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01-27-2010, 10:07 AM | #89 | |
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01-27-2010, 11:06 AM | #91 |
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Personally, I think the headlights of the 335is look bloated and too much
1 series-ish and I'm not sure if I'm feelin' the gloss black kidney ring with the chrome verticle vents. The rear bumper and apron look way too busy and the wheels aren't nearly as nice as the 220M 19" wheels, IMO. As for the motor and set up? I think this is BMW's way of introducing the F30 M3 with its TTV6. Considering that the 335i is losing a turbo and the 335is is keeping the pair (and configuring them ala X5/6 M), then this makes sense.
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01-27-2010, 11:14 AM | #92 | |
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And it's still more than a few more years. The 08's didn't appear till 08', so I don't expect to see the 2014 M3 till 2014, which means 4 more years of enjoying our M3's.
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01-27-2010, 11:33 AM | #93 | |
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01-27-2010, 02:00 PM | #94 |
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335's are great cars... but...
It doesn't have the V8 and the official name of "M3." Just like Corvette offers the Grand Sport but you still have the Z06! It's nothing like natural V8 power!!! |
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01-27-2010, 04:39 PM | #95 |
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This is exactly what I've been "preaching" on here for the last two weeks. If I wanted an M3, I would have bought one but the E90 LCI 335i that I just bought yesterday fits me much more appropriately for what I want/need out of a daily driver at this point.
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01-27-2010, 06:44 PM | #97 | |
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Yeah, I went with an '09 sedan. Looking for a set of wheels for it now and then off to GIAC for a "tune". I really thought this out (for once) and just realized I'm not going to utilize full abilities of the M3 (which I love....save for the hump ---- still not 100% sold on yet). The 335i gives a good bit more TQ (especially when GIAC is done with it), better gas mileage, and better ride for something I'm just not going to track. Contrary to what many in this M3 section here will say, it had NOTHING to do with cost and EVERYTHING to do with use and practicality. |
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01-27-2010, 07:53 PM | #98 |
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Setting the Record Straight
Well....at least "my" record.
I've owned at least one BMW for the last 15 years. In the last 5 years, I have owned the following: 2008 750i Sport 2007 550 Sport 2007 335 Sport 2008 535 Sport 2008 135 Sport 2009 335xi Sport 2006 330 Sport 2009 X5 4.8 Sport Currently, in my family we have the following: Son #1 2006 330 Sport Son #2 2009 335ix Sport Wife 2008 135i vert Me 2009 M3 (** just got it three weeks ago!) So, I have driven all manner of BMWs over the years. But...I have never owned or leased an M3. This all changed in December of 2009, when I accidentally fell on a silverstone e90 M3 sitting on the showroom floor with no one to love it! 6 months it had sat. With a deal I couldn't pass up, I am no one very happy owner!! I just hit the 1200 mile mark, and she is in the shop getting the fluid treatment. Regrettably, mine was the third M3 of the day to get a fluid change and the last remaining oil filter was broken!! Blah! So I have to wait until tomorrow to get her back!! Anyway, on to my point of the post. After 1200 miles and 4 weeks in the M, this is what I have discovered. IT IS INCREDIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!! One can talk all day about what BMs various cars look like in pictures and on paper....but no BMW drives like an M, period. A 335 is a 335. What makes my car so awesome is the steering, handling, power, engine response, exhaust tuning and looks. One of the most amazing things about this car is the throttle and engine response in Sport Plus of the M settings. I have the 6 speed, and when I blip the throttle for a double clutch action, the engine speed just rips so fast it is quite unbelievable. I really don't understand how this car can be so fast and feel so fast with only 295ft lbs of torque. I'm no engineer, but this car rips my old 2007 335 that I thought was fast. And when I drive our 335ix just after the M3, if feels r e a l l y s l o w and unresponsive in comparison. The sound of the engine alone is incomparable. The exhaust tuning is much more aggressive than the stock 335, and the sound of the V8, is...well, incomparable to the straight 6. Need I go on? The M3 has blown me away and it has far exceeded my expectations. When I see a post about an M3 vs 335 comparison, I just laugh inside now. Now, that is not to say that the 335 is a poor car. It is an awesome car. But I don't care what you the owner, or BMW does to the 335 to make it more 'sporty'. It's no M3! And I'm happy that BMW is proud to retain that distinction! I think that they are proud of their M3 as well!!
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01-27-2010, 08:26 PM | #99 |
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It's called force. Engine torque is nothing without the added benefit of the gearbox and rear diff which multiply that torque and deposit it to the ground in the form of acceleration. Most think they feel the engine torque. Well they do but not alone. Really they feel the entire force being generated by the engine (torque) combined with the gearing. The force generated by the M3 is far more than the 335i and more than erases the weight penalty of the M3. Comparing engine torque car to car is meaningless without consideration to gearing. Force explains acceleration when weight (mass) is considered. Torque alone explains nothing in terms of acceleration.
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01-27-2010, 09:24 PM | #100 |
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Cool...okay so what is different about the M3 gearing, specifically, when compared to the 335, that puts more power to the ground?
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01-27-2010, 09:43 PM | #101 | |
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Force is (engine torque x gearbox gear ratio x axle ratio) / tire radius Acceleration is Force / mass And don't think of torque peak. Peak also means little. Torque and force vary by rpm and gearbox gear. But rather than measure each rpm, measure increments usually at 500 rpm increments. When you multiple the torque output at a given rpm increment and gearbox ratio x axle ratio (rear diff) and divide by tire radius you get the force at that rpm in that gearbox gear. Long story short is the M3 is producing far more force at the same rpm increments than the 335i (regardless of gearbox gear). The force is roughly the same until 2,500 rpms then the M3's force increases measurably more comparatively as rpms increase. At higher rpms the difference is significant...more than enough to make up for the mass difference. Thus the M3's chosen gear ratios combined with a very flat torque curve work together to produce significant force and subsequently strong acceleration...measurably more so than the 335i does with its different gear ratios and engine torque curve (power delivery) characteristics which is biased to lower and mid rpms.
