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      01-06-2022, 11:00 PM   #23
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Also doing an E90 standalone + PDM re-wire...

evilspiritM3, curious if you've met with the Motec guys and how far you've gotten with the PDM30 install and allocating circuits, etc?

I'm doing the same Epic standalone configuration with the factory DME that it sounds like you're doing (also on an E90, ftw), but with the AiM PDM32 instead of the Motec. If you've gotten things working I've got a few questions that would save me some experimenting, as I'm trying to figure out how much of the car I can safely run through my PDM (120A max) and for the leftovers whether to just keep the stock fuse box with the JBE (the easy button) or replace with a smaller fuse block (lighter, less complex).

* Since without the JBE there's no D-CAN gateway, so did you just wire the PT-CAN directly into the OBDII port and did that get you full communication via INPA/ISTA with both the DME and DSC? Randy recalled it would at least get the DME, had to check on the DSC though.

* Are you actually able to run EVERYTHING through the 100A-rated PDM without overloading or did you have to move some circuits into a fuse block (e.g. the 30 and 40A DSC pump circuits)?

* Curious if you got things running if you could share some data on the actual continuous current draws on some of the motor circuits that are on the higher 20-30A fuses in the JB. e.g. do the throttle actuators and coils each actually need a continuous 30A available as its fused from the factory - meaning with the Motec you'd need multiple circuits for each - or is one of the 20A outputs sufficient and the fuses are oversized and/or just accounting for transient current demands?

Thanks!
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      01-12-2022, 05:48 PM   #24
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I decided to do competition school to get a wheel to wheel license, in this case with NASA. Did the 2 day comp school that NASA SoCal put on at Buttonwillow (25a CW). It's a mix of 8 20 minute sessions on track and a lot of time in the classroom going over rules, how to race, how to stay safe, some race strategy, and etiquette. There is also an exam at the end where you are required to get 100%.

The on track sessions were a mix of warm up, drills, and mock races. We did 3 wide around the track swapping positions each lap and leap frogging to simulate passing in the corners and being competitive and collaborative at the same time. We did a bunch of mock starts, which are pretty insane. There is nothing in DE that compares to 30 cars that are lined up close suddenly smashing the accelerator and then funneling into turn one. Complete chaos and massively fun. The last session was a full mock "race" where we put it all together.

I ended up passing and being recommended for a license. It's not automatic- sounded like about 40% of the class has a plan to improve and come back. I'll apply for my provisional license (8 races as a rookie) in the SoCal region. NASA SoCal put on a great event- safe and very credible. Glad to have this done. Highly recommend giving it a try if W2W is an interest.

Now I just need to get this car build finished . . .

[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/CS...hjc-S4vM=w2400[/IMG]
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      01-12-2022, 06:52 PM   #25
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Nice! I did the competition school put on by BMW CCA / BW and it was excellent. Only 10 students. 2 days, maybe 12 hours in class, ~5 hours on track. Pass rate was 50%.

Sadly my car is far from race ready (primarily cage), but going to try and use my rookie license for WRL events. I know the groups can provide reciprocity for licenses with appropriate references. That weekend highlighted one thing. W2W is addicting!

Super excited to continue watching your build.
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      01-13-2022, 10:00 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRLane View Post
Nice! I did the competition school put on by BMW CCA / BW and it was excellent. Only 10 students. 2 days, maybe 12 hours in class, ~5 hours on track. Pass rate was 50%.

Sadly my car is far from race ready (primarily cage), but going to try and use my rookie license for WRL events. I know the groups can provide reciprocity for licenses with appropriate references. That weekend highlighted one thing. W2W is addicting!

Super excited to continue watching your build.
50% pass rate is pretty serious, but definitely a good thing. It's sketchy enough when people are on top of their game out there.

Interested to hear about the WRL licensing transfer. I liked their format and how organized they were. The NASA SoCal instructor is also a chief instructor at the local BMWCCA chapter so I'll probably apply for the CCA license too.
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      01-13-2022, 10:29 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRLane View Post
Nice! I did the competition school put on by BMW CCA / BW and it was excellent. Only 10 students. 2 days, maybe 12 hours in class, ~5 hours on track. Pass rate was 50%.

