Harrop Owners Chime In!

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

Any news?

Sorry, I haven't gotten around to installing them. 😖. Ran the existing over these past weekends. Wrenching time has taken a hit with an infant in the house. Have to tread carefully around my wife.

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by DRLane

Sorry, I haven't gotten around to installing them. 😖. Ran the existing over these past weekends. Wrenching time has taken a hit with an infant in the house. Have to tread carefully around my wife.

Congratulations about your new infant. I understand about the need to tip-toe.. Typically it doesn't last too long. The tip-toeing I mean..

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

Congratulations about your new infant. I understand about the need to tip-toe.. Typically it doesn't last too long. The tip-toeing I mean..

Thank you. My wife was supposed to take a 2 week trip to see family. Which was going to be brilliant and allow a lot of car time. Sadly COVID nixed those plans. Can't fully complain I've gotten away for 5 days at the track in the last month. Just not getting to properly work on the car. Going to drop it off at buddy's shop to install SPL arms and oil diverter valve for last NASA TT event in October. Then the car will go into deep hibernation for the fall.

Plans are to redirect the air intake to the front and try to add a second oil cooler in its place to match transmission cooler location. Add the vented fenders, end do a livery wrap for the car.

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by DRLane

Thank you. My wife was supposed to take a 2 week trip to see family. Which was going to be brilliant and allow a lot of car time. Sadly COVID nixed those plans. Can't fully complain I've gotten away for 5 days at the track in the last month. Just not getting to properly work on the car. Going to drop it off at buddy's shop to install SPL arms and oil diverter valve for last NASA TT event in October. Then the car will go into deep hibernation for the fall.

Plans are to redirect the air intake to the front and try to add a second oil cooler in its place to match transmission cooler location. Add the vented fenders, end do a livery wrap for the car.

5 days at the track in a month! Now that's some serious seat time. Well done to you and the car.. Good luck with the upcoming mods and maintenance. Sorry to hear about the WuFlu putting a damper on things. Stay safe and enjoy the little one(s). Oh, and no rush on the spark plug update. Was just wondering.

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

5 days at the track in a month! Now that's some serious seat time. Well done to you and the car.. Good luck with the upcoming mods and maintenance. Sorry to hear about the WuFlu putting a damper on things. Stay safe and enjoy the little one(s). Oh, and no rush on the spark plug update. Was just wondering.

Installed the new racing plugs last night, and changed oil from RL 15w50 to Motul 300v 15w50. Haven't fired it up yet but should be able to give it a proper test at the track Oct 2nd.

Fingers crossed it doesn't throw any misfires because I hate changing the plugs with the Harrop plenum and coolant lines in place. My replacement interval is once a year so I generally have to rediscover how to navigate the coil packs out from the back. I guess it's really just #7.

Anyhow, I'll post my feedback.

[drwankel]

Looking forward to the results. Would absolutely love to get back to 30k plug change intervals.

I'm going to replace my valvecovers soon, and might as well change to these plugs while I am there.

[drwankel]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

7) Now the main shortcoming (if you can call it that, and there are very few with the Harrop kit) is probably the same with all forced induction solutions, and that is crankcase ventilation. By this I mean, I could swear that ever since installing the Harrop it has exacerbated valve cover oil leakage and seepage. In an effort to mitigate it, I replaced both valve cover breathers - but to no avail. Under boost, I think the crankcase is under positive pressure - and so then is the air in the valve covers. This is purely my speculation and I have no data to back up this opinion. For these reasons, my next modification will be an oil catch can, as well as a new PCV valve. There are some good after market ones out there such as the Bimmerworld aluminum oil catch can.

How many others are in this boat? In my reply above I mentioned I was about to replace the valve covers. I had already replaced the gaskets, but am getting seepage, and figured that I need to replace the entire valvecover.

Would be interesting to know how other harrop owners valve cover gaskets are doing. Are they bone dry? The theory about the crankcase being pressurized under boost causing valve cover seepage makes sense.

Definitely don't want to cough up the dough for new valve covers if it wont do anything.

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by drwankel

How many others are in this boat? In my reply above I mentioned I was about to replace the valve covers. I had already replaced the gaskets, but am getting seepage, and figured that I need to replace the entire valvecover.

Would be interesting to know how other harrop owners valve cover gaskets are doing. Are they bone dry? The theory about the crankcase being pressurized under boost causing valve cover seepage makes sense.

Definitely don't want to cough up the dough for new valve covers if it wont do anything.

I have bone dry valve covers. Have 54k miles on the original '08 covers.

Installed the Harrop at 35k miles. Last 5k miles were exclusively miles to/from and on the track.

[Davisca455]

Originally Posted by drwankel

How many others are in this boat? In my reply above I mentioned I was about to replace the valve covers. I had already replaced the gaskets, but am getting seepage, and figured that I need to replace the entire valvecover.

Would be interesting to know how other harrop owners valve cover gaskets are doing. Are they bone dry? The theory about the crankcase being pressurized under boost causing valve cover seepage makes sense.

Definitely don't want to cough up the dough for new valve covers if it wont do anything.

Not a Harrop, but boosted.
2008, 70,0XX miles.
Kit was installed in 2009, so 63,000+ miles on boost.
The driver's side valve cover was removed in 2009 when the kit was installed (to add oil return fitting from pump).
No leaks from either cover so far.

Oil fill cap is dry as well.
No bubbling or peeling on the factory finish.

[CamasM3e93]

Originally Posted by MikeYQM

Hi, my name is Mike and I have a problem. I have the boost bug.

