Why should I NOT buy this RS4?

mkoesel · 07-19-2008, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mashit

It will years before the next RS4 arrives.

Until then he can get the current RS4, that was launched in 2006.

Definitely not a great idea to plan on trading in a car in two years. That's what he'll want to do when the B8 RS4 arives. That's why (or, just one reason why) the M3 is the better choice - it'll be current for the next 5 to 6 years.

mchm3 · 07-19-2008, 08:36 AM

i went from a rs4 to my m3 and im so glad the rs4 is so slow the awd kills it but if you do get the rs4 i have a milltek exhaust 4 sale

malter2.0 · 07-19-2008, 06:24 PM

Quote:

At the end of the day... for me I'm still leaning towards the M since

you already answered your question.

porsche
benz
bmw
audi
vw

German pyramid. in that order.

Bunkei · 07-19-2008, 06:32 PM

Price is too high, especially for a car at the end of its model cycle. You could possibly buy the upcoming RS4 (based on the new A4/A5) for not much more money.

At first, I thought Audi's high price for this car was due to the weak dollar, but after looking at the price of the M3, IS-F, and even the C63, the weed must really be good in Ingolstadt (sp?)

gadget · 07-19-2008, 06:32 PM

get the ///M3, if we thought the RS4 was better than the M3, then why would I be on this forum???

mashit · 07-19-2008, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Definitely not a great idea to plan on trading in a car in two years. That's what he'll want to do when the B8 RS4 arives. That's why (or, just one reason why) the M3 is the better choice - it'll be current for the next 5 to 6 years.

A lot of people including myself get new cars every 2-3 years. So I really wouldn't factor that in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bunkei

Price is too high, especially for a car at the end of its model cycle. You could possibly buy the upcoming RS4 (based on the new A4/A5) for not much more money.

You guys make it sound like the next RS4 is just around the corner. The new A4 hasn't even hit the showrooms. Then next in line would be the S4. And finally they would release the RS4. The next gen RS4 is easily 2-3 years away.

mkoesel · 07-20-2008, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mashit

A lot of people including myself get new cars every 2-3 years. So I really wouldn't factor that in.

Right, well I happen to know the OP is on a tight budget based on his other threads. Trading in early usually (though not always) ends up costing you more money in the form of depreciation, so like I said, it is not something to plan on.

Quote:

You guys make it sound like the next RS4 is just around the corner. The new A4 hasn't even hit the showrooms. Then next in line would be the S4. And finally they would release the RS4. The next gen RS4 is easily 2-3 years away.

Doesn't matter if the next RS4 is coming. B7 = old. I would not have bought an E46 M3 in 2006 either, knowing the bodystyle is going bye-bye. Just my personal preference though.

Voltigeur · 07-22-2008, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malter2.0

you already answered your question.

porsche
benz
bmw
audi
vw

German pyramid. in that order.

Sorry, this is

Depends where you live. In Germany the trio of BMW/Merc/Audi is seen much more on par, so then it comes down to which state (in Bayern I tend to see more Bimmers and Audis, in Baden-Wurttemberg more Mercs relatively) in which you live.

Porsche is in its own special niche w/ its long racing heritage and product range emphasizing 2-doors (vs 4 doors for the rest), commanding the highest margins - but a much lower production run vis-a-vis the others.

AMG is also niche. And so are the M and RS cars. Porsche's Panamerica is their entrant to go after the M5, E incl. CLS AMG crowd.

And then there's the mass market: VW / Opel / Ford. But even BMW and Audi & Merc 'play' in this space w/ models that don't even come here like:

BMW: 1ers and 3ers w/ smaller engines / diesels
Merc: A-class, B-class
Audi: A2 and A3 w/ smaller engined / diesels

Back on topic: if I lived in Canada or similar climes I'd go RS4. But in the warmth give me the playful M3 - and I think the coupe looks sportier. Also a good point above re the new A4 [B8 platform] coming.

footie · 07-22-2008, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malter2.0

you already answered your question.

porsche
benz
bmw
audi
vw

German pyramid. in that order.

I think that is a very old German Pyramid, in some German circle the Audi is seen above both the Merc and the BMW. To some people that very fact that BMW are reducing their prices and chasing sales has cheapened the brand.

Voltigeur · 07-22-2008, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footie

I think that is a very old German Pyramid, in some German circle the Audi is seen above both the Merc and the BMW. To some people that very fact that BMW are reducing their prices and chasing sales has cheapened the brand.

I also queried this. I know wealthy Germans who regarded Merc as having gone too far downmarket and down in QC - and since then have been buying nothing but Audis / Bimmers. And AMG has has taken some of the old Merc mantle for exclusivity (leaving aside the sad experiment of Maybach - if you want that kind of ride buy a Roller!

)

malter2.0 · 07-22-2008, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footie

I think that is a very old German Pyramid, in some German circle the Audi is seen above both the Merc and the BMW. To some people that very fact that BMW are reducing their prices and chasing sales has cheapened the brand.

are you on crack? both porsche and benz carry huge heritage. porsche in racing, benz in innovation. i prefer bmw to all, but to say audi or bmw are close to first two is ridiculous.

bmw and audi will never have classics that will sell for this kind of money...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cars-...em250271962602

bmw will always be sportier of the three (minus porsche), but benz is in its own league, just as porsche is in its own.

mixja · 07-23-2008, 06:32 AM

I just sold my RS4, loved it, performance is weak at first but as the engine loosens up it gets better and better (at 10,000 miles it was starting to hit its straps). Mind you my RS4 had ECU remap, full Milltek downpipes + exhaust, ceramic brakes and sports suspension plus (which really helped its handling). In that state it felt quicker than a stock M3 manual (especially low RPM torque), but M3 DCT felt quite a bit quicker at high RPMs (and the equal of the modded RS4 at low RPM), particularly in 3rd/4th gears...

I wouldn't go for the M3 Manual - the manual box in the M3 is far inferior IMO to the RS4 box and the ratios are too tall for an engine with such a wide power band. If you've never experienced the RS4 box then the M3 box is passable, but once you've driven the RS4 manual, it does show up the M3 manual transmission and clutch.

The M3 DCT on the other hand makes the M3 "special" IMO, and I've consequently got one on order now.

footie · 07-23-2008, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malter2.0

are you on crack? both porsche and benz carry huge heritage. porsche in racing, benz in innovation. i prefer bmw to all, but to say audi or bmw are close to first two is ridiculous.

bmw and audi will never have classics that will sell for this kind of money...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cars-...em250271962602

bmw will always be sportier of the three (minus porsche), but benz is in its own league, just as porsche is in its own.

I was saying that some people see the Audi to be as good as Merc or BMW or even better in some areas, I never said that it was above Porsche.

Voltigeur · 07-23-2008, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footie

I was saying that some people see the Audi to be as good as Merc or BMW or even better in some areas, I never said that it was above Porsche.

Admittedly, getting

but agree - that's why Porsche's margins are so fat.

And @malter2: Audi does have an amazing heritage, it's called Auto Union!

http://www.autounion.org.uk/

And BMW has the cool WWI aircraft engine heritage

http://www.flyingbrick.de/GB/the_bmw_factory.html

footie · 07-23-2008, 01:02 PM

I wouldn't want to throw the racing heritage into an argument but even Porsche don't have the lengthy history of both Mercedes and Audi. Back when both were racing at over 400km/h on the Autobahn, Porsche wasn't a company and BMW only had a very limited car history, while only really coming to the sport in the late 60's.

Most people see Audi as a brand invented by VW to move them up market but the fact is that Audi(Horch) has a very long history second only to Benz.

07-19-2008, 08:36 AM	#24
mchm3 Private 4 Rep 78 Posts Drives: 08 m3 dct Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Miami iTrader: (0)	i went from a rs4 to my m3 and im so glad the rs4 is so slow the awd kills it but if you do get the rs4 i have a milltek exhaust 4 sale __________________ 11 e90/ adv5.0 trak funks/ AA stage 2 Blower, AA exhaust , race x pipe 10 Matte black E63 ADV1 05
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07-19-2008, 06:32 PM	#26
Bunkei Anti-Fanboy 68 Rep 572 Posts Drives: 2018 BMW M4 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Seattle, WA iTrader: (0)	Price is too high, especially for a car at the end of its model cycle. You could possibly buy the upcoming RS4 (based on the new A4/A5) for not much more money. At first, I thought Audi's high price for this car was due to the weak dollar, but after looking at the price of the M3, IS-F, and even the C63, the weed must really be good in Ingolstadt (sp?)
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07-19-2008, 06:32 PM	#27
gadget Major 108 Rep 1,161 Posts Drives: 09 e92///M SSII DCT Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: US iTrader: (0)	get the ///M3, if we thought the RS4 was better than the M3, then why would I be on this forum???
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07-23-2008, 06:32 AM	#34
mixja Captain 50 Rep 780 Posts Drives: 2011 E90 DCT Silverstone Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Beverly Hils, CA iTrader: (1)	I just sold my RS4, loved it, performance is weak at first but as the engine loosens up it gets better and better (at 10,000 miles it was starting to hit its straps). Mind you my RS4 had ECU remap, full Milltek downpipes + exhaust, ceramic brakes and sports suspension plus (which really helped its handling). In that state it felt quicker than a stock M3 manual (especially low RPM torque), but M3 DCT felt quite a bit quicker at high RPMs (and the equal of the modded RS4 at low RPM), particularly in 3rd/4th gears... I wouldn't go for the M3 Manual - the manual box in the M3 is far inferior IMO to the RS4 box and the ratios are too tall for an engine with such a wide power band. If you've never experienced the RS4 box then the M3 box is passable, but once you've driven the RS4 manual, it does show up the M3 manual transmission and clutch. The M3 DCT on the other hand makes the M3 "special" IMO, and I've consequently got one on order now.
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07-23-2008, 01:02 PM	#37
footie Major General 1122 Rep 8,017 Posts Drives: i5M60 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: No where fast iTrader: (0) Garage List 2024 BMW i5M60 [0.00] 2022 BMW i4M50 [0.00] 2020 BMW M5 Competi ... [0.00] 2008 E92 M3 [0.00]	I wouldn't want to throw the racing heritage into an argument but even Porsche don't have the lengthy history of both Mercedes and Audi. Back when both were racing at over 400km/h on the Autobahn, Porsche wasn't a company and BMW only had a very limited car history, while only really coming to the sport in the late 60's. Most people see Audi as a brand invented by VW to move them up market but the fact is that Audi(Horch) has a very long history second only to Benz.
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