Sadly my car is far from race ready (primarily cage), but going to try and use my rookie license for WRL events. I know the groups can provide reciprocity for licenses with appropriate references. That weekend highlighted one thing. W2W is addicting!

Super excited to continue watching your build.
50% pass rate is pretty serious, but definitely a good thing. It's sketchy enough when people are on top of their game out there.

Interested to hear about the WRL licensing transfer. I liked their format and how organized they were. The NASA SoCal instructor is also a chief instructor at the local BMWCCA chapter so I'll probably apply for the CCA license too.
Yeah, really was a stellar program. CCA doesn't have any W2W in this region so all the instructors were GT2/3 NASA guys but each student was paired up with an instructor on track. And basically, the instructors had to unanimously agree that they'd race with you to pass. So it's likely not a set % just the result of our class.

Also, because it's BW sponsored James approves a big one time discount on any parts needed for building a race car, plus they give and a BW jacket for free. Which makes the $600 entry fee really a killer deal.

NASA sprint racing isn't likely in my immediate budgetary plans. WRL is just so much more seat time for the $. A couple buddies (all from the class) intend to build back a previous e30 WRL car that's sitting around and just get W2W seat time. Least that's the plan!
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      01-19-2022, 08:41 PM   #28
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Update on body panels:

Doors are fully gutted and back on, as is the hood. Racing screen has been added to the front bumper and it's back on the car too. Making progress!

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      01-19-2022, 10:20 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
I decided to do competition school to get a wheel to wheel license, in this case with NASA. Did the 2 day comp school that NASA SoCal put on at Buttonwillow (25a CW). It's a mix of 8 20 minute sessions on track and a lot of time in the classroom going over rules, how to race, how to stay safe, some race strategy, and etiquette. There is also an exam at the end where you are required to get 100%.

The on track sessions were a mix of warm up, drills, and mock races. We did 3 wide around the track swapping positions each lap and leap frogging to simulate passing in the corners and being competitive and collaborative at the same time. We did a bunch of mock starts, which are pretty insane. There is nothing in DE that compares to 30 cars that are lined up close suddenly smashing the accelerator and then funneling into turn one. Complete chaos and massively fun. The last session was a full mock "race" where we put it all together.

I ended up passing and being recommended for a license. It's not automatic- sounded like about 40% of the class has a plan to improve and come back. I'll apply for my provisional license (8 races as a rookie) in the SoCal region. NASA SoCal put on a great event- safe and very credible. Glad to have this done. Highly recommend giving it a try if W2W is an interest.

Now I just need to get this car build finished . . .

[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/CS...hjc-S4vM=w2400[/IMG]
What car were you in? I did it as well
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      01-20-2022, 09:26 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shmelgy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
I decided to do competition school to get a wheel to wheel license, in this case with NASA. Did the 2 day comp school that NASA SoCal put on at Buttonwillow (25a CW). It's a mix of 8 20 minute sessions on track and a lot of time in the classroom going over rules, how to race, how to stay safe, some race strategy, and etiquette. There is also an exam at the end where you are required to get 100%.

The on track sessions were a mix of warm up, drills, and mock races. We did 3 wide around the track swapping positions each lap and leap frogging to simulate passing in the corners and being competitive and collaborative at the same time. We did a bunch of mock starts, which are pretty insane. There is nothing in DE that compares to 30 cars that are lined up close suddenly smashing the accelerator and then funneling into turn one. Complete chaos and massively fun. The last session was a full mock "race" where we put it all together.

I ended up passing and being recommended for a license. It's not automatic- sounded like about 40% of the class has a plan to improve and come back. I'll apply for my provisional license (8 races as a rookie) in the SoCal region. NASA SoCal put on a great event- safe and very credible. Glad to have this done. Highly recommend giving it a try if W2W is an interest.

Now I just need to get this car build finished . . .

[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/CS...hjc-S4vM=w2400[/IMG]
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      01-20-2022, 02:09 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shmelgy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
I decided to do competition school to get a wheel to wheel license, in this case with NASA. Did the 2 day comp school that NASA SoCal put on at Buttonwillow (25a CW). It's a mix of 8 20 minute sessions on track and a lot of time in the classroom going over rules, how to race, how to stay safe, some race strategy, and etiquette. There is also an exam at the end where you are required to get 100%.

The on track sessions were a mix of warm up, drills, and mock races. We did 3 wide around the track swapping positions each lap and leap frogging to simulate passing in the corners and being competitive and collaborative at the same time. We did a bunch of mock starts, which are pretty insane. There is nothing in DE that compares to 30 cars that are lined up close suddenly smashing the accelerator and then funneling into turn one. Complete chaos and massively fun. The last session was a full mock "race" where we put it all together.

I ended up passing and being recommended for a license. It's not automatic- sounded like about 40% of the class has a plan to improve and come back. I'll apply for my provisional license (8 races as a rookie) in the SoCal region. NASA SoCal put on a great event- safe and very credible. Glad to have this done. Highly recommend giving it a try if W2W is an interest.

Now I just need to get this car build finished . . .

[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/CS...hjc-S4vM=w2400[/IMG]
What car were you in? I did it as well
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Ahh nice. Maybe I'll see you out there once your car is done
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      02-07-2022, 07:02 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magus4286 View Post
evilspiritM3, curious if you've met with the Motec guys and how far you've gotten with the PDM30 install and allocating circuits, etc?

I'm doing the same Epic standalone configuration with the factory DME that it sounds like you're doing (also on an E90, ftw), but with the AiM PDM32 instead of the Motec. If you've gotten things working I've got a few questions that would save me some experimenting, as I'm trying to figure out how much of the car I can safely run through my PDM (120A max) and for the leftovers whether to just keep the stock fuse box with the JBE (the easy button) or replace with a smaller fuse block (lighter, less complex).

* Since without the JBE there's no D-CAN gateway, so did you just wire the PT-CAN directly into the OBDII port and did that get you full communication via INPA/ISTA with both the DME and DSC? Randy recalled it would at least get the DME, had to check on the DSC though.

* Are you actually able to run EVERYTHING through the 100A-rated PDM without overloading or did you have to move some circuits into a fuse block (e.g. the 30 and 40A DSC pump circuits)?

* Curious if you got things running if you could share some data on the actual continuous current draws on some of the motor circuits that are on the higher 20-30A fuses in the JB. e.g. do the throttle actuators and coils each actually need a continuous 30A available as its fused from the factory - meaning with the Motec you'd need multiple circuits for each - or is one of the 20A outputs sufficient and the fuses are oversized and/or just accounting for transient current demands?

Thanks!
Quote:
Originally Posted by magus4286 View Post
evilspiritM3, curious if you've met with the Motec guys and how far you've gotten with the PDM30 install and allocating circuits, etc?

I'm doing the same Epic standalone configuration with the factory DME that it sounds like you're doing (also on an E90, ftw), but with the AiM PDM32 instead of the Motec. If you've gotten things working I've got a few questions that would save me some experimenting, as I'm trying to figure out how much of the car I can safely run through my PDM (120A max) and for the leftovers whether to just keep the stock fuse box with the JBE (the easy button) or replace with a smaller fuse block (lighter, less complex).

* Since without the JBE there's no D-CAN gateway, so did you just wire the PT-CAN directly into the OBDII port and did that get you full communication via INPA/ISTA with both the DME and DSC? Randy recalled it would at least get the DME, had to check on the DSC though.

* Are you actually able to run EVERYTHING through the 100A-rated PDM without overloading or did you have to move some circuits into a fuse block (e.g. the 30 and 40A DSC pump circuits)?

* Curious if you got things running if you could share some data on the actual continuous current draws on some of the motor circuits that are on the higher 20-30A fuses in the JB. e.g. do the throttle actuators and coils each actually need a continuous 30A available as its fused from the factory - meaning with the Motec you'd need multiple circuits for each - or is one of the 20A outputs sufficient and the fuses are oversized and/or just accounting for transient current demands?

Thanks!
So I've got some of this figured out with help from Bimmerspeed.

