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      05-18-2019, 01:53 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
Well if someone wrote a book to immigrate to the US or U.K. wasn't proof that this isn't propaganda then I don't know what is!

If this was created by Ukrainians or with the help of those that are still alive to tell the tale I could be a bit more sympathetic but it's not, it's meant to drum up drama and stereotypes.

Imagine if a US author wrote a book about how the moon landing was fake and then Russia did a movie on how the Americans faked the moon landing. You'd watch it and facepalm, but whatevs enjoy the fiction
Take a look at this:



I direct you to 36:00 and 38:26. The first one is an interview of the guy who was told to crawl under the reactor to see if ths corium had burned through. His words was he didn't volunteer and saying no was not an option. The second one was the interview of the army general in command of the liquidators. He was outraged by his command telling him to send soldiers in to clear out radioactive material.
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      05-18-2019, 02:35 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
Propaganda showing the Soviets would rather sacrifice lives if they could cover it up. This is bullsheet 101 right here. The fact is they didn't actually know how bad this was and were scrambling for experts to arrive onsite ASAP.

Plenty of dumb commentary about how the Soviet official didn't want the scientists to issue an evacuation order.

Layers and layers of propaganda.
I think youíre quite adept at manufacturing your own propaganda after reading your replies to this thread.
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      05-18-2019, 03:38 PM   #47
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Enjoy the propaganda and fiction not going to argue with you guys if you like the show
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      05-18-2019, 04:39 PM   #48
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I posted a video that's not tied to the show. Conveniently you have zero comments especially when I told you at what time markers to view interviews of two Russians who were there and were an integral part of the whole disaster response. I don't speak Russian so I have to assume the translations were spot on. But you can hear them speaking natively in Russian to verify if the translations were off. They were both clear from the translations that the Russian government couldn't give a damn about the lives being sent in to clean up the mess.

I think looking in the mirror is warranted for you.
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      05-18-2019, 05:10 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
I posted a video that's not tied to the show. Conveniently you have zero comments especially when I told you at what time markers to view interviews of two Russians who were there and were an integral part of the whole disaster response. I don't speak Russian so I have to assume the translations were spot on. But you can hear them speaking natively in Russian to verify if the translations were off. They were both clear from the translations that the Russian government couldn't give a damn about the lives being sent in to clean up the mess.

I think looking in the mirror is warranted for you.
I just watched the portion you referenced, yeah this native Russian. I'd have to watch that full documentary to see how I feel about it but the fact still stands, this HBO series is yet another Cold War propaganda piece disguised as "education" and "drama".

Trying to portray this whole thing as a cover up is pretty shameless. The whole world and everyone within the Soviet Union knew what happened within 48 hours...

Let's not throw stones. This isn't Nixon.
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      05-18-2019, 05:38 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
I just watched the portion you referenced, yeah this native Russian. I'd have to watch that full documentary to see how I feel about it but the fact still stands, this HBO series is yet another Cold War propaganda piece disguised as "education" and "drama".

Trying to portray this whole thing as a cover up is pretty shameless. The whole world and everyone within the Soviet Union knew what happened within 48 hours...

Let's not throw stones. This isn't Nixon.
I point you to 18:08 in the video. The Swedes were not notified about the situation. It took workers going into a nuclear facility setting off their screening detectors for entry before they knew what was going on. They had to figure out where the source of the radiation was coming from. Only till the Swedes confronted the Russian government did they finally come clean with the situation.
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      05-18-2019, 08:01 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
I point you to 18:08 in the video. The Swedes were not notified about the situation. It took workers going into a nuclear facility setting off their screening detectors for entry before they knew what was going on. They had to figure out where the source of the radiation was coming from. Only till the Swedes confronted the Russian government did they finally come clean with the situation.
48 hours after the incident, the world knew. Pretty sure they had bigger problems in the immediate aftermath than calling up the Swedes for a chat.

