic and very little throttle barely making it past 1500rpm on each gear, something more difficult on a manual.
Starts out in 2nd one drive logic 1.
Also ever car is slightly different. Each “learns” or adapts to the driver. So if you don’t know how to drive the computer compensates. This is more apparent on automatic transmission bmws as the adaption of the transmission is more noticeable. Consider a 135i n54, two keys, two drivers with very different driving habits/styles (one very easy and light on the throttle the other aggressive and always over estimating pedal position etc). Now give the two keys to a new driver and he will report its two different cars based on the key. One very responsive one dull.

[Helmsman]

That thump when changing up, and rev match on the way down... even from sound perspective DCT can't be beated.

[neilum]

The DCT shifts into the next gear and the revs drop in the same way because they both have ratios. Why would one think only the manual drops revs as it shifts and the DCT doesn't is beyond me.

The transmission doesn't impact sound. I would argue the DCT sounds better because it has auto blip rev match downshifts that are 100% perfect every time and thus sound amazing. It is a very cool feature that allows you to go from 4,3,2,3, 4, 3,2 and so on. You can really play with all of the gears and get more out of it in this sense.

My TP/Corsa DCT was one the best sounding cars I've ever heard by the way. If it was manual it would have been the same but without all of the perfectly matched instant downshifts/blips.

[SunnyD]

Originally Posted by neilum

The DCT shifts into the next gear and the revs drop in the same way because they both have ratios. Why would one think only the manual drops revs as it shifts and the DCT doesn't is beyond me.

While it's true they both have ratios, the reason why the manual's revs "drop" is because when you clutch in to change gears, the revs drop and head down to idle before you engage the next gear. In the DCT, the changes are so instantaneous that you don't get the same drop in the revs.