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      03-30-2020, 10:04 AM   #1
olaf_aarts
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Recently bought, already big cost ...

Dear all,

Hope everyone is fine, safe and healthy!

Just checking weather normal or not. I have recently bought a beauty of an M3, 2008, manual, 119k km.

Right after the purchase I am faced with the following repairs:
- regular maintenance (car indicated it is required after 12k more km's).
- clutch replacement + they will refresh the oil as well.
- chain replacement.
- ignition coils and spark plugs.
- my friend has a repair shop and they put the car on the dyno, measurement: 402 bhp was considered normal seen the mileage and age of the car.

My reasoning now is that I think I am glad to have this all done to the car, eventhough it is an investment I did not really see coming yet as per the maintenance record. Bearing shells were replaced after ~100k km.

Who has been confronted with the same?

Regards,
Olaf Aarts
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      03-30-2020, 10:20 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olaf_aarts View Post
Dear all,

Hope everyone is fine, safe and healthy!

Just checking weather normal or not. I have recently bought a beauty of an M3, 2008, manual, 119k km.

Right after the purchase I am faced with the following repairs:
- regular maintenance (car indicated it is required after 12k more km's).
- clutch replacement + they will refresh the oil as well.
- chain replacement.
- ignition coils and spark plugs.
- my friend has a repair shop and they put the car on the dyno, measurement: 402 bhp was considered normal seen the mileage and age of the car.

My reasoning now is that I think I am glad to have this all done to the car, eventhough it is an investment I did not really see coming yet as per the maintenance record. Bearing shells were replaced after ~100k km.

Who has been confronted with the same?

Regards,
Olaf Aarts
Seems like a lot of stuff for a car with ~74k miles. Is the clutch slipping? Plugs need to be replaced ever ~30k miles, so that seems in line, but are you getting a code for bad coils? I wouldn't change the coils proactively. Also, why the timing chain replacement? I haven't heard of this being an issue, particularly at such low miles.

Seems like this could be a big money grab, but a bit more detail on your car would be helpful.
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      03-30-2020, 10:32 AM   #3
olaf_aarts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New2Roundel View Post
Seems like a lot of stuff for a car with ~74k miles. Is the clutch slipping? Plugs need to be replaced ever ~30k miles, so that seems in line, but are you getting a code for bad coils? I wouldn't change the coils proactively. Also, why the timing chain replacement? I haven't heard of this being an issue, particularly at such low miles.

Seems like this could be a big money grab, but a bit more detail on your car would be helpful.
The clutch under normal circumstances is behaving well though when e.g. reversing it sounds as if something is loose or not mounted properly in connection to the clutching. I have been told that the computer signals multiple bad coils indeed, the engine doesn't run 100% clean (would estimate it 85%) and by replacing spark plugs and coils it would be good again. The timing chain is making strange noises. The shop has done many BMW's to date.
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      03-30-2020, 11:13 AM   #4
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Timing chain?
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      03-30-2020, 11:17 AM   #5
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Its a 12 year old car. If you are picky and want to address the small issues you are experiencing, then yes, its going to cost you some money up front.

That being said, i have never heard of anybody replacing timing chain @ 74k miles. Are you sure its not just the timing chain tensioners that are located on the outside left and right of the engine?
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      03-30-2020, 11:25 AM   #6
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I would probably suggest getting a second opinion by another shop. Sounds like you already had the work done, but maybe next time try couple different mechanics so that you don't end up paying for unnecessary service.

Getting a cam chain changed on a sub 100k mile engine is fairly uncommon as is needing to replace all 8 ignition coils.

In any case, congrats on your new ride and hopefully this is the last time you had to take it in! Go drive it .
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      03-30-2020, 11:38 AM   #7
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Do your own oil, plugs, and coils. The clutch shouldn't be going unless it was abused and the chain? I agree a second opinion is warranted. I have to assume if you're pulling 400+ there can't be too many issues with ignition/timing so that all doesn't jive.
Patience and a good set of tools is all you need, and rod bearings 😉
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      03-30-2020, 03:24 PM   #8
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Just from my experience from buying cars, I don't buy use car that have more than 20-25K max. Anything less than 15K is what I usually look for. Too much variables, the higher the milage, the more problem you will most likely encounter.
Also, I don't buy corporate or rental cars either.
You saved money when you buy the car but long run is trouble, plus some mechanic might just quick fix or put some bandaid on the car so that it'll look good for the sales.
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      03-30-2020, 03:53 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olaf_aarts View Post
Dear all,

Hope everyone is fine, safe and healthy!

Just checking weather normal or not. I have recently bought a beauty of an M3, 2008, manual, 119k km.

Right after the purchase I am faced with the following repairs:
- regular maintenance (car indicated it is required after 12k more km's).
- clutch replacement + they will refresh the oil as well.
- chain replacement.
- ignition coils and spark plugs.
- my friend has a repair shop and they put the car on the dyno, measurement: 402 bhp was considered normal seen the mileage and age of the car.

My reasoning now is that I think I am glad to have this all done to the car, eventhough it is an investment I did not really see coming yet as per the maintenance record. Bearing shells were replaced after ~100k km.

Who has been confronted with the same?

Regards,
Olaf Aarts
Hi, and welcome to the forum and M3 ownership. In Europe owning an M3 is pretty much like having a Viper ACR as your daily driver in the US, so good job!

The clutch of the M3 is almost indestructible. It can take years of track use, can take 650hp supercharged every day... It is very unlikely it is worn unless it slips.
The M3 manual talks about 'clunks' being a normal part of operation. Unless you see something specifically wrong with the clutch, do not change it.

