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07-12-2013, 12:49 PM | #89 |
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At least in Europe DCT option came some years later than the introduction of the M3.... so that's the reason why (preLCI) first sales have a lot more manuals.
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07-12-2013, 01:48 PM | #90 |
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07-12-2013, 01:49 PM | #91 |
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07-12-2013, 02:08 PM | #92 | |
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07-12-2013, 02:20 PM | #93 |
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That's how I got my car. March '08 build, arrived at dealer in September of '08, sat there for 18 months until I bought it in April of 2010 with 280 miles on it, 10 of which were my test drive. They got this car allotted to them along with half a dozen loaded or nearly loaded cars over that 18 month period, and in keeping with the times the haves had to have, so the ones who just wanted all the options on the latest and greatest M car snapped up the loaded-up cars within a few weeks of arrival but my car with only a couple of options sat there waiting for someone who appreciated less idrive and more headroom...
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07-12-2013, 02:26 PM | #94 |
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Intersting figures. Thanks for posting.
I think it's difficult to make sweeping generalizations about buyer preference, particularly by country. There are so many reasons why people go DCT or Manual. One of my partners at work will only order stripped down cars that have only a manual. He's from Geneva and has only ordered manual cars. Another friend of mine ordered his E93 so he could cheap it out and only get nav. He isn't what I'd call an enthusiast but he enjoys a manual and really didn't want to add $2900 to the cost of his lease.. I have never owned a manual car and now as tech got better, I find it less compelling to go backwards in development to a transmission I'm no better than average at operating. So DCT wins for me every time. If and only if I ended up buying a weekend car that was older, would I only consider a manual transmission. Cars I'd consider for purchase down the road as a fun car would be a 993 S wide body or 993 turbo or hell, I'd even pick up an E36 M3 project car if I found a clean example because it was my dream car as a teen. These cars had horrendous slow auto boxes so the manual is the only way to go. |
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07-12-2013, 02:59 PM | #95 | |
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If you really press them on it, (and I've asked a few) they'll tell you it allows them to focus on executing one less thing behind the wheel, which makes them feel faster and more in control, not less (contrary to the "MT allows more control" argument which is objectively true but that's theory and we live in reality) when driving quickly Both great options, I chose the one I wanted but if the M3 was DCT only I'd be sad but it'd still be a great automobile Now, why anyone would choose an E92 when the E90 was available I have no idea (kidding...)
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07-12-2013, 04:00 PM | #96 |
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So I wonder how many E92 x drive 6MT cars were produced? 2012?
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07-12-2013, 04:11 PM | #97 | |
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And as to the rest of your post. I've driven MT's my entire driving life, and BMW MT's for 12 years before I got my present car. Would never even consider an automagic. Not saying I was an ace, but I have tracked my cars for years and was proficient. First time I ever drove the DCT was at the Performance Center in SC, when the best BMW salesman I've ever seen set me up to test the M3 when i told him I was considering it. And I was miserable at it, because my right hand kept reaching for the gearshift and my left foot almost punched through the floorboard. But after the instructor duct taped my right hand to the wheel, I was flat sold on it. Given the choice, I'd go DCT every time. I see and respect what you're saying about the satisfaction derived from wringing out a car using more coordination and effort. But as for me...I ain't goin' back. |
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07-12-2013, 04:22 PM | #98 |
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Waited for an 08 DCT E92 to be available even though I was driving MT for 25+ years. Got myself the 2013 E92 again but it took me 6 months to decide on what type of trans to get. Took delivery of another DCT E92M3. Resistance to the Borg is futile.
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07-12-2013, 05:33 PM | #99 | |
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Agreed. An awful lot of people like to put on the ruse that by driving a manual transmission they are able to "control" the car better. I agree that you do have the final say in what your car does when you're in a manual but facing the probable fact, a lot of manual drivers cannot operate a manual transmission to an expert level where the driver input is spot on all the time. As long as what I input is not close to perfect and this remains my only car I daily drive, I'll choose a transmission that is idiot proof so I can concentrate more on either the coffee in my hand (damn you cupholders) or other aspects of spirited driving that I'm again, not a professional at. That being said, I will gladly give up being able to tell my car its my way or the highway with regards to how I operate it for a transmission that will 98% of the time act exactly as I wish for it to operate. I do enjoy the heck out of driving a manual the infrequent occasions I get to drive one. Just being more involved in the driving process is fun when it's simply for that - fun. |
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07-12-2013, 06:08 PM | #100 | |
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07-12-2013, 06:41 PM | #101 | |
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07-12-2013, 08:59 PM | #102 | |
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My statements about DCT are all physically observable realities. You are trying to falsify reality with a mix-up of semantics, twisting the word "control" outside of its true meaning. This isn't a rhetorical exercise. No need to talk about "objectivity" and "subjectivity" when describing how many physically independent degrees of control exist between the transmission and the driver. There are: MT = 2 degrees, DCT = 1 degree. It is what it is - not debatable -. This is not going to change by how you feel about it. Now let's step to something else that you are souping things up with: "sense of speed" and "having more brain time to focus on other aspects of driving the car". You will not be able to make them pass as "control" when they have strictly nothing to do with it . I am not disagreeing that you are having driving sensations since THESE are purely subjective to each driver. But just think for a second about about how sitting on the passenger front seat in the nurburgring M3 taxi would feel incredibly faster because you have zero control of the car as a passenger. In fact the more you are in control the less fast your driving experience will feel (and the safer if you are the driver!). Ok so DCT lets you better enjoy the cup holders and enjoying beverages while driving (and what else), hey that's great. No kidding. I believe this has not been a small factor when choosing DCT in a country where the drivein was invented. Now about the whole misconception that driving a manual is so difficult that "idiot drivers" (i am quoting your words) could not master it sufficiently to extract every bit of performance out of the M3. That is nonsense. You don't need to drive the car to 99.9% of its capacity to enjoy it (nearly all M3 owners will never be able to drive it to the edge anyway with Manual or DCT). The shifting speed superiority of the DCT is not going to make any significant difference to almost all M3 drivers. but I concede the point about he cup holder enjoyment Not that you could also get that from a true automatic. I want to quote one of my fellow MT driver. He said it much better but it was something along these words: I want the freedom of occasionally missing some of my shifts and hear the engine growl in discontent because that is part of the fun too. My ideal transmission does not exist yet. It would be a manual with clutch pedal that can also be bypassed with DCT. But please no DCT for 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear. Last edited by V8FunNaturally; 07-12-2013 at 09:09 PM.. |
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07-12-2013, 09:07 PM | #104 |
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Anyone know of a source as to sales by color?
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07-12-2013, 10:45 PM | #105 | |
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07-12-2013, 10:45 PM | #106 | |
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07-13-2013, 02:37 AM | #107 |
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This data is even more impressive in regards to the DCT when you factor in that it is a 2,900 dollar option. The DCT will spank the manual in sales with the F80 M3 even more because this time there will be no head start for the manual. As someone above said, resistance to the Borg is futile. IMHO, the DCT was the second best thing about the E9X M3 behind the S65.
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07-13-2013, 02:42 AM | #108 |
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Could be the numbers for E9x Ms lower than E46 Ms due to the fact that 335i models with some not so expensive upgrades are so capable and more friendly as a DD?
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07-13-2013, 03:01 AM | #109 | |
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...but I actually didn't read any of your posts in this entire thread. If you think anything I wrote was in response to anything you wrote up above, it wasn't. Any link was a pure coincidence. |
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07-13-2013, 03:05 AM | #110 | |
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