You also have to keep in mind that the heads of state had no idea what is really going on.

But yeah, they're trying to cover it up because in the first 5 minutes of the explosion the plant workers didn't start dialing everyone across the globe.

Propaganda at its finest.
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      05-18-2019, 08:12 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by The Libertine View Post
I think youíre quite adept at manufacturing your own propaganda after reading your replies to this thread.


North Koreans making a movie about the US. This is the equivalent of the Chernobyl show.
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      05-18-2019, 09:53 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
48 hours after the incident, the world knew. Pretty sure they had bigger problems in the immediate aftermath than calling up the Swedes for a chat.

You also have to keep in mind that the heads of state had no idea what is really going on.

But yeah, they're trying to cover it up because in the first 5 minutes of the explosion the plant workers didn't start dialing everyone across the globe.

Propaganda at its finest.
When you have a mess which impacts others such as radiation fall out, the prudent thing to do is to provide advanced warning. And the world only knew because the Swedes were turning up the heat on the Russian government for an explanation.

Propaganda.....you sure are adept at toeing the party line.....

Along the lines of the Russian government not giving a crap about lives because of trying to save face. I point to the Kursk.
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      05-19-2019, 12:38 AM   #54
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Totally LOLD when Dyatlov said "I'll go check it myself....*barf*"
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      05-19-2019, 07:11 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
I just watched the portion you referenced, yeah this native Russian. I'd have to watch that full documentary to see how I feel about it but the fact still stands, this HBO series is yet another Cold War propaganda piece disguised as "education" and "drama".

Trying to portray this whole thing as a cover up is pretty shameless. The whole world and everyone within the Soviet Union knew what happened within 48 hours...

Let's not throw stones. This isn't Nixon.
Nixon covered up some of his guys who stole some of the other party’s paperwork prior to an election, bad but nobody died it didn’t cause birth defects for many years after and he was forced out of office and men went to prison for what his admin did.

The Soviets on the other hand tried to coverup the worst nuclear accident in history, thousands died and likely more dying this day due to effects of U-235 and no one at the kremlin was held to task and punished.
Thousands of Russians including construction, scientists, engineers, workers, soldiers, politicians admitted the atrocities that occurred from the shody building of the plant, running of the plant, the test that caused the explosion, keeping the news of that explosion from the world hush and idiotic attempts to try to stop it and today the sarcophagus built to contain the beast is failing.
You are in a miniscule minority of Russians who have the gall to try to deny what history has proven fact. Nearly all Russians now admit what happened then and take responsibility. You speak like a Pravda editorial page, pure communist propaganda from the 50’s, so much so it’s laughable. The USSR is long gone, open your eyes and see what the word Pravda really means. Stand up, Be a man and take responsibility.


Comparing the crazy NK hermit kingdoms ridiculous fiction to the American/ British story of Chernobyl's factual history with thousands of actual Russians admitting it actually happened is both pathetic and comical.
I’ll say it again, research and read actual books accounting on what happened from thousands of those Russians who were there.

While you’re at it, check out books about the shooting down of KAL flight 007 from the same era of the Soviet Union and the coverup that was dreamed up by the boys in the kremlin. Even the pilot who pulled the trigger admitted the horror. So don’t even try to play holier then thou about the sanctity of the politburo in Moscow at the time. They were bad actors on the world stage and the fact that the govt utterly imploded and collapsed is evidence of that.
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      05-19-2019, 07:53 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by N54Yankee View Post
Nixon covered up some of his guys who stole some of the other partyís paperwork prior to an election, bad but nobody died it didnít cause birth defects for many years after and he was forced out of office for what his admin did.

