Finally got to drive an M4!

[Space Fox]

I've been wanting to experience the other side for myself since buying my e92 back in September. Luckily my buddy purchased a Mineral Grey M4 Competition pack shortly after.
We've talked about switching cars for a bit to experience and compare. Yesterday morning on some empty Tampa back roads we finally got around to it. I have read a fair amount about the F8x and know there is no shortage of strong opinions related to the two cars. I tried to ignore all of this as well as my bias toward my own car and form my own opinion of the M4, specifically the driving experience.

Sitting in the car the platform felt familiar (for obvious reasons). The seats are no doubt better and while certainly positioned lower I felt they still maintain the high seating position feel of the e9x. Upon starting the car the first thing I noticed was the Heads Up Display. Perhaps because it is right in front of my face. This is the first car I've driven with a HUD. I was surprised and impressed, it looks 3D like it's almost floating over the hood rather than reflecting off the windshield. Nice technology but I found it distracting, if I owned the car I would likely disable it.

The shift knob was the next touch point. Beautiful carbon fiber DCT shift knob. I was surprised to find the shifter felt like I was clicking an Xbox controller rather than controlling a transmission. It doesn't feel connected to anything. The e92s shifter, while still a DCT, feels mechanical in comparison to the F8x's. Something I was not expecting and hadn't read much about. You could say the same for the paddle shifters. While lighter and sleeker than the e9x's they share a similar 'clicking' controller feeling with nothing behind it.

Naturally once we got going the steering was next. I am aware that this was a transition to electric steering from the hydraulic steering of the e9x. I have also read about the generally more disconnected feel and would have to agree. You know the steering is electric immediately, significantly lighter and you feel the road noticeably less. I missed the weight and feel of the e9x rack immediately. It could be due to the more aggressive alignment on my e92 but the f82's turn in felt lazier, less willing to jump in to a corner if only by a small margin. Less direct in general. Once I started pushing the car it handled incredibly well, very planted and capable. I did notice on some of the corners the car felt a bit bigger and heavier than I would expect as the rear end of the car would like to lean and jaw as you feel the weight transfer. Again in fairness I would attribute a lot of this to alignment.

Sound. What sound? I told my buddy I wanted to follow him while he drove my e92 as I have had zero opportunity to hear the car from outside. I couldn't hear anything over the scream of the S65 and my exhaust set up in front. This made me love my car that much more as I smiled for my buddy listening to him wind out the S65 and bark downshifts. I could see him smiling and laughing through the rear view mirror. Meanwhile in the M4 it was hard to decipher what gear I was even in. An issue I've never had in the e92 as the motor tells you exactly where you are in the rev range. At this point I found the HUD to be more useful. I will say the turbos sound great. I used to drive a 335 and one of the best parts about that car was the sucking and whooshing sound of the turbos. It was nice to hear that noise again in the M4 although it did feel weird hearing that coming from an M car. This was with stock intake and no tune so I'm sure that sound only gets better with some help. I honestly struggled to hear anything resembling an exhaust note during my drive. Surprising but not disappointing as I'm not a fan of the turbo farts and raspy nature of the M4. Although it did make me realize what a large part of the driving experience the exhaust note is. I missed that immediately. This M4 came equipped with the sport exhaust. Again, my car being modified skews this comparison as I'm sure there are some great aftermarket exhaust systems out there for the M4.

Torque/Power Delivery. This was something I was looking forward to. I do miss the turbo pull from my old 335 at times. It's just a different, addicting feeling you can only get from forced induction. I also knew this was an area the M4 shined. In driving the car I did not feel that shine. The torque is certainly there. Low rpms are night and day when compared to the S65 but it was nothing that took my breath away. Maybe I was expecting too much. Partially my fault for the first quarter of the drive or so as I had to keep reminding myself how to properly drive a turbo car. That is to keep the power in the band between 3 and 6k. It only took me one trip to the high end of the rev range to feel the cars power nose dive and lurch forward. Served as a good reminder. It is funny to think about the power curve dying off right when the e92s starts to shine. Power delivery could not be more different. After some memory jogging I got the hang of it. 3rd and 4th gear at 3-4k show the most difference but still nothing that blew me away. Fun for sure but it felt like my JB4 335 pulled about the same or even more in all honesty. Part of it I'll attribute to the staged turbo delivery of the M4 which does a very good job at smoothing out turbo lag. This is the smallest amount of lag I have experienced on a turbo car. It is still there but well managed. Maybe I actually liked the lag of my 335? The experience of hearing the turbos spool up and the definitive boost of power. At this point I actually checked the settings to make sure I was in the most aggressive modes. A quick look at the dash confirmed that I was. At that moment I actually said out loud "This doesn't feel like an M car". Everything was softer and less engaging, less raw, less visceral, more electric, more disconnected.
I'm sure no revelation to most here.