Spark plugs generally should be replaced. I do mine every 16k km just to be sure. However, there is no need to change the coils. I race an M3 with coils almost as old as yours and zero issues. If any of yours have failed it's due to a malfunction/fabrication error.

Timing chain... I hope this was a typo. You do not need to change your timing chain. The timing chain of the M3 is pretty much indestructible.
Besides, I would not trust the shop to time the engine correctly afterwards. Even if I burnt money to keep warm at night I still wouldn't EVER let someone change my timing chain.
Google timing chain failure E92 M3, this is simply not a problem with the S65.


It's interesting that after that list of complete horseshit your mechanic gave you they did not mention things that actually fail, like engine mounts, throttle actuators.
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      03-30-2020, 04:15 PM   #10
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You have two words that should be never be in the same paragraph.

Car and investment.

Yes itís normal.

These cars are not an investment. Be ready to pony up if you plan to keep it long. 👍 When I picked up mine also a 2008 I knew what I was going into, I replaced everything. Now itís mine to enjoy and kill it.

- clutch
- Rb and bolts
- thermostat
- exhaust leaks
- interior was trashed due to previous owner pet (interior cost more than engine parts!)
- sparks
- spark plug gaskets
- oil pan gasket
- transmission gaskets
- more gaskets I donít even remember
- engine mounts
- suspension components
- wheels
- random stupid mods

Iím about more than half the car purchase.
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      03-30-2020, 05:38 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richneerd View Post
You have two words that should be never be in the same paragraph.

Car and investment.

Yes itís normal.

These cars are not an investment. Be ready to pony up if you plan to keep it long. 👍 When I picked up mine also a 2008 I knew what I was going into, I replaced everything. Now itís mine to enjoy and kill it.

- clutch
- Rb and bolts
- thermostat
- exhaust leaks
- interior was trashed due to previous owner pet (interior cost more than engine parts!)
- sparks
- spark plug gaskets
- oil pan gasket
- transmission gaskets
- more gaskets I donít even remember
- engine mounts
- suspension components
- wheels
- random stupid mods

Iím about more than half the car purchase.
Car is depreciating as soon as you drive it off the lot so you're right car is not an investment. Is just a mode of transportation. The OP might be young and eager.
That's why he's stuck with all of the problems right after just buying the car.
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      03-30-2020, 05:43 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L1FHR View Post
Just from my experience from buying cars, I don't buy use car that have more than 20-25K max. Anything less than 15K is what I usually look for. Too much variables, the higher the milage, the more problem you will most likely encounter.
Also, I don't buy corporate or rental cars either.
You saved money when you buy the car but long run is trouble, plus some mechanic might just quick fix or put some bandaid on the car so that it'll look good for the sales.
I'm sure you understand there are a lot of people who can't financially get into a car like an M3 with low milage or a newer model year, right? Depreciation is a real thing that allows average people to drive a $80k car for low $20's or less. with all that the OP has mentioned im sure he's gonna have a solid ride now and not even touch what it would've cost to buy the same car 10 years ago. I'm financially fortunate but not everyone is and not everyone can afford or justify the cost of a car like this when it's slightly used.
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      03-30-2020, 07:22 PM   #13
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      03-30-2020, 07:31 PM   #14
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I've never heard of timing chain needing replacement.

The M3 makes a ton of mechanical noises, some of these are normal. If you've come from other cars, these noises may be disconcerting. But it's a good idea to check here if a particular noise is normal or not before changing stuff. For example, the M3 has a very clunky drive train, and that's normal.
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      03-30-2020, 07:40 PM   #15
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Definitely take it for a second opinion. Sounds like there's lots of stuff they're trying to upsell you on... Where are you located?
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      03-30-2020, 08:04 PM   #16
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The car doesnít need timing chains.

If anything it needs timing chain tensioners. (Which I even have a hard time believing)

My car has 173k miles. Still on original tensioners. And sounds very healthy.

Why does it need a clutch? Is it slipping or just making some noise? They all make noise.

Shops need work right now. So be careful.
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      03-31-2020, 09:29 AM   #17
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Just because you never heard of a bad timing chain doesn't make it not true or not possible. Sure it's not common but is it possible? Yes!
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      03-31-2020, 10:22 AM   #18
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The dyno rum is what confuses me. I can't see a 402 pull with timing issues. 🤔
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      03-31-2020, 12:32 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olaf_aarts View Post
The clutch under normal circumstances is behaving well though when e.g. reversing it sounds as if something is loose or not mounted properly in connection to the clutching. I have been told that the computer signals multiple bad coils indeed, the engine doesn't run 100% clean (would estimate it 85%) and by replacing spark plugs and coils it would be good again. The timing chain is making strange noises. The shop has done many BMW's to date.
As others have said, a second opinion is what's required here. Also, it's rare that all of your coils are going at once and since they're pretty reliable items on this car, I would just replace what's broken. Having written that, if there's no CEL, I don't you have a coil issue. Perhaps the PO replaced the coils and didn't clear out the code.
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      04-01-2020, 04:08 AM   #20
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I am also from the Netherlands, if you want you can contact me for more information.

2,5 years ago I buyed my m3 with 67.000km and driven it to 95.000km without any problem until now, it has prover very reliable!
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      04-01-2020, 06:26 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bpark1977 View Post
The dyno rum is what confuses me. I can't see a 402 pull with timing issues. 🤔
We donít know what kind of dyno. Probably one that extrapolates to crank hp.
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