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      03-26-2020, 12:41 AM   #1
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Considering going from M2C to E92 M3, input appreciated!

Hi guys,

I currently have my M2C which I bought last year, thinking I would enjoy the torque and efficiency from the turbo engine. I do, but I just feel that I don't "need" it. I love the wonderful chassis and nimbleness of the M2, especially after some upgrades. And after adding an Akrapovic exhaust it actually sounded decent (personal opinion). However, I can't help but think about the sensation of E92 with NA V8 and hydraulic steering, and recently I'm wondering if this is the right time (or perhaps too late) to own an E92? Another reason is that the M2C is so new, I'm always worried about scratches and etc, and I feel like it's just a waste only driving it a few times a week.

Anyways, I've put the M2C up for sale for now (FS thread: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?t=1706168z), and started to look at the E92 market. I would really appreciate insights in looking for the specs I want (11-13, 6MT, no nav and no moonroof) and just buying the E92 in general. Obviously there are the rod bearings and throttle actuators, but realistically how much should I prepare to have all the preventative maintenance (making the car as reliable as possible) done? What mileage should I be looking at? Anything else I should know buying an almost ten years old car? I understand I'll be losing some money, but I feel that I would regret not being able to own one of the classics at the right time.

Thanks for your time!

Last edited by M2 GT; 03-26-2020 at 09:46 AM..
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      03-26-2020, 01:06 AM   #2
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"Relaxing to not have to be so careful with an old E9M"... Sorry to say mate but assuming you find the right E92 i.e crazy clean, you will end up looking after it the same way, or more! Instead of new, the element of classic with no more to get is introduced...

Good luck!
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      03-26-2020, 01:33 AM   #3
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Maybe 5k
Rod bearings
Throttle actuator
Valve cover leak
Diff leak
Transmission leak? Not sure about MT but dct for sure.
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      03-26-2020, 05:36 AM   #4
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I assume you've had significant seat time in an E9x M3 before? If not, make sure you drive one extensively now, so you'll understand the nuances of the car, the feel of the chassis and the engine. I've had the M2C for 18 months now, and the E90 M3 for 8 years, so I back to back drive them a fair amount.

Secondly, I would definitely return the M2C to completely stock and sell off all the parts. This will accomplish two things: net you a *ton* more money, and allow you to sell the car much faster, especially in today's terrible environment. Finding someone who will pay for all the mods is highly unlikely. The vast majority of M2C buyers would purchase a brand new car significantly cheaper (and deals way under MSRP are common now everywhere) and then decide later on about mods.
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      03-26-2020, 08:43 AM   #5
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I would agree with the 5k number but depending how you buy it a lot of these items can be saved for much later. I've only had to take care of the diff leak and a faulty oil sensor on mine. Plan to do rod bearings and motor mounts shortly. Throttle actuators are an as-they-break item. My DCT is weeping but its nothing bad so I'm holding off.
I bought my car with 42,700 back in September. Super clean fully loaded comp pack. Couldn't be happier with it, wouldn't change a thing. Comp pack is a must if for the glorious 359 wheels only. Still can't believe the car you get for the money with these things. Personally I don't see the draw of the no-nav and a DCT will be easier to find. I understand the draw of a 6MT but I do feel the DCT pairs much better with the high revving nature of the S65 and the adjustability is nice. For the age and with the GTS tune the DCT is lightning fast - have you driven one to compare? Again these are more personal preference but just walking you through some of my thought process when buying mine.
P.S. Your M2C is perfect.
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      03-26-2020, 09:28 AM   #6
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Sheesh, man, unless it's a serious cash flow issue, dance with one you brung. Grass ain't necessarily greener over here.
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      03-26-2020, 09:38 AM   #7
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If you have a car you are scared to drive because it is too new or you think it is too special, buy a different car that you will drive and enjoy.
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      03-26-2020, 10:01 AM   #8
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If you have a car you are scared to drive because it is too new or you think it is too special, buy a different car that you will drive and enjoy.

Bingo. Cars are depreciating assets. Just drive it and enjoy it.


You wouldn't believe how many people ask me why I take such a "nice" car to the track. Maybe because it's so much fun and I just want another excuse to drive it the way the manufacturer intended?
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      03-26-2020, 10:52 AM   #9
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JK Idk if its the right move for you or not, but I wouldnt go at it thinking youll be less cautious from a dings and dents pov. If you are the kind of person that cares much about the M2C youll care the same about an E9X M3. Its a fun car. I think a reasonable number for cost immediately after purchase for a MT car would be around 3k. That will get you RBs w/motor mounts, engine air filter and new plugs. Thats a good place to start.

Ive got an itch for an M2 right now. Its not in the cards, but it doesnt mean I dont want one.
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      03-26-2020, 11:05 AM   #10
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I'd prefer to have the service history. If not, I'd do oil change, brake fluid, diff fluid, spark plugs, assess the brake pads/rotors. IOW what I'd do with pretty much any used car purchase at this age. do the motor mounts with the rod bearings. plan on suspension refresh around 80-100K. pretty standard stuff. weeping dct pan and valve covers are a judgement call on when to deal with. the car is a lot of fun and you'd be at the lower end of the depreciation curve. if you can DIY some of the routine things, ownership cost is nothing out of the ordinary.
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      03-26-2020, 11:23 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2 GT View Post
Hi guys,

I currently have my M2C which I bought last year, thinking I would enjoy the torque and efficiency from the turbo engine. I do, but I just feel that I don't "need" it. I love the wonderful chassis and nimbleness of the M2, especially after some upgrades. And after adding an Akrapovic exhaust it actually sounded decent (personal opinion). However, I can't help but think about the sensation of E92 with NA V8 and hydraulic steering, and recently I'm wondering if this is the right time (or perhaps too late) to own an E92? Another reason is that the M2C is so new, I'm always worried about scratches and etc, and I feel like it's just a waste only driving it a few times a week.

Anyways, I've put the M2C up for sale for now (FS thread: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?t=1706168z), and started to look at the E92 market. I would really appreciate insights in looking for the specs I want (11-13, 6MT, no nav and no moonroof) and just buying the E92 in general. Obviously there are the rod bearings and throttle actuators, but realistically how much should I prepare to have all the preventative maintenance (making the car as reliable as possible) done? What mileage should I be looking at? Anything else I should know buying an almost ten years old car? I understand I'll be losing some money, but I feel that I would regret not being able to own one of the classics at the right time.

Thanks for your time!
I don't think you're too late at all, it's not like these cars have significantly appreciated yet (not that I care, I'm keeping mine forever).

Have you driven one before? May I recommend you go do so before pulling the trigger? 2 things in my opinion
1) The E9x will feel like a physically larger car. I couldn't help but feel like I was sitting in something the size of an E46 M3 when I drove the M2C
2) I prefer the feel of an NA engine, especially one as great as the S65. It "might" feel slow for you if you're used to an S55.

Personally, I can see myself adding an M2C, but I just don't see them very comparable in terms of characteristics to an E9X M3.
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      03-26-2020, 11:46 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2 GT View Post
Hi guys,

I currently have my M2C which I bought last year, thinking I would enjoy the torque and efficiency from the turbo engine. I do, but I just feel that I don't "need" it. I love the wonderful chassis and nimbleness of the M2, especially after some upgrades. And after adding an Akrapovic exhaust it actually sounded decent (personal opinion). However, I can't help but think about the sensation of E92 with NA V8 and hydraulic steering, and recently I'm wondering if this is the right time (or perhaps too late) to own an E92? Another reason is that the M2C is so new, I'm always worried about scratches and etc, and I feel like it's just a waste only driving it a few times a week.

Anyways, I've put the M2C up for sale for now (FS thread: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?t=1706168z), and started to look at the E92 market. I would really appreciate insights in looking for the specs I want (11-13, 6MT, no nav and no moonroof) and just buying the E92 in general. Obviously there are the rod bearings and throttle actuators, but realistically how much should I prepare to have all the preventative maintenance (making the car as reliable as possible) done? What mileage should I be looking at? Anything else I should know buying an almost ten years old car? I understand I'll be losing some money, but I feel that I would regret not being able to own one of the classics at the right time.

Thanks for your time!
I currently have a 2017 M2. Sold my 2011 E90 M3 last August and I regret it everyday. It's all personal preference but the M3 just felt like a raw machine. You cannot beat the sound of the V8. Once this coronavirus garbage dies down I am selling my M2 and looking for another E90/E92 M3. I am in no way bashing the M2. It is a capable car and the torque is amazing. The M3 just speaks to me more and brings me more joy. At the end of the day no one cares about 0-60 times. It's all about your connection to your car. With that being said you may not feel the same way without actually having adequate seat time with an M3.

Besides the rod bearings and throttle actuators you just need to make sure you do basic maintenance to keep the car running properly. Spark plugs, oil change every 5-7k, air filter, fluids etc.
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      03-26-2020, 11:51 AM   #13
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Good time to pick up a clean E9XM! M2C is nice but most here prefer the S65.
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      03-26-2020, 12:13 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W/// View Post
I don't think you're too late at all, it's not like these cars have significantly appreciated yet (not that I care, I'm keeping mine forever).

Have you driven one before? May I recommend you go do so before pulling the trigger? 2 things in my opinion
1) The E9x will feel like a physically larger car. I couldn't help but feel like I was sitting in something the size of an E46 M3 when I drove the M2C
2) I prefer the feel of an NA engine, especially one as great as the S65. It "might" feel slow for you if you're used to an S55.

Personally, I can see myself adding an M2C, but I just don't see them very comparable in terms of characteristics to an E9X M3.
You weren't sitting in something the size of an E46 M3...it was smaller! That's one thing we love about the M2C - it's size, especially with the coming G80 M3 as big or bigger than my old E39 M5.

Driving one back to back, just sitting in the cars, I feel like I'm sitting "on" the M3 while I feel like I'm sitting "in" the M2C. The M4 seats are wonderful in that car, and the driving position is also much better than the E90 M3 (for me, I'm 6'2"). The steering wheel has a huge range of adjustment in the M2C, so I can put the seat well back for my legs and then get the perfect wheel location plus the shifter falls right to hand. In the M3, the wheel doesn't extend as far, the seat is higher up feeling (always have it as low as possible), and the shifter is further away -- it's a compromise feeling. Interestingly, compared to my E39 M5, I loved the way I fit in the E90 M3 compared to it.

The M2C is a fantastic chassis and engine (once you get used to the S55, and that takes time and experience). The steering is improved over the M2, and has ok feedback at/near/over the limits of the front tires. The Active-M LSD is a masterpiece, especially compared to the Visco-Lok unit in the E9x M3. It truly makes that car feel really awesome on track or an autox, or even on the 1/2 mile skidpad at 60+mph drifting. It's like it already knows what you're going to do and it's ready and willing: slow speed corner entry after braking 10/10ths from 100mph to a 35mph entry? The LSD is mostly opened up as you're easing off the braking and starting to trailbrake, so the car turns in like a banshee. Once you're just adding power at the apex, it's increasing locking percentage and right there for you...none of the required inside tire spin the Visco-Lok requires to generate locking force.

Back to back driving, the M3 feels lethargic, heavy, and large compared to the M2C, and my M3 has 9.5/10.5" wheels with larger front and rear sway bars, so it has a much nicer turn-in and feel than a stock one. The M2C is still stock and will likely remain that way since I don't feel the need to change anything. I still love the E90 M3, and it's not going anyplace though...never going to be a car like it again.
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      03-26-2020, 02:48 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
"Relaxing to not have to be so careful with an old E9M"... Sorry to say mate but assuming you find the right E92 i.e crazy clean, you will end up looking after it the same way, or more! Instead of new, the element of classic with no more to get is introduced...

Good luck!
Yeah if you find something you feel is rare and hard to replace you're going to be more worried than you are about the M2C. The M2C is currently easy to replace with a new or used one.

I own both cars basically and they both have their positive and negatives. The e9x M3 positive over the M2/C is basically JUST the engine. The hydraulic steering too but I don't miss it if I drive the M2 for a while, I only miss the engine.

In the E9x M3 I miss pretty much everything about the M2 besides the engine.
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      03-26-2020, 03:44 PM   #16
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Does the M2C hide its weight well? I saw the weight figure is pretty similar to E9xM platform. I rather get something a lot lighter if I want something smaller tbh. S2000 might be up your ally if you want something more "raw" and something you don't need to worry about much in public. Its not something I would call a beater, but mechanicals to body panels are a lot cheaper.
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      03-26-2020, 04:59 PM   #17
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I think that right now has got to be the best time to get into a "nice" E9X car. Ones that have few owners and haven't been ragged out and offer a decent value for your dollar ratio. That said, you are going to take a massive bath on your M2C. I can see where this could be a struggle. On one hand you have an NA German muscle car, on the other hand you have a pocket sized missile that is much nicer with creature comforts and conveniences. With the M2 proposition it is lose money now, or lose money later because the depreciation is coming. On the M3 it is easy to find a nice clean coupe right now - unless I was under financial duress I think I would stick with the M2C. The C will hold value far better than the standard M2's over time.
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      Yesterday, 06:15 AM   #18
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I will also add to this after some more thought as I drove my E92 M3 to work today. The E9x M3 is still the only BMW that has that magic for me (I also own an E36 M3 and Z4MR which I enjoy very much).

But there's just nothing like the S65, and there will never be anything like it. To this day, I remember the first time I drove an E92 M3 for the first (Performance Center event) and the first time I had one for a weekend (rented from BMW Welt). The car just feels more expensive than it is to me if that makes sense. I remember I only slept 3 hours that night I had the rented M3. I could not stop driving it and had such fond memories of it (Moonstone on Rust).

The E9x M3 is not a perfect car by any means, but it is for me. I'm not letting this one go, although I could see myself selling both the Z4MR and E36 for a Porsche in the distant future.
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      Yesterday, 10:25 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E90M3velocity View Post
Does the M2C hide its weight well? I saw the weight figure is pretty similar to E9xM platform. I rather get something a lot lighter if I want something smaller tbh. S2000 might be up your ally if you want something more "raw" and something you don't need to worry about much in public. Its not something I would call a beater, but mechanicals to body panels are a lot cheaper.
Having owned a s2000, 2 e90 M3s and now a m2c I feel like I should chime in.

The M2C hides it weight well despite the specs. For me the front end feels significantly different than the e9x with the v8 despite the balance of the weight being similar on both cars and I guess this could be attributed to the factory suspension tuning or I just havent pushed the M2C enough yet.

They're all good cars, i think the e9x is my favorite platform but the M2C is nice in its own right for what it is and for a "modern" bmw platform. If i move back to a e9x, there will be things in the M2C i will miss and right now there are things that i miss in the e9x. There is no perfect car.
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      Yesterday, 01:10 PM   #20
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I would really spend some time driving the e9x as it's very different from most other V8s on the market. The torque you claim to not need is pretty addicting once you've had it for a while. When you drive an e9x M3 it definitely feels lacking down low. I don't mind it at all personally, but it seems to be a common complaint with these cars. I've driven several M2c back to back with my e92 and while the M2 is a VERY nice car, it wasn't enough to make me want to sell my car for one. Though if I started out with an M2c, I'm not sure I'd be all that interested in getting into an M3. I guess it depends on what you value, but if you went ahead and bought an M2 in the first place, things like steering feel isn't a huge thing for you (it isn't for me, FYI).

So spend some time in the M3 before you commit to one.
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      Yesterday, 03:18 PM   #21
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I really don't get all of the lack of torque comments on these forums. The S65 is very linear, and pulls fine down low.

I've owned a FBO F80 before this so that's my frame of reference. I really never once thought my DCT E90 was lacking in any way, in fact sometimes it surprises me how well it pulls everywhere.

I've also owned an S2000 so I get what people mean when they talk about torque, now that car needed to be revved up. The S65? I don't agree at all in terms of it being a problem or a notable "flaw"

anyway, I don't like the feel of new BMW's, plus not a fan of the looks of the M2 or 2 series so my default answer given this choice is a no brainer.

If you're are going to get an E90 I agree set aside 3-5K for issues noted above to be addressed or fixed, get new plugs no matter what (these motors are very sensitive to even plugs that are 15K miles old) and get any exhaust that you like and enjoy. It's a very raw machine and IMO the last of the classic BMW's that drive a certain way. The new BMW's feel like vanilla Ice cream...
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      Yesterday, 03:34 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neilum View Post

anyway, I don't like the feel of new BMW's, plus not a fan of the looks of the M2 or 2 series so my default answer given this choice is a no brainer.
I was very much in the same camp ... I preferred the E46 M3 (or a F06 M6) over the M2 as a second car for the E92, until I saw this one on the forums. Definitely has me considering changing my mind (still give the edge to a nice E46 CSL clone, but it's close).
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