I'm looking for feedback from any Harrop owners out there, I have a couple specific questions:

1. Are there any common bugs with the Harrop system? Either preventable through maintenance or otherwise?

2. Do you have any regrets after jumping on this system?

I've been meaning to post a blurb about my experience with the Harrop supercharger, now about 2 months into ownership on the e93 platform. Some of my experience is unique to the heavier convertible. I've got test pipes, running stock secondary cats and stock exhaust. using factory air intake. I've added a P3 gauge recently with an analog boost sensor.

1. Common bugs - not that I've detected. The car drives like OEM+ in most regards. At idle there is zero boost. At street or freeway cruising speeds under no acceleration, it runs around 0.5 PSI. Under moderate to moderate plus acceleration it runs 3.5 - 5.5 PSI. Wide open throttle I've had boost up to 7.5PSI.

I installed it myself and for the most part a competent wrench turner can pull this off. Before the installation I replaced the tension and deflection pulleys, removed my power pulley and went back to stock, replaced the spark plugs, and addressed the rod bearings. If I had to do it over I would have done throttle actuators as well but I had a time crunch. I had a buddy help me for the last 75% of the project and that extra set of hands made a big difference.

The kit itself had an issue with the alignment of the SC mounts to the holes in the supercharger; I've heard that report from myself and 2 others who've done recent installs. I guess you can call that a common bug. In my kit, the cobra clamps were not properly sourced (wrong number of certain sizes) and I had to make a run for screw hose clamps. Nothing too serious or unworkable. Apart from the prep work I described above, I took about 3 hours breaking the car down and getting everything exposed. Then I went on vacation and returned a week later ready to go. Up and in the garage at around 6am on a Sunday, and I had the car fired up by 9pm. Took about 2 hours to get everything back together the next morning.

I made two errors on the installation: I torqued the deflection pulley too far and that caused it to rub on the water pump pulley, slowing the deflection pulley down. That caused a speed mismatch between the accessory belt and the deflection pulley - the resulting friction melted the belt and caused accessory belt failure on the maiden drive. Thankfully I still had the original pulley and a spare accessory belt and was back on the road quickly. Recommend having two fresh belts for both positions and not throwing away parts. Problem #2 was that I became distracted by the SC mount/SC mounting hole misalignment issue and missed torquing the boots down. I had some power but not all of it and that ended up messing up the adaptations and my boost at high RPMs. Once the throttle boots were properly torqued and adaptations reset, the unit has run well. (I also somehow ran the battery down despite the car being on a trickle charger; that gave me some battery discharge errors to sort through but I recharged the battery and that's been fine since)

The kit on the heavier convertible is a really nice match. I have fresh Michelin Sport all season 4's on the car with the stock 19" wheels. At least with summer driving, I have zero need to go to wider tires. The car does a real nice job holding the power down to the pavement but I could definitely see the reports from others in the lighter e90/e92 of needing more tire on the ground to prevent spinning. The stock DCT e93 is rated at 0-60 in 4.7 seconds. I've clocked the harrop s/c'd e93 DCT with test pipes at 4.0 and 4.1 seconds. I might be able to pull off a 3.9 in the proper conditions. So essentially this kit makes the convertible about as fast or a touch faster than the stock e92, and the same 0-60 of a 2021 porsche 911 coupe. That's quite an accomplishment for a platform that is 13 years old.

Much like the stock S65, the kit really shines on the freeway with freeway speed acceleration and maneuvering. I agree with others that the car drives like a sport bike on the freeway and you have to be extra alert as other drivers won't recognize how quickly you can move around them. Just this morning I had a minivan aggressively on my tail at a freeway interchange. I'm like, really? I dropped the DCT down into 4th and 3 seconds later the guy wasn't even visible in my rearview mirror any longer and the speedometer showed 115. Of course, this was in Mexico.

Any regrets? I'm still appreciating the kit for what it is and being my first supercharger, it's hard for me to say how good this is compared to a centrifugal blower in terms of daily driver drivability. I was expecting a bigger difference in the torque-feel of the car at lower speeds, but I think the 0-60 says it all. The price is a little eye watering and depending on what else you will do to the car as a result, like the list above, plus or minus wider tires in a coupe or sedan, it does add up. Part of me has toyed with the idea that my money would have been better spent on an exhaust upgrade and a carbon fiber plenum - but that's with hindsight and acknowledging that whatever power/speed I end up with I'll adjust to and later want more. Such is the pain of human existence. I would say that the only real regret at this point is the loss of the induction note I had with an aFe conical filter air intake. Back in the factory air box plus the whine of the SC - that to me is a step backward but to each his own. I get feedback from others that they love the whine. Also just a note that mileage has dropped off about 30% (18-19 mpg summer to 14-16mpg SC'd), so it does make a vulnerability of the platform a little more ouchy but I just try not to think about it. All of this said, I'm in no way considering going back to stock and selling the unit. so you can't have it!!! Cheers, everyone.

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by CamasM3e93

I've got test pipes, running stock secondary cats and stock exhaust - using factory air intake.

High flow secondaries [<=200 cpsi] and a higher flow air filter will release even more ponies..

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-pipercro...SABEgJEQvD_BwE

[drwankel]

Originally Posted by DRLane

I have bone dry valve covers. Have 54k miles on the original '08 covers.

Installed the Harrop at 35k miles. Last 5k miles were exclusively miles to/from and on the track.

Thanks.

I'm going to proceed with replacing the valve covers.

[tbuck]

Originally Posted by CamasM3e93

I've been meaning to post a blurb about my experience with the Harrop supercharger, now about 2 months into ownership on the e93 platform. Some of my experience is unique to the heavier convertