Dyno Rematch: Battle between Dinan & RD Sport for 4.6L Stroker Motor Bragging Rights

Alex07M3 · 02-20-2014, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aus

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

Humm, I tend to disagree with you(again

) about the fact that the minor bolt-ons is the only way to go with the S65! It's so rare to ear about members who broke an engine because of boost, I really don't see why you think the S65 does not respond well to superchargers, so many members here have proven the opposite! Probably the fact that there's more thread about rod bearings issue then there is actual blown S65 has contributed to the general paranoia but let me tell you this, no engine is without a problem! Just an exemple, my friend who owns a stock C63(which many consider to have a bullet proof engine) with half my mileage has blown his head gaskets, while me with my fussy supercharged S65 has never had an issue except for a bad o2 sensor(probably not supercharger related)!

Don't get me wrong, I'm not stupid enough to think that a blower wont accelarate the wear of my engine, but with the used S65 getting cheaper(I'v seen many in the $6-7k range) and my car being a keeper

, I'm willing to take that small risk of blowing an engine in exchange of having the pleasure to drive this incredebly fun toy!! I honestly think that my s/c S65 has nothing to envy to the V10 you find in a Gallardo/R8 as far as fun to drive, and these cars are well well over my budget so to me a blower is a no brainer!!

I'll probably think of changing my rod bearings one day but I'll wait to see what can be done, tuning wise, with the new M3/M4 before deciding if I keep my car long enough for that!

That's a known issue with that engine. My buddy just had his engine changed out from his AMG G wagon. It's all over the MB forums too.

.

Ah I did'nt knew that, my friend is not on the forum either so he did'nt expected something like this could happen! He went straight to the dealer for an out of warranty repair and ended up with a $7k bill, finally he had an offer from the dealer to buy back his car at a fair price + cancelling his repair bill in exchange of buying a brand new C63, so now he drives a nice flat gray C63 507 that I can't wait to race!!

regular guy · 02-20-2014, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kawasaki00

Shoot me a PM about the coil bind specs if you would

Check your email.

Sered · 02-20-2014, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kawasaki00

Cam and head work is where the power will be. Plenum elbow and tb already flow more than what is needed for the size and rpm of this engine.
Not that ones and twos do not matter but for the effort and money just not much to be gained.
The 284/292 combo would probably be best on the stroker

^^^ This.

I don't get why people don't understand this. Simply adding displacement doesn't do much if your heads/cams can't flow the air, it just changes the amount of air that gets pumped down low.

A REAL stroker build involves heads/cams work, you have to change the cam and head profiles to take advantage of the increased displacement. It's not rocket science, it's very well established basic science.

I honestly don't think the manufacturers of these 'stroker' builds are this stupid; they know exactly what they're doing. Milking the idiot customer for all their money.

As for deltas, one of the stock cars dynoed somewhere in the 320whp range? Hardly a representation of a well-running stock S65. Stock S65s generally dyno in the 350-360whp range. The FBOs that I've seen generally get into the 375-380whp range with some hitting 400whp with good gas.

These gains are not impressive in the least.

MrStinky · 02-20-2014, 06:20 PM

I would say stock M3 healthy dyno 335-350. Never seen one near 360. Otherwise agreee

catpat8000 · 02-20-2014, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sered

Stock S65s generally dyno in the 350-360whp range.

What is your source for this assertion?

catpat8000 · 02-20-2014, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrStinky

I would say stock M3 healthy dyno 335-350. Never seen one near 360. Otherwise agreee

You would say. Hmm. How about a source? Maybe a dyno database?

regular guy · 02-20-2014, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sered

As for deltas, one of the stock cars dynoed somewhere in the 320whp range? Hardly a representation of a well-running stock S65. Stock S65s generally dyno in the 350-360whp range. The FBOs that I've seen generally get into the 375-380whp range with some hitting 400whp with good gas.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrStinky

I would say stock M3 healthy dyno 335-350. Never seen one near 360. Otherwise agreee

Quote:

Originally Posted by catpat8000

What is your source for this assertion?

I'd like to know this as well. What is the source?

Here's all the bone stock entries from the Dyno Database, Dynojet, SAE Corrected.

HP	TQ	Corr.	User	Mods
352 @ 8100	259 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	KSA ///M3	STOCK, 94US, 6MT
350 @ 8000	254 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	MPoweredAuto	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
348 @ 8100	252 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rom3n	STOCK, 94US, 6MT
346 @ 8000	259 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Dave2011M3	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
343 @ 8150	248 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	Sig5x	STOCK, 91US, DCT
343 @ 8100	249 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	per	STOCK, 94US, 6MT
342 @ 8200	247 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Encore Innovation	STOCK, 91US, DCT
341 @ 8250	250 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	slipstream	STOCK, 91US, DCT
341 @ 8200	248 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	King Tut	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
340 @ 8225	257 @ 3700	SAE (J1349)	EAS	STOCK, 91US, DCT
339 @ 8100	249 @ 3750	SAE (J1349)	Green-Eggs	STOCK, 91US, DCT
338 @ 8200	247 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	Sleeper	STOCK, 91US, DCT
337 @ 8200	254 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	DLSJ5	STOCK, 91US, DCT
337 @ 8200	248 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Fabspeed	STOCK, 93US, DCT
337 @ 8000	247 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	JonMartin	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
336 @ 8250	248 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	mexicanmike	STOCK, 91US, DCT
334 @ 8250	246 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rldzhao	STOCK, 93US, DCT
334 @ 8000	235 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Joey@Fabspeed	STOCK, 93US, DCT
333 @ 8150	246 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	dcstep	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
333 @ 8050	241 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	m33	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
332 @ 7810	249 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	KZ	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
327 @ 8150	242 @ 4010	SAE (J1349)	catpat8000	STOCK, 91US, DCT
324 @ 7900	252 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Nick@Jlevi SW	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
322 @ 8200	238 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	PencilGeek	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
321 @ 8150	238 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rom3n	STOCK, 91US, DCT
320 @ 8200	238 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rom3n	STOCK, 91US, DCT
319 @ 8150	245 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	tightie	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
312 @ 7800	238 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	FStop7	STOCK, 91US, 6MT

Longboarder · 02-20-2014, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regular guy

I'd like to know this as well. What is the source?

Here's all the bone stock entries from the Dyno Database, Dynojet, SAE Corrected.

I gave you mine RG maybe it never made it up there.

I made 365 STD on 91 octane DCT 2013.

There's a guy back east that made 371 on a really cold day with a stock 2013 DCT on 93 octane.

regular guy · 02-20-2014, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sered

A REAL stroker build involves heads/cams work, you have to change the cam and head profiles to take advantage of the increased displacement. It's not rocket science, it's very well established basic science.

Have you ever seen the ports of this cylinder head? I'm curious what you thought of them and exactly where you would make the improvements.

Quote:

As for deltas, one of the stock cars dynoed somewhere in the 320whp range? Hardly a representation of a well-running stock S65. Stock S65s generally dyno in the 350-360whp range. The FBOs that I've seen generally get into the 375-380whp range with some hitting 400whp with good gas.

Here's all the bolt on entries from the Dyno Database. Again, these are all Dynojet and SAE corrected. I don't generally see any of them in 375-380 range. Those are extremely rare. Most of these are in the 360ish range.

HP	TQ	Corr.	User	Mods
393 @ 8200	283 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	joe@trinityautosport	PPMS, CPMS2, SCPRPI, CATDEL, EX-RPI-GTC, 91US, 6MT
383 @ 8100	270 @ 3750	SAE (J1349)	dogears	PLYAAW, FLTAAA, CAT200, CATDL2, XPPFBS, ECUCST, 93US, DCT
383 @ 8100	270 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Fabspeed	PLYFAB, FLTBMC, CAT200, XPPFBS, ECUFAB, 93US, DCT
381 @ 8150	272 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Boosted-M	FLTAFD, CAT200, EXHESR, ECUPCC, 93US, 6MT
379 @ 8320	272 @ 4040	SAE (J1349)	Alekshop	CATDEL, AKRAGT4, ECUESS, 91US, DCT
378 @ 8350	274 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	tom@eas	CATDL2, XPCHLG, EXHAKP, ECDNS2, 91US, 6MT
377 @ 8300	271 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	radz182	PLYAAW, SCPRPI, EXRPIG, ECSING, 91US, DCT
375 @ 8100	273 @ 5600	SAE (J1349)	DemonEye	AA-GRN, CATDEL, ECUAA, 93US, 6MT
371 @ 8225	272 @ 4252	SAE (J1349)	Mike Benvo	PLYRDS, CPMS2, CATDEL, EXHAKP, BPMS1, 91US, 6MT
371 @ 8200	267 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Jon Martin	PLYEVO, FLTMSA, CATDL1, EXHGT2, ECUPC2, 91US, 6MT
370 @ 8200	262 @ 7000	SAE (J1349)	e92 M3	EXHESR, 93US, 6MT
368 @ 8300	264 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	cpiguy	INTDS2, XPDNAN, EXHDIN, ECDNS2, 91US, DCT
367 @ 8200	267 @ 5600	SAE (J1349)	DLSJ5	PLYRE, FLTAFD, CAT200, XPPENI, 91US, DCT
366 @ 8400	270 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Alekshop	FLTMSA, EXHAKP, ECUESS, 91US, DCT
366 @ 8125	270 @ 4285	SAE (J1349)	Mike Benvo	PLYRDS, CPMS2, SCPRPI, CATDEL, EXHAKP, 91US, 6MT
364 @ 8400	264 @ 4600	SAE (J1349)	kitw	CPAFE2, EXHAKP, ECUDI1, 91US, DCT
364 @ 8100	265 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Ca$hOnly	FLTAFD, EXHAKP, 91US, 6MT
361 @ 8100	268 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	xxe92xx	FLTBMC, CATDEL, XPGTNI, EXMGT2, ECUPC2, 93US, 6MT
360 @ 8300	257 @ 7050	SAE (J1349)	dasvolk	FLTAFW, ECUDI1, 93US, 6MT
360 @ 8300	261 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	SCCAForums.com	PLLY, FLTMSA, SCPRPI, CAT200, XPRISS, EXRRAB, ECUPC2, 91US, 6MT
360 @ 8175	257 @ 4050	SAE (J1349)	Jean@VelosDesignwerks	EXHAKP, ECU-VELOS, 93US, DCT
359 @ 8400	259 @ 4200	SAE (J1349)	kitw	EXHAKP, ECDNS2, 91US, DCT
359 @ 8360	257 @ 5825	SAE (J1349)	Alvin 11 M3	PLYDN2, DTB, INTDS2, CATDEL, XPDNAN, EXHDIN, ECDNS2, 100RON, DCT
359 @ 8020	273 @ 3820	SAE (J1349)	KennyPowers	PPMS, CPMS2, FLTAAA, CATDL1, XPTURN, ECUEV1, 93US, 6MT
358 @ 8250	267 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	sard	FLTBMC, EXHAKP, ECUPCC, 91US, DCT
357 @ 8230	266 @ 3720	SAE (J1349)	SWen	AA-GRN, CATDEL, XPTURN, EXHMEG, BPMS2, 91US, DCT
356 @ 8400	258 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	disapr	EXHAKP, ECUESS, 93US, DCT
355 @ 8200	256 @ 3700	SAE (J1349)	Encore Innovation	CAT200, XPPENI, 91US, DCT
355 @ 8200	258 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	bubu	EXHRMS, 91US, 6MT
355 @ 8150	262 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	slipstream	CAT200, XPAKRA, 91US, DCT
355 @ 8000	270 @ 4100	SAE (J1349)	DLSJ5	CATDEL, XPGTNI, EXBRL4, 91US, DCT
355 @ 7865	237 @ 3550	SAE (J1349)	John@BMW	FLTBMC, EXUUCC, ECUAA, 91US, 6MT
354 @ 8400	236 @ 3700	SAE (J1349)	frankzlin79	PLYDN2, FLTMSA, CATDEL, XPDNAN, EXHDIN, ECDNS2, 93US, DCT
354 @ 8125	264 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Alekshop	FLTMSA, EXHAKP, 91US, DCT
353 @ 8250	256 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Dray-M3	PLYDN2, FLTMSA, EXHAKP, ECUDI1, 91US, DCT
353 @ 8200	257 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Fabspeed	XPPFBS, 93US, DCT
353 @ 8175	259 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Jean@VelosDesignwerks	EXHAKP, ECU-VELOS, 93US, DCT
353 @ 8100	267 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	mindless.spades	CAT200, EXHAKP, ECUESS, 91US, 6MT
352 @ 8100	261 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Z4dave	PLYAAW, FLTAFW, XPAA, EXHDIN, ECUAA, 91US, DCT
351 @ 8400	227 @ 3700	SAE (J1349)	///M Ryder	PLYDN2, INTDS2, CATDEL, XPDNAN, EXHDIN, ECUDI1, 93US, DCT
351 @ 8200	351 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	NosonyxM3	EXHAA, ECUAA, 93US, DCT
350 @ 8400	253 @ 4100	SAE (J1349)	skoot3r	PLYDN1, INTDS2, CATDEL, EXGTRR, ECDNS2, 91US, DCT
350 @ 8150	253 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	dogears	PLYAAW, FLTAAA, 93US, DCT
350 @ 8000	253 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Fabspeed	PLYFAB, FLTBMC, 93US, DCT
349 @ 8200	257 @ 4150	SAE (J1349)	dettinger	FLTAFD, EXHAKP, 91US, DCT
349 @ 8200	262 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	madjmonkee	FLTBMC, EXHAKP, 91US, DCT
348 @ 8400	258 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	Hollywood Hogan	FLTMSA, SCPRPI, CATDL1, XPTURN, ECUEV2, 91US, DCT
348 @ 8100	249 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	pumper206	INTTCP, FLTBMC, XPPFBS, ECUPC2, 92US, DCT
346 @ 8250	243 @ 3825	SAE (J1349)	tinpot	PLYAAW, FLTMSA, CAT200, XPPFBS, EXHRDS, ECUPCC, 93US, DCT
346 @ 8150	252 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	jimmyeatsworld	FLTBMC, SCPRPI, EXHRPI, 91US, 6MT
346 @ 8000	254 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	tom@eas	EXHAEP, 91US, DCT
345 @ 8250	255 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	TXM32B	PLLY, FLTAFW, CAT200, XPRISS, ECUCST, 93US, 6MT
345 @ 8000	260 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Darren1100	FLTAFD, EXHAKP, 91US, DCT
344 @ 8200	251 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Irb Digital	EXHAA, 93US, 6MT
344 @ 8150	247 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	King Tut	PLYEVO, FLTMSA, 93US, 6MT
344 @ 8110	256 @ 3975	SAE (J1349)	Z4Dave	PLYAAW, FLTAFD, XPAA, EXHDIN, ECUAA, 100US, DCT
343 @ 8225	250 @ 4085	SAE (J1349)	Dray-M3	PLYDN2, FLTMSA, EXHAKP, ECUDI1, 91US, DCT
343 @ 8150	252 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Ca$hOnly	FLTAFD, 91US, 6MT
343 @ 8000	247 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Joey@Fabspeed	XPPFBS, EXHRMS, 93US, DCT
342 @ 7740	263 @ 3780	SAE (J1349)	KennyPowers	FLTAAA, CATDL1, XPTURN, ECUEV1, 93US, 6MT
341 @ 8200	243 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	pumper206	INTTCP, FLTBMC, XPPFBS, 92US, DCT
341 @ 8100	248 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	SCCAForums.com	FLTMSA, SCPRPI, 91US, 6MT
340 @ 8250	245 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	KennyPowers	FLTAAA, XPTURN, ECUEV1, 93US, 6MT
340 @ 8000	246 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	KnockOutKing	EXGTRR, EXGTRR, 93US, 93US, DCT, DCT
339 @ 8100	245 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Z4dave	FLTAFW, 91US, DCT
339 @ 8100	249 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	m3soupy	FLTMSA, EXAKSO, 91US, DCT
338 @ 8150	248 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	8.08E+92	CAIGM, EXARQ, 92US, 6MT
337 @ 7900	247 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	dcstep	DTB, 91US, 6MT
337 @ 7900	247 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	dcstep	DTB, ECUDI1, 100US, 6MT
337 @ 7850	255 @ 3980	SAE (J1349)	chris s	EXHAEP, 93US, 6MT
336 @ 8200	241 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	King Tut	PLYEVO, 93US, 6MT
336 @ 8175	236 @ 4010	SAE (J1349)	noxredna	FLTMSA, XPCUST, EXHRMR, 91US, DCT
336 @ 8100	251 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	duk	FLTBMC, EXAKSO, 91US, 6MT
335 @ 8400	253 @ 3700	SAE (J1349)	EAS	BPMS1, 91US, DCT
333 @ 8150	240 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Chaos888	FLTMSA, EXHCST, 91US, DCT
333 @ 7900	258 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Nick@Jlevi SW	EXHVST, 91US, 6MT
332 @ 8100	245 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	dcstep	DTB, 100US, 6MT
327 @ 8100	250 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	TXM32B	PLLY, FLTAFW, CAT200, XPRISS, 93US, 6MT
324 @ 8300	240 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	aus	FLTAFW, EXRRAB, 91US, DCT
316 @ 8110	239 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	psuwcc112	PLYRDS, FLTAFD, EXHRMS, 91US, DCT

regular guy · 02-20-2014, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longboarder

I gave you mine RG maybe it never made it up there.

I made 365 STD on 91 octane DCT 2013.

There's a guy back east that made 371 on a really cold day with a stock 2013 DCT on 93 octane.

I must have lost track of those. I will look into that tonight.

Since there's already 600+ entries in the Dyno Database, I've narrowed what I put in and what I don't. Generally speaking, this is what gets in these days.
1. Must have Dyno .DRF files (for dynojet). There are exceptions as noted below.
2. Sets a new record.
3. Introduction of a new product.

So for people who send me their dyno files, they're almost always guaranteed and entry. Sometimes I get bogged down with other things and forget. That's probably what happened to you. Without the dyno files, unless it sets a new record or comes from the introduction of a new product, it doesn't get in.

I remember the guys back east. I was never able to get their files in spite of two or three attempts.

tom @ eas · 02-20-2014, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regular guy

Here's all the bolt on entries from the Dyno Database. Again, these are all Dynojet and SAE corrected. I don't generally see any of them in 375-380 range. Those are extremely rare. Most of these are in the 360ish range.

We've had a few 400whp FBO M3s on the dyno. Kiav's for example:

We posted a few in this thread: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=788241

Longboarder · 02-20-2014, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regular guy

I remember the guys back east. I was never able to get their files in spite of two or three attempts.

I think it was e92 M3 who did 370. Actually he's noted above in your database but I guess he had one mod so he wasn't stock. Says he had: EXHESR, 93US, 6MT. What is "EXHESR"? This was the guy that did 620 STD with the ESS 625 kit when it was like 40 degrees F.

Ezio · 02-20-2014, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sered

^^^ This.

I don't get why people don't understand this. Simply adding displacement doesn't do much if your heads/cams can't flow the air, it just changes the amount of air that gets pumped down low.

A REAL stroker build involves heads/cams work, you have to change the cam and head profiles to take advantage of the increased displacement. It's not rocket science, it's very well established basic science.

I honestly don't think the manufacturers of these 'stroker' builds are this stupid; they know exactly what they're doing. Milking the idiot customer for all their money.

As for deltas, one of the stock cars dynoed somewhere in the 320whp range? Hardly a representation of a well-running stock S65. Stock S65s generally dyno in the 350-360whp range. The FBOs that I've seen generally get into the 375-380whp range with some hitting 400whp with good gas.

These gains are not impressive in the least.

why arent there cam/head options ? the stock setup is surely not the most aggressive the engine can go.

regular guy · 02-20-2014, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longboarder

I think it was e92 M3 who did 370. Actually he's noted above in your database but I guess he had one mod so he wasn't stock. Says he had: EXHESR, 93US, 6MT. What is "EXHESR"? This was the guy that did 620 STD with the ESS 625 kit when it was like 40 degrees F.

Two ways to find out the abbreviations:
1) Click "Output Type" -> "Long"
2) Click "Mods & Logs Explained"

EXHESR = Eisenmann Race Exhaust

regular guy · 02-20-2014, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom @ eas

We've had a few 400whp FBO M3s on the dyno. Kiav's for example:

We posted a few in this thread: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=788241

Oh, I remember that one. The bottom graph that says "Conditions" doesn't actually have the conditions (it's the same STD graph posted twice). I'll get that one added tonight as well.

catpat8000 · 02-20-2014, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regular guy

I'd like to know this as well. What is the source?

Here's all the bone stock entries from the Dyno Database, Dynojet, SAE Corrected.

HP	TQ	Corr.	User	Mods
352 @ 8100	259 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	KSA ///M3	STOCK, 94US, 6MT
350 @ 8000	254 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	MPoweredAuto	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
348 @ 8100	252 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rom3n	STOCK, 94US, 6MT
346 @ 8000	259 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Dave2011M3	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
343 @ 8150	248 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	Sig5x	STOCK, 91US, DCT
343 @ 8100	249 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	per	STOCK, 94US, 6MT
342 @ 8200	247 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Encore Innovation	STOCK, 91US, DCT
341 @ 8250	250 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	slipstream	STOCK, 91US, DCT
341 @ 8200	248 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	King Tut	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
340 @ 8225	257 @ 3700	SAE (J1349)	EAS	STOCK, 91US, DCT
339 @ 8100	249 @ 3750	SAE (J1349)	Green-Eggs	STOCK, 91US, DCT
338 @ 8200	247 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	Sleeper	STOCK, 91US, DCT
337 @ 8200	254 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	DLSJ5	STOCK, 91US, DCT
337 @ 8200	248 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	Fabspeed	STOCK, 93US, DCT
337 @ 8000	247 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	JonMartin	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
336 @ 8250	248 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	mexicanmike	STOCK, 91US, DCT
334 @ 8250	246 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rldzhao	STOCK, 93US, DCT
334 @ 8000	235 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Joey@Fabspeed	STOCK, 93US, DCT
333 @ 8150	246 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	dcstep	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
333 @ 8050	241 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	m33	STOCK, 93US, 6MT
332 @ 7810	249 @ 3950	SAE (J1349)	KZ	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
327 @ 8150	242 @ 4010	SAE (J1349)	catpat8000	STOCK, 91US, DCT
324 @ 7900	252 @ 3800	SAE (J1349)	Nick@Jlevi SW	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
322 @ 8200	238 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	PencilGeek	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
321 @ 8150	238 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rom3n	STOCK, 91US, DCT
320 @ 8200	238 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	Rom3n	STOCK, 91US, DCT
319 @ 8150	245 @ 4000	SAE (J1349)	tightie	STOCK, 91US, 6MT
312 @ 7800	238 @ 3900	SAE (J1349)	FStop7	STOCK, 91US, 6MT

Based on this data (which is awesome!) there are a couple things we can say:

1, The average output for a stock M3 is 335hp on a dynojet.

2, The standard deviation is 10 hp. This means that 2/3 of stock M3s will dyno between 325 and 345 hp and 95% of stock M3s will dyno between 315 and 355 hp.

catpat8000 · 02-20-2014, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ezio

why arent there cam/head options ? the stock setup is surely not the most aggressive the engine can go.

There are cam options. Schrick makes S65 cams in varying degrees of wildness. And it is crystal clear from the stroker dyno graphs they could use more cam overlap and duration. There was a previous thread where we calculated cams might be good for upwards of 40-50 hp.

The factory heads are reputed to be very good. As RG says, when you look through the intake ports, they are pretty smooth, pretty direct, and there doesn't appear to be a lot of material to remove.

The thing we all ought to remember is that this is a built motor from the factory but it's only 4 liters.

Mit_Boost · 02-20-2014, 10:43 PM

The S65 Strokers are far from "cost effective" and really don't have a place in "street" cars where you can you pick up any of the proven supercharger kits for ~1/2 the cost. If you want to stay N/A, then go FBO and enjoy very similar power at a VERY reduced rate (albeit much lower TQ numbers).

IMO, if you're buying a stroker it's for a track car and get get it from a race quality builder (like VAC) who'll give you a complete build -- Heads, Cams, Crank, Pistons, Rods, Sleeves, etc.

MrStinky · 02-20-2014, 11:25 PM

Exactly clears point Kawasaki made that the intake, manifold and throttle bodies flows more than enough air for a supercharger let alone a stock car and why any cold air intake or din an elbow just cannot increase power given enough air flow is there stock.

And if you gear down and stay in 6500-8500 range than FBO seems to provide equal power however if you want a lazier ride to make power lower rpm than stroker may be good.

With fairness to stroker guys, the M3 gets has the same intake manifold and heads as regular M3 and BMW still increased size of just bottom end. Although not a lot more power is there

Hujan · 02-20-2014, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mit_Boost

The S65 Strokers are far from "cost effective" and really don't have a place in "street" cars where you can you pick up any of the proven supercharger kits for ~1/2 the cost. If you want to stay N/A, then go FBO and enjoy very similar power at a VERY reduced rate (albeit much lower TQ numbers).

IMO, if you're buying a stroker it's for a track car and get get it from a race quality builder (like VAC) who'll give you a complete build -- Heads, Cams, Crank, Pistons, Rods, Sleeves, etc.

Well said.

regular guy · 02-21-2014, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longboarder

I gave you mine RG maybe it never made it up there.

I made 365 STD on 91 octane DCT 2013.

There's a guy back east that made 371 on a really cold day with a stock 2013 DCT on 93 octane.

Fixed. I didn't realize I was four entries behind on your stuff. It's all there now. Please check for accuracy. If you have any newer ones, then please send the files.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom @ eas

We've had a few 400whp FBO M3s on the dyno. Kiav's for example:

We posted a few in this thread: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=788241

Got one of them tonight...will look at the others in that thread tomorrow.

catpat8000 · 02-21-2014, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by catpat8000

Based on this data (which is awesome!) there are a couple things we can say:

1, The average output for a stock M3 is 335hp on a dynojet.

2, The standard deviation is 10 hp. This means that 2/3 of stock M3s will dyno between 325 and 345 hp and 95% of stock M3s will dyno between 315 and 355 hp.

Also, forgot to add a couple more points, just for interest:

3, The average output for a stock M3 running 91 AKI is ~330 hp, stddev 9.

4, The output for a stock M3 running 93 or 94 AKI is ~340 hp, stddev 7.

In these cases, there aren't enough samples to make as confident a prediction as in 1 and 2 above but the benefit of higher octane is clear.

Pat

02-20-2014, 06:20 PM	#70
MrStinky Banned 8 Rep 182 Posts Drives: m3 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: usa iTrader: (0)	I would say stock M3 healthy dyno 335-350. Never seen one near 360. Otherwise agreee
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02-20-2014, 10:43 PM	#84
Mit_Boost Captain 135 Rep 692 Posts Drives: E90 335 Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: NJ iTrader: (0)	The S65 Strokers are far from "cost effective" and really don't have a place in "street" cars where you can you pick up any of the proven supercharger kits for ~1/2 the cost. If you want to stay N/A, then go FBO and enjoy very similar power at a VERY reduced rate (albeit much lower TQ numbers). IMO, if you're buying a stroker it's for a track car and get get it from a race quality builder (like VAC) who'll give you a complete build -- Heads, Cams, Crank, Pistons, Rods, Sleeves, etc. __________________ Results >
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02-20-2014, 11:25 PM	#85
MrStinky Banned 8 Rep 182 Posts Drives: m3 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: usa iTrader: (0)	Exactly clears point Kawasaki made that the intake, manifold and throttle bodies flows more than enough air for a supercharger let alone a stock car and why any cold air intake or din an elbow just cannot increase power given enough air flow is there stock. And if you gear down and stay in 6500-8500 range than FBO seems to provide equal power however if you want a lazier ride to make power lower rpm than stroker may be good. With fairness to stroker guys, the M3 gets has the same intake manifold and heads as regular M3 and BMW still increased size of just bottom end. Although not a lot more power is there
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