help me decide M3 v GTR

[BMW-videos.com]

Not a fan of the GTR, but i'd probably take it over the M3. I like modding my car, japanese tuners seem to be cheaper than German.. but it seems the GTR has changed that a little..

[synclastica_86]

Originally Posted by BMW-videos.com

Not a fan of the GTR, but i'd probably take it over the M3. I like modding my car, japanese tuners seem to be cheaper than German.. but it seems the GTR has changed that a little..

I'd be careful working with the GTR, the dual clutch gearbox might not the the increased torque. There are already stories about it overheating after a few launches with the stock engine.

[th3Stig]

synclastica, your words should be read and idolized by every other user on this board. You finally gave YOUR review which is what I can actually use to help me pick whether or not the GTR is worth it.

[Japanese_Racer]

M3 vs. GT-R vs. GT3

[Herms]

go with the m3. it has street cred, great performance (though not GTR perf), is cheaper and will be a better daily driver + free maintenance.

the only reason to get the GTR over the M3 is if you're all about performance, otherwise the M3 is superior and pretty f'in fast in its own right.

[burrito007]

If you want street cred go with the GT-R. You will attract the attention of every boy-racer on the planet. Seriously you can pull into a Dunkin' Donuts and people will FLOCK to your car. When you pull into the exec parking lot, however, people will likely say "nice nissan" and won't know the difference between that or the other nissans/pontiac etc.

If you get the M3 the boy-racers will sometimes know you have a nice car but won't really care since they (for the most part) don't like BMWs. In the exec parking lot, people will be like "nice bimmer." Some will know its an M3 but very few. Most will just think its a nice 3 series and could think its more $$ because it has 2x the exhaust of any other 3 series =)

Personally, going from a 323 to m3(e46), no one has noticed. I get 0 additional attention - save from 1 or 2 crazed boy-racers. My family/friends are like
"oh another bmw." Fiance's opinion is "looks exactly the same inside as ur 323." Co-workers I have driven around have said "where are the features? no nav?" - I pointed down to the 6spd and said "this is the feature" but I couldn't demonstrate since it was raining.

The new M3 will probably get you more looks than the e46 but i think you get the picture.

I would always pick the m3, but its in my blood at this point. If I wasn't so bent on BMW and hadn't been obsessed with the m3 since I got my license I would probably say GT-R.

TLDR Cliff Notes:
M3 - exec car, "i own a bmw," most people won't know its an M or care.
GT-R - Boy-racer exotic with awesome performance, less respect in business world due to it being a "nissan"

[Herms]

Originally Posted by Japanese_Racer

M3 vs. GT-R vs. GT3

interesting review. not very flattering to the M3, but the cars it's up against are in a different class. The GTR has supercar performance as does the GT3. The fact that people feel the need to compare the M3 to such cars is a testament to how good it is. also, that guy clearly didn't know how to get the most out of the MT cars. Comparing his "first" tries using launch control on the GTR versus guessing how it should be done on the other cars is bs.

Seems to be a general advantage of the GTR. One of the critcisms I've heard is that the driving experience is less engaging than other cars because the computers do so much of the driving. whether that's true or not, the fact remains that it's probably an easier car to just sit in and drive fast, whereas the M3 and the GT3 especially require more skill and an understanding of how to manipulate the car to get its potential. As he noted, some people like the challenge, but in any case, the point is that someone just randomly driving the cars without any experience doesn't make for a comparison of the cars' true potential, though the point about performance that normal drivers can actually get is well taken (though agian, even normal drivers get used to their cars and can do better than this guy on try 1).

[TLud]

Originally Posted by Herms

Seems to be a general advantage of the GTR. One of the critcisms I've heard is that the driving experience is less engaging than other cars because the computers do so much of the driving. whether that's true or not, the fact remains that it's probably an easier car to just sit in and drive fast, whereas the M3 and the GT3 especially require more skill and an understanding of how to manipulate the car to get its potential. As he noted, some people like the challenge, but in any case, the point is that someone just randomly driving the cars without any experience doesn't make for a comparison of the cars' true potential, though the point about performance that normal drivers can actually get is well taken (though agian, even normal drivers get used to their cars and can do better than this guy on try 1).

Funny, your highlighted comment is one that traditionally has been directed toward BMWs. The M3 is a relatively easy car to drive at the limit, but it sounds like the GTR sets a new standard in this regard.

[Herms]

Originally Posted by TLud

Funny, your highlighted comment is one that traditionally has been directed toward BMWs. The M3 is a relatively easy car to drive at the limit, but it sounds like the GTR sets a new standard in this regard.

Drive at the limit yes, 0-60 I think not, at least not on the first try. 5.2 seconds is not even close to what the car can do, even discounting 1-ft roll out times you see. Since the the low end is a bit lacking compared to some other comparable cars, you need to get a good launch to get a good time and that's always a fine line between bogging down and wheelspin. If we're talking the DCT with launch control, his opinion would have been substantially different. Like I said, it's not that a normal driver can't master it, it's just not something you're likely to nail on the first try. The point is that comparing first efforts, especially against a LC car, isn't very meaningful IMO if the point is "what can an average driver actually do with this car" or something to that effect.

I happen to like the challege personally. I drove the dct and still got the mt. The joy of trying to improve my performance driving skills in and of itself gets me out of the house in the morning.

[TLud]

Originally Posted by Herms

Drive at the limit yes, 0-60 I think not, at least not on the first try. 5.2 seconds is not even close to what the car can do, even discounting 1-ft roll out times you see. Since the the low end is a bit lacking compared to some other comparable cars, you need to get a good launch to get a good time and that's always a fine line between bogging down and wheelspin. If we're talking the DCT with launch control, his opinion would have been substantially different. Like I said, it's not that a normal drive can't master it, it's just not something you're likely to nail on the first try. The point is that comparing first efforts, especially against a LC car, isn't very meaningful IMO if the point is is "what can an average driver actually do with this car" or something to that effect.

I happen to like the challege personally. I drove the dct and still got the mt. The joy of trying to improve my performance driving skills in and of itself gets me out of the house in the morning.

I couldn't agree more with everything you said. Well put.

[McLuVan]

Originally Posted by ///Mantis

GTR

[Advskier]

This is only my second post here, but I just purchased an M3 after (briefly) considering the GTR.
Just like with performance bikes, regardless of what you buy, there is always something better around the corner.
The M3 has an understated elegance about it, and is a very tastefull car. Performance numbers were only a part of the equation for a car that I will only use on the street. The M3 makes a different kind of statement than the GTR does.
On paper, the GTR (and M3) will outperform Aston Martin and Maserati, but I doubt very many people with the means would choose the GTR over either of these cars.
If track performance were my only criteria, there are plenty of other cars I would have considered. I wouldn't have needed/wanted heated leather seats, Navigation, Bluetooth, etc.

No doubt the GTR is a great car for the money. But the person buying it because it is the king of the hill right now is probably in for a rude awakening, when Nissan, Mitsubishi, or whoever ups the ante next week/month/year.

[ersin]

Not to take anything away from the GT-R, but it seems the production units that are just now becoming available don't quite get the same performance as some of the pre-US-launch examples. I was reading somewhere on one of these forums (can't find it with search) where the GT-R was only able to do 0 - 60 in 4.1 seconds. That's the same numbers as some reviewers were getting for both M3 coupe and sedan.
Edit: That 0-60 time was without LC. But so were the times for the M3.

In any case, the GT-R is likely faster in most every way. But if you value how much fun it is to drive each of these -- GT-R or M3 -- the comparison is not so clear cut. It has been reported that the M3 > GT-R in this respect. You'll have to drive for yourself to decide. Thanks to the OP for your impressions.

Then there is practicality which I can unreservedly say goes in favor to the M3. It has a real usable back seat and trunk for example. This is important for me since I'll be using the car as a daily driver. Why do they even put those excuses for a rear seat in the GT-R and 911? They should follow the example of the Mercedes Black -- just put carpeted shelf back there instead of pretending to have seats.

Another thing in BMW's favor is the 4-year/50,000 mile free service. I understand that maintenance on the GT-R is horrendously expensive. I'll have to verify that but it doesn't surprise me. The tires are supposed to be filled with pure nitrogen. Which local gas station has compressed nitrogen? And I don't think I'd want Nissan service folks working on my $70K+ car. Not that BMW is any better. It's just that I have never had anything but shit for service from any Nissan dealer. And I've had my share of Nissans. In general, their vehicles are great. Their dealer network sucks hind tit.

Just some of my ranting ... you don't have to agree, but don't flame me.

[M3-Spirit]

I agree fully with Mojo, even if the Nissan GTR managaes 0-100 in 1 sec, even if its fitted with gold engine, platinum gearbox, diamond etc.... it will always be a Nissan with a stolen GTR name...

it reminds me with those Lancer Evo XYZ or Subaru wrc bla bla... i used to have a 2005 E46, and you should look at those guys driving these japanese cars, getting an orgasm when they pass next to my car, where they try to race me...so funny...

so even if they put a Full computer system for every piston in the Nissan GTR...the image of the car will not change. and nothing, nothing beats the charm and presence of an M3

[BMW-videos.com]

Originally Posted by BMW335icDDS

This one is WAY too easy. I was on a waitlist for a M3, but the GT-R is the new KING. Read any car magazine, they call it the king, corvette crusher, instant legend. It is the car of the decade. The M3 isn't even close performance wise, and the M is supposed to stand for Motorsport. I say the M now stands for marketing since they are now trying to sell 100k of these things a year. And 70k for a M3? Only enthusiasts know the difference between a 3 and a M3. You get a sick awesome looking machine in the GTR that is unique, and has performance that bests a Veyron on any track. The GTR, easily.

yeah the new king, except it's being proven day in and day out to be slaughtered by corvettes in almost all areas except maybe off the line. I'd still take the GTR over the m3 most likely, but look at the new price it's almost $80k. Nissan priced it so low as a head fake to PRETEND like it was the greatest value, when in fact it's being shown now it's certainly not as fast as claimed. still a nice car though!