The Soviets on the other hand tried to coverup the worst nuclear accident in history, thousands died and likely more dying this day due to effects of U-235 and no one at the kremlin was held to task and punished.
Thousands of Russians including construction, scientists, engineers, workers, soldiers, politicians admitted the atrocities that occurred from the shody building of the plant, running of the plant, the test that caused the explosion, keeping the news of that explosion from the world hush and idiotic attempts to try to stop it and today the sarcophagus built to contain the beast is failing.
You are in a miniscule minority of Russians who have the gall to try to deny what history has proven fact. Nearly all Russians now admit what happened then and take responsibility. You speak like a Pravda editorial page, pure communist propaganda from the 50ís, so much so itís laughable. The USSR is long gone, open your eyes and see what the word Pravda really means. Stand up, Be a man and take responsibility.


Comparing the crazy NK hermit kingdoms ridiculous fiction to the American/ British story of Chernobyl's factual history with thousands of actual Russians admitting it actually happened is both pathetic and comical.
Iíll say it again, research and read actual books accounting on what happened from thousands of those Russians who were there.

While youíre at it, check out books about the shooting down of KAL flight 007 from the same era of the Soviet Union and the coverup that was dreamed up by the boys in the kremlin. Even the pilot who pulled the trigger admitted the horror. So donít even try to play holier then thou about the sanctity of the politburo in Moscow at the time. They were bad actors on the world stage and the fact that the govt utterly imploded and collapsed is evidence of that.
One thing I want to correct in your post is the sarcophagus. There was a new one built which was just put into place recently from what I recall seeing. I don't know how much funding the Russian government put into the new sarcophagus project. But I can say confidently, at least the vast majority of the funding came from the international community to the tune of $1 billion.

Meanwhile, I don't recall the Japanese government taking in any international funding to clean up Fukushima.
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      05-19-2019, 08:35 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post


North Koreans making a movie about the US. This is the equivalent of the Chernobyl show.
What youíre ultimately suggesting is that the North Korean mindset of controlling everything its citizens watch and have access to, is analogous to an HBO miniseries? Wow, even if I suspend my disbelief at your reasoning still canít reach the same conclusion.

In America, citizens are free to watch what they want, think what they want, and draw their own conclusions. Conversely, in North Korea, the state ONLY shows what it WANTS itís citizens to see, and with content aimed precisely in the light most favorable to its government. North Koreans are told what to believe, and live in fear of severe consequences if thinking otherwise.
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      05-19-2019, 08:37 AM   #58
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Fellas, fellas...don't waste your precious time feeding the trolls. You should know better.
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      05-19-2019, 09:08 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
48 hours after the incident, the world knew. Pretty sure they had bigger problems in the immediate aftermath than calling up the Swedes for a chat.

You also have to keep in mind that the heads of state had no idea what is really going on.

But yeah, they're trying to cover it up because in the first 5 minutes of the explosion the plant workers didn't start dialing everyone across the globe.

Propaganda at its finest.
When you have a mess which impacts others such as radiation fall out, the prudent thing to do is to provide advanced warning. And the world only knew because the Swedes were turning up the heat on the Russian government for an explanation.

Propaganda.....you sure are adept at toeing the party line.....

Along the lines of the Russian government not giving a crap about lives because of trying to save face. I point to the Kursk.
Also see:
K-19 "Hiroshima"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet...19?wprov=sfti1

K-8
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet...-8?wprov=sfti1 https://maps.apple.com/?ll=46.000000...AAAAAAAAGMA%3D

K-431
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet...31?wprov=sfti1
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      05-19-2019, 09:20 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
Fellas, fellas...don't waste your precious time feeding the trolls. You should know better.
You're right. I rather not have this thread moved to the Politics sub forum or have it locked. I'd like to have a continued discussion about each of the episodes without the distractions.
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      05-19-2019, 09:23 AM   #61
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Fellas, fellas...don't waste your precious time feeding the trolls. You should know better.
Agree. Happy to keep discussing this show with my fellow comrades.
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      05-19-2019, 01:26 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by N54Yankee View Post
Nixon covered up some of his guys who stole some of the other partyís paperwork prior to an election, bad but nobody died it didnít cause birth defects for many years after and he was forced out of office and men went to prison for what his admin did.