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01-27-2010, 10:14 PM | #102 |
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K, now I get it...very cool..thanks!
The actual seat-of-the-pants translation is real, that's for sure!
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01-28-2010, 01:49 AM | #103 | |
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That was exactly what I felt after driving an E92 M3...the 335i felt so slow and unresponsive after that...I needed to trade it in for the M3. Sorry 335i guys, but you don't know what you are missing.
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01-28-2010, 06:03 AM | #104 |
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Heres something to consider why the M3 holds the crown and can never be overthrown from its throne
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M3 With quotes like: Critical Reception: The M3 has received nearly unanimous critical acclaim from motoring journalists for its performance, refinement, and practicality. It is the only car on Seven Car Garage to receive 100% positive reviews.[23] Ezra Dyer of Automobile Magazine once suggested that "...car magazines generally regard the M3 the same way a four-year-old regards Santa Claus."[24] Check this review from SEVENCARGARAGE with multiple links to the M3 from various auto journalists. http://www.sevencargarage.com/Vehicl...rs/bmw-m3-2009 Long term Road Test: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...term_road_test Performance Figures How does the 335i/335is beat the M3, why would current M3 owners be pissed? If anything they should be proud for what an exotic (although not being used in the right context ) i.e. exquisite piece of automotive engineering perfection the m3 really is http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezfl...bf11b014b4.pdf Track Data and Comments http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezfl...8335e6f855.pdf http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezfl...a829b7bd11.pdf I am a current subscriber of Car and Driver and look what DAVE VANDERWERP one of the experts testing the M3 wrote in that same long term m3 test article (I can scan that page and post it for those who want to see it ) "..I've long said that the Ferrari F430 is my favourite car, but after 13 days in the M3, I'm not sure the Ferrari is any better at delivering driving thrills - even without any "for the price" caveats..." This really made my day when I received the magazine ,I mean to compare a BMW M3 and Ferrari 430 in the same sentence was priceless For those of you wondering its the FEB 2010 version of Car and Driver, where they have the lightning lap and the first drive of the 458 italia Now despite all these articles and automotive praise for the M3, here are some videos for those ignorant people who still dont see the light FOR E93 335i vert OWNERS: heres something to think about http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test Car and Driver's Comparison's Test with exotics : [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/j9k5Lo_ja_w&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/j9k5Lo_ja_w&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b] [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/RaYKSd6q6ps&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/RaYKSd6q6ps&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b] Track videos with its competition: Race ISF vs C63 vs M3 vs 350GT [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/clAR90E5cVI&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/clAR90E5cVI&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b] TOPGEAR BMW M3 vs C63 vs Audi RS4 [u2b]<object width="480" height="295"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/DaZExdTHHjY&hl=en_US&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/DaZExdTHHjY&hl=en_US&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="480" height="295" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>[/u2b] Fifth Gear's BMW M3 vs C63 [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/CCg5iMKAc0Y&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/CCg5iMKAc0Y&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b] Topgears BMW M3 E90 vs Lexus ISF [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/clAR90E5cVI&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/clAR90E5cVI&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b] I mean frankly I can fill this whole forum with links and videos that praise the M3 as the ultimate sportscar, but I think it might tick the moderators But people hsve preferences, and my point is BMW is the one who makes both cars. They will not jeapordise there reputation and profitability by making a mistake like that, having a stock 335is outperforming a stock M3. So 335i owners should get this thought out of there heads, the M3 is constantly being compared to exotics as it already walks its immediate competition! What does that mean? I mean sure they all rave about mods mods, who gives a fuck? I can mod my M3 albeit being a little expensive but it would run circles around modded 335i/335is, for example PencilGeek's M3 I understand its not the perfect car, (I didnt just say that ) but its yet to be proven otherwise Last edited by M3 vert; 01-28-2010 at 06:14 AM.. |
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01-28-2010, 06:09 AM | #105 | |
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I am not bashing on the 335 owners, but just trying to show you guys the light, on why and what the m3 is and why it deserves the respect it gets etc. This current M3 received so much praise that the one-off special version (CSL) the M3 GTS got sold out even before it started production! Its not a status symbol in anyway as some have mentioned, because its not the most expensive BMW M or flagship of the entire BMW portfolio like the 760. Its a die-hard enthusiast's wettest dream |
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01-28-2010, 08:40 AM | #106 |
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Not pissed.
1. I don't like the look of the 335 coupe (M3 coupe looks fine) 2. If I was just looking for straight line performance I would have saved $5k and got a C63. 3. No 335is sedan I needed a sedan. I am, however, nervous they didn't make a 335is sedan if they are downgrading the sportiness of the sedan vis-a-vis the coupe as corporate policy (eg, no next gen M3 Sedan) I am unlikely to be enjoying a BMW as my next car. If I wanted a coupe I would have bought a used 911. 4. I love my car, and couldn't give a s*&t about what other people are driving around.
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01-28-2010, 10:59 AM | #107 |
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I am pissed only because it's snow and freezing and my amazing M3 sits in the garrage....can't wait for the spring
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01-28-2010, 11:04 AM | #108 |
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01-28-2010, 05:03 PM | #109 | |
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Last edited by alms21; 01-28-2010 at 05:39 PM.. |
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01-28-2010, 08:34 PM | #110 | |
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