[synclastica_86]

M3 is you enjoy performance that you need to earn with your driving skills... GTR if you want out right speed and let the computer do your driving...

[Nebo335]

Originally Posted by burrito007

If you want street cred go with the GT-R. You will attract the attention of every boy-racer on the planet. Seriously you can pull into a Dunkin' Donuts and people will FLOCK to your car. When you pull into the exec parking lot, however, people will likely say "nice nissan" and won't know the difference between that or the other nissans/pontiac etc.

If you get the M3 the boy-racers will sometimes know you have a nice car but won't really care since they (for the most part) don't like BMWs. In the exec parking lot, people will be like "nice bimmer." Some will know its an M3 but very few. Most will just think its a nice 3 series and could think its more $$ because it has 2x the exhaust of any other 3 series =)

Personally, going from a 323 to m3(e46), no one has noticed. I get 0 additional attention - save from 1 or 2 crazed boy-racers. My family/friends are like
"oh another bmw." Fiance's opinion is "looks exactly the same inside as ur 323." Co-workers I have driven around have said "where are the features? no nav?" - I pointed down to the 6spd and said "this is the feature" but I couldn't demonstrate since it was raining.

The new M3 will probably get you more looks than the e46 but i think you get the picture.

I would always pick the m3, but its in my blood at this point. If I wasn't so bent on BMW and hadn't been obsessed with the m3 since I got my license I would probably say GT-R.

TLDR Cliff Notes:
M3 - exec car, "i own a bmw," most people won't know its an M or care.
GT-R - Boy-racer exotic with awesome performance, less respect in business world due to it being a "nissan"

[MidwestBimmerFan]

M3's do almost everything well that's what makes BMW 's the best! The GTR does one thing great and that is being pushed to the limits on the track. From your description of what you want in a car the M3 is all the car you will ever need.

[Hotan Braskey]

I didn't have time to read all six pages of replies, so if someone has already said this- my apologies. If you are interested in the GTR and can wait a little bit, the Carmax dealer in White Marsh is also a Nissan dealership. This is a no haggle dealership, meaning everything goes for sticker. No discounts, and no markups. I know someone who just got on the list there and he was guaranteed a GTR at sticker. Just some food for thought...

[duyh]

you would get way more vag in a m3 after all it is a bmw i mean sounds way fancier than saying i drive a nissan but performance wise gtr

[2high2aim]

hey man I am also into both cars and also considering an Mitsubishi Evo X but besides that I wanted to tell you that yea the GTR tranny gets a little hot but they came out with a solution to that with a Tranny cooler http://www.gtrblog.com/index.php/200...ooler-d?blog=4

Well yea the GTR will have solutions to all "problems" by aftermarket support because of all the craze ppl have of the car plus its a japanese car that has a history known for its capability to be modified to a monster. Well on the other end for a daily drive the M3 will be more luxurious but normal people dont know the dif b/t a 335 and a M3 but whereas the GTR ppl will be like wtf isnt that the car that made 7:38 and like the kids to adults will know because of it being advertised so great in video games and the hype specially the kids. Well I also read somewhere that the GTR can give you 26mpg and the M3 give 20 and MPGs are import to me because of the current gas prices but I would really like more leg room for my passengers. My friend has a accord (dont laugh but yea) and the leg room is tight for the 2 door and I hated every second of sitting in the back seat. So yea and then I thought hey the new Mitsubishi Evo X is out (I know its not you option but i think its a great car because I can used the saved money to customise it and make it capable to kick the GTRs butt will all the saved $$ and more plus it would be one of a kind literally.

A con for the GTR is that it doesnt have a great warrenty and everything is expensive on the car. Its a hard decision...good luck

[laicosmo]

Well, I have both the R35 + E92 M3 DCT, well these 2 cars a really different in style, performance or handling, but what i can say is I actually like my E92 M3 a little better. Because of how the E92 M3 handles, the NA V8 and all the little things that BMW consider about, the major thing you notice in a R35 and E92 M3 is there steering wheel, when you get in the M3 you get the fat and nice feeling from the steering wheel, but while in the GTR you don't. I'm not saying i don't like my R35, i means it is scary fast, I mean people litearly move out of your when when they see you, but when i get in the GTR i have the urge to racing anything out on the street, but once i hop back into the M3 it is different I'm more of a gent. So both cars a great, and both have the ups and downs, it only depends on what you like, for suggestion wise, I would say E92 M3 due to its elegance and speed is more equal, but if you want fast & furious R35 is you best bet, you can't go wrong with both cars, is what style you choose. This is just my IMHO