The PDM30 should not get maxed out as the entire car should never see a combined 100A load. And all of the higher load modules/components don't draw current in line with their corresponding fuses. I don't have the data on that yet, but intend to gather standard and peak loads. Also the 20A MOTEC outputs can handle a higher peak current than 20A, but I don't expect that to occur- we will see what the actual loads end up being.

The ABS will be stand alone from the DME and we aren't using any of the DSC functions. That's been coded out of the DME. It will communicate via CAN with the DME and be powered direct from the PDM.

The OBD2 port will stay and we will wire up CAN and power to that for diagnostics and we expect to get full connection to ISTA.

I'll have more to share when Chris Brown is here next week and finalizes the blueprint and integration.
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      03-04-2022, 11:58 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
So I've got some of this figured out with help from Bimmerspeed.

The PDM30 should not get maxed out as the entire car should never see a combined 100A load. And all of the higher load modules/components don't draw current in line with their corresponding fuses. I don't have the data on that yet, but intend to gather standard and peak loads. Also the 20A MOTEC outputs can handle a higher peak current than 20A, but I don't expect that to occur- we will see what the actual loads end up being.

The ABS will be stand alone from the DME and we aren't using any of the DSC functions. That's been coded out of the DME. It will communicate via CAN with the DME and be powered direct from the PDM.

The OBD2 port will stay and we will wire up CAN and power to that for diagnostics and we expect to get full connection to ISTA.

I'll have more to share when Chris Brown is here next week and finalizes the blueprint and integration.
Good stuff! That is confidence inspiring.

Did a bunch of data collection with an amp clamp meter on some of the bigger circuits. For example the throttle actuators are on a 30A circuit and they did actually pull 22-24A, but only for the fraction of a second when they fully open and close the throttles (captured using a peak function on the meter), otherwise almost nothing. So the "inrush" rating for the power outputs is what will really matter most.

If you do get some continuous + peak inrush numbers on some of the bigger circuits, like the coils and DME 30A fused circuits, especially under heavy load (e.g. 8k RPM) I'd be interested in seeing those. On my PDM I only have 4x each of 35A (and these have other features that I need for other things) and 20A circuits, but 12 each of 15A and 10A. So anything that will actually be happy on those 15A outputs (which can handle 80A inrush) will be a big win.

Also confirmed for myself that re-wiring the OBDII port to the PTCAN directly still enabled full diagnostics from INPA and ISTA.

Did Randy code out the DSC settings? I figured that would have been a DSC unit coding thing not DME, but maybe the DME manages the defaults? I was just going to install a momentary button for DSC off, but having it off by default would be nice.
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      03-04-2022, 05:29 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magus4286 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
So I've got some of this figured out with help from Bimmerspeed.

The PDM30 should not get maxed out as the entire car should never see a combined 100A load. And all of the higher load modules/components don't draw current in line with their corresponding fuses. I don't have the data on that yet, but intend to gather standard and peak loads. Also the 20A MOTEC outputs can handle a higher peak current than 20A, but I don't expect that to occur- we will see what the actual loads end up being.

The ABS will be stand alone from the DME and we aren't using any of the DSC functions. That's been coded out of the DME. It will communicate via CAN with the DME and be powered direct from the PDM.

The OBD2 port will stay and we will wire up CAN and power to that for diagnostics and we expect to get full connection to ISTA.

I'll have more to share when Chris Brown is here next week and finalizes the blueprint and integration.
Good stuff! That is confidence inspiring.

Did a bunch of data collection with an amp clamp meter on some of the bigger circuits. For example the throttle actuators are on a 30A circuit and they did actually pull 22-24A, but only for the fraction of a second when they fully open and close the throttles (captured using a peak function on the meter), otherwise almost nothing. So the "inrush" rating for the power outputs is what will really matter most.

If you do get some continuous + peak inrush numbers on some of the bigger circuits, like the coils and DME 30A fused circuits, especially under heavy load (e.g. 8k RPM) I'd be interested in seeing those. On my PDM I only have 4x each of 35A (and these have other features that I need for other things) and 20A circuits, but 12 each of 15A and 10A. So anything that will actually be happy on those 15A outputs (which can handle 80A inrush) will be a big win.

Also confirmed for myself that re-wiring the OBDII port to the PTCAN directly still enabled full diagnostics from INPA and ISTA.

Did Randy code out the DSC settings? I figured that would have been a DSC unit coding thing not DME, but maybe the DME manages the defaults? I was just going to install a momentary button for DSC off, but having it off by default would be nice.
I think the DME has different maps (normal, M mode, etc) and tells the DSC how much to be ok with. So my expectation is that randy set it up so it tells the DSC that DSC is off as a default.

The big mystery to me is how much the instrument cluster was doing as a pass through to turn stuff on/off.

I am keeping the steering angle sensor and stalks and we may program some things that are on the keypad to the stalks and those buttons.

I should have more info by late March when we install, etc.
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      03-06-2022, 03:26 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
I think the DME has different maps (normal, M mode, etc) and tells the DSC how much to be ok with. So my expectation is that randy set it up so it tells the DSC that DSC is off as a default.

The big mystery to me is how much the instrument cluster was doing as a pass through to turn stuff on/off.

I am keeping the steering angle sensor and stalks and we may program some things that are on the keypad to the stalks and those buttons.

I should have more info by late March when we install, etc.
I discovered a lot about how the stalks function:

The wiper stalks communicate entirely over CAN (through FCAN to PTCAN to the JBE, really). Decoded those messages and will be using them to control my wipers. Can share if you are interested.

Cruise control also CAN, didn't spend time decoding those.

The turn signal stalk and BC button / rocker switch are actually variable resistance outputs, like a two-wire analog sensor, effectively. The stalk has separate output wires for each of: lift up(i.e. turn right), pull down (i.e. left), push/pull (i.e. brights), and BC/rocker. Those go to the FRM and cluster directly. It must be this way since each of those actions has more than two positions, so each wire has 3 or 4 resistance levels.
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      05-19-2022, 02:59 PM   #36
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Interior is coming together. Had a dash built for the Motec, keypad, and radio.

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      05-29-2022, 05:03 PM   #37
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From gtracingtires.com. These look to be in good shape for scrubs. 305/645/18

Where do you find the production date on these?

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      05-31-2022, 08:37 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilspiritM3 View Post
From gtracingtires.com. These look to be in good shape for scrubs. 305/645/18

Where do you find the production date on these?
Non-dot tires unfortunately don't get date codes. It's a bit of a gamble unless you have some idea on the series they ran in and when they got used. If they're in good shape tread wise they're probably fine if they've been stored properly. That set most likely came off a GT4 car in that size.
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#ladydriven Heavy-spec M3 // KW Clubsports // AA x-pipe // Gintani muffler // Macht-Schnell intake // Gintani tune // OMP Seats // Too Many Apex Wheels // Stoptech ST-60 // Cobalt Friction brake pads
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      11-19-2022, 08:57 AM   #39
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Custom fuel cell/bladder complete. 27 gallons. Dry break system in the rear quarter window panel will feed the tank. This is about as low as we could go without one of the FIA stock tank replacements, but those are silly $$.

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      11-20-2022, 11:24 PM   #40
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very clean build. i enjoy the pics, please keep posting.
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      02-21-2023, 07:02 PM   #41
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Some progress to report: Motec dash and PDM and harness is going in and fuel cell and pump layout is looking good.
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      10-27-2023, 02:29 PM   #42
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Some updates:
  • Motor starts and runs fine. Electronics, motorsport ABS, PDM, dash all seem to function and communicate properly.
  • Fuel system is built, and fire systems installed.
  • Electric fan installed
  • Cockpit starting to look right
  • Front windshield and rear windows in (polycarbonate)
  • Dry break coming along.
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      02-08-2024, 06:43 AM   #43
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Fuel system and cell are complete and the sheet metal is reinforced for the dry break system.

We are ready for some dyno tuning likely later on this month to dial in a TT3/ST3 tune and a max HP track day tune.
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      02-08-2024, 09:18 AM   #44
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