The Soviets on the other hand tried to coverup the worst nuclear accident in history, thousands died and likely more dying this day due to effects of U-235 and no one at the kremlin was held to task and punished.
Thousands of Russians including construction, scientists, engineers, workers, soldiers, politicians admitted the atrocities that occurred from the shody building of the plant, running of the plant, the test that caused the explosion, keeping the news of that explosion from the world hush and idiotic attempts to try to stop it and today the sarcophagus built to contain the beast is failing.
You are in a miniscule minority of Russians who have the gall to try to deny what history has proven fact. Nearly all Russians now admit what happened then and take responsibility. You speak like a Pravda editorial page, pure communist propaganda from the 50ís, so much so itís laughable. The USSR is long gone, open your eyes and see what the word Pravda really means. Stand up, Be a man and take responsibility.


Comparing the crazy NK hermit kingdoms ridiculous fiction to the American/ British story of Chernobyl's factual history with thousands of actual Russians admitting it actually happened is both pathetic and comical.
Iíll say it again, research and read actual books accounting on what happened from thousands of those Russians who were there.

While youíre at it, check out books about the shooting down of KAL flight 007 from the same era of the Soviet Union and the coverup that was dreamed up by the boys in the kremlin. Even the pilot who pulled the trigger admitted the horror. So donít even try to play holier then thou about the sanctity of the politburo in Moscow at the time. They were bad actors on the world stage and the fact that the govt utterly imploded and collapsed is evidence of that.
The whole world knew within 48 hours of the incident.

Strong coverup...

Why are you being intellectually dishonest ?
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      05-19-2019, 02:24 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post
The whole world knew within 48 hours of the incident.

Strong coverup...

Why are you being intellectually dishonest ?
Are you serious? The world knew no thanks to Moscow.
The soviets has already begun evacuating without a word of warning to surrounding countries. The Swedes recognized there was fallout from somewhere and based on wind direction keyed on the USSR. The Swedes called Moscow and initially they lied to the Swedes saying nyet it not us. Finally They were forced to admit it due to overwhelming evidence including USA spy satellite shots but saying it was only a Ďminor incidentí no cause for concern comrades, donít worry too much.

The whole world is in agreement that it was a terrible way for the soviets to handle what was then a worldwide problem. You are the one being dishonest as the soviets were back then, difference is youíre still perpetuating the fraud long after the soviets admitted culpability.
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      05-19-2019, 07:48 PM   #64
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Found these on Youtube. They're podcasts with Craig Mazin the creator of the mini series. They go over all the research done, what was changed, what was kept accurate, etc. I'm listening to the first one now. So far definitely worth the listen to supplement the actual show. The podcast is long at just over 50 minutes. Extremely fascinating so far.



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      05-19-2019, 08:12 PM   #65
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Just finished the first podcast. The whole podcast is really worth the listen. But the "Really?" list which starts at 44:00 is definitely something to jump to. The recorded response which is the Soviet's version of 911 was the actual recording during the incident.

After listening to the podcast, it gives me more respect as to the work behind the scenes to put this all together.
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      05-19-2019, 11:22 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by The Libertine View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spetsnazos View Post


North Koreans making a movie about the US. This is the equivalent of the Chernobyl show.
What you’re ultimately suggesting is that the North Korean mindset of controlling everything its citizens watch and have access to, is analogous to an HBO miniseries? Wow, even if I suspend my disbelief at your reasoning still can’t reach the same conclusion.

In America, citizens are free to watch what they want, think what they want, and draw their own conclusions. Conversely, in North Korea, the state ONLY shows what it WANTS it’s citizens to see, and with content aimed precisely in the light most favorable to its government. North Koreans are told what to believe, and live in fear of severe consequences if thinking otherwise.
Suspension of disbelief, one of my favorite phrases!
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