I guess I could have written this long, opinionated review in one sentence - The entire time I wanted to get back in my car.

After our drive my buddy got out of the e92 literally hopping up and down laughing and smiling. I, on the other hand, quickly had to find something positive to share with him about the power delivery or the torque or turbo sounds or something else regurgitated from an auto article I had read in the past.

I did not intend to write yet another review chastising the M4 for known quantities. I really did want to like the car and give it a fair shot. After my experience my appreciation for the e9x platform has only grown. I have scheduled my rod bearing appointment for next week so I can preserve and enjoy that special experience worry free for years to come.

Cheers!

[akkando]

Interesting about the DCT. I own an m2 and e90 m3 and don't notice much of a different in tactile feel with the paddles or dct shift lever. However the shifts on the newer m2 feel much crisper. This could be age and wear and tear related.

[Redd]

Thanks for that detailed write up. It confirms my thoughts if wanting to keep my M3 forever as there will never be another wailing high RPM V8 in a practical German body ever again.

I think BMW tried too much to make the F8x generation power delivery to be more NA-like. Unfortunately, it never had the smoothness and high rpm power band of a real NA, and at the same time lost the shove in the ass feeling of a turbo car. Look at AMG's current crop of turbo engines. Screw lag reduction. Plonk in a stonking big turbo, who cares if it lags. When that power hits you'll be holding on for dear life.

I'd also be keen to hear your buddy's review of your M3 tho, especially coming from the viewpoint of an M3 owner.

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by akkando

Interesting about the DCT. I own an m2 and e90 m3 and don't notice much of a different in tactile feel with the paddles or dct shift lever. However the shifts on the newer m2 feel much crisper. This could be age and wear and tear related.

As far as the shift speed the two felt identical. I have the GTS tune which does sharpen the e9x DCT a bit but as far as I could tell there was no functional difference between the two transmissions, only tactile in my experience.

Originally Posted by Redd

Thanks for that detailed write up. It confirms my thoughts if wanting to keep my M3 forever as there will never be another wailing high RPM V8 in a practical German body ever again.

I think BMW tried too much to make the F8x generation power delivery to be more NA-like. Unfortunately, it never had the smoothness and high rpm power band of a real NA, and at the same time lost the shove in the ass feeling of a turbo car. Look at AMG's current crop of turbo engines. Screw lag reduction. Plonk in a stonking big turbo, who cares if it lags. When that power hits you'll be holding on for dear life.

I'd also be keen to hear your buddy's review of your M3 tho, especially coming from the viewpoint of an M3 owner.

I think you hit the nail on the head. I will be keeping mine for a long time.

I'll see if I can get a review out of him but he's not as passionate about the brand as I. I think his overall giddy nature after the drive spoke volumes.

[New2Roundel]

Originally Posted by Redd

I think BMW tried too much to make the F8x generation power delivery to be more NA-like. Unfortunately, it never had the smoothness and high rpm power band of a real NA, and at the same time lost the shove in the ass feeling of a turbo car.

I think the S58 will be more to your liking as peak torque starts 250 rpms higher and falls off 720 rpms higher than the S55.

[BRNDNSLVRA]

The F8X has no soul. The E9X was the last real M car BMW ever made.

[antonyl]

I own both a 2013 6mt e92 and an M3 CS,
I do agree that it takes awhile to acclimatise to the s55, as in where you are in the rev range. However, the sharpness of the f80 is far superior with a quicker turn in to corners with less body roll.
I still enjoy the e92 for what it is, a high reving car that needs to be pushed to truely enjoy its potential, however the f80 is a much more capable car overall.

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by antonyl

I own both a 2013 6mt e92 and an M3 CS,
I do agree that it takes awhile to acclimatise to the s55, as in where you are in the rev range. However, the sharpness of the f80 is far superior with a quicker turn in to corners with less body roll.
I still enjoy the e92 for what it is, a high reving car that needs to be pushed to truely enjoy its potential, however the f80 is a much more capable car overall.

I appreciate your perspective as you have far more seat time in the F8x than do I. I just could not find the excitement of it. It did not make me grin and laugh the way the e9x does.

[14_deltaM3]

Capability is a double edged sword when it comes to fun.

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by 14_deltaM3

Capability is a double edged sword when it comes to fun.

That's deep

[pbonsalb]

Capability of driver must match capability of car, but that is actually pretty rare with high performance cars.

[14_deltaM3]

Originally Posted by brantp

That's deep

I love philosophizing

[BayE30]

i had the pleasure of driving a 600hp m4 for a couple days. Initially i was shocked by the power, and had fun playing with burble on the car. But after the initial fun wore off, i found the car to be bland and disconnected. I was very happy to get back into my e90m3 after playing with the m4, and proved that for me, i made the correct choice in cars.

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by BayE30

i had the pleasure of driving a 600hp m4 for a couple days. Initially i was shocked by the power, and had fun playing with burble on the car. But after the initial fun wore off, i found the car to be bland and disconnected. I was very happy to get back into my e90m3 after playing with the m4, and proved that for me, i made the correct choice in cars.

My experience was similar albeit with much less power. I personally can't stand the burble on the M4 or any other of the new turbo cars.

[Ratedm3]

Not a fan of the new chassis

[BimmerMan33]

Currently own & regularly track an e92 M3, drove f82 M4 for 3 days, city driving & canyons.
In my opinion, M4 is clearly more fun when driving aggressively in the canyons but felt like a louder 335i when city driving/commuting. M4 would definitely be more fun & faster on the race track too.
The e92 M3 feels balanced on the track & the engine feels special as you rev to 8300 rpm. Daily driving, the e9x still feels that you are driving something special, it has more feel than the F8x cars.
Going from e30 —> F8x, cars have been losing feel but becoming faster.
Even older generation AMGs have more feel than current ones...

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by BimmerMan33

Currently own & regularly track an e92 M3, drove f82 M4 for 3 days, city driving & canyons.
In my opinion, M4 is clearly more fun when driving aggressively in the canyons but felt like a louder 335i when city driving/commuting. M4 would definitely be more fun & faster on the race track too.
The e92 M3 feels balanced on the track & the engine feels special as you rev to 8300 rpm. Daily driving, the e9x still feels that you are driving something special, it has more feel than the F8x cars.
Going from e30 —> F8x, cars have been losing feel but becoming faster.

Losing feel but becoming faster is a good way to put it. I think the M4 finally tipped the scale a bit too much in the loss of feel category and in my opinion the additional speed doesn't make up for it. I actually enjoyed my old 335i more than I did the M4.

[14_deltaM3]

This is the problem with BMW, Porsche, Ferrari etc. They need to simplify the cars and disregard incremental improvements in performance. Or at least offer a line of cars that don’t chase power and performance at the cost of engagement. Porsche is guilty of this, but have begun to remedy it with the new Cayman/Boxster GTS.

Theoretical lap times and 0-60 are great, but shouldn’t be the sole objective of the cars development.

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by 14_deltaM3

This is the problem with BMW, Porsche, Ferrari etc. They need to simplify the cars and disregard incremental improvements in performance. Or at least offer a line of cars that don’t chase power and performance at the cost of engagement. Porsche is guilty of this, but have begun to remedy it with the new Cayman/Boxster GTS.

Theoretical lap times and 0-60 are great, but shouldn’t be the sole objective of the cars development.

I think it would be excellent if these manufacturers continued to produce a 'purist' line as you're suggesting pulling from the best driver elements of the past instead of chasing power, 0-60 times, and creature comforts.
I suppose the argument against is that the market for this could be questionable and a lot would just point and tell you to buy an old car.
I heard Chris Harris mention recently that he had conversations with Singer about developing a 'reimagined' e30 M3 line and a classic Range Rover line. Fun thought exercise to imagine what a Singer M3 would look like.

[14_deltaM3]

Originally Posted by Space Fox

I think it would be excellent if these manufacturers continued to produce a 'purist' line as you're suggesting pulling from the best driver elements of the past instead of chasing power, 0-60 times, and creature comforts.
I suppose the argument against is that the market for this could be questionable and a lot would just point and tell you to buy an old car.
I heard Chris Harris mention recently that he had conversations with Singer about developing a 'reimagined' e30 M3 line and a classic Range Rover line. Fun thought exercise to imagine what a Singer M3 would look like.

Agreed - market may be small. But if the purist line is engineered appropriately (minimize/simplify, a la alpine), cost should be lower.

That m3 will cost 100k+. But I bet it will be glorious. To me, the gold standard I aspire to is an Alfaholics....

[Blindside_137]

Completely agree. These cars could not be more different. My dad has a gorgeous Austin M4 6MT. When I drive it it certainly feels like a sports car, but the overall driving experience though is so dissimilar it's mind boggling. It sure is a beauty though, and I would love an F80 some day as a fun spirited daily driver. But man is my E90 a FUN car.

[Space Fox]

Originally Posted by Blindside_137

Completely agree. These cars could not be more different. My dad has a gorgeous Austin M4 6MT. When I drive it it certainly feels like a sports car, but the overall driving experience though is so dissimilar it's mind boggling. It sure is a beauty though, and I would love an F80 some day as a fun spirited daily driver. But man is my E90 a FUN car.

Oof love that color on your e90! Awesome shots. And damn your pops has some good taste! Beautiful car. It really is surprising how different the experience is. I just keep thinking of the drastically different reaction from my buddy and I when we each exited each others cars. He couldn't wipe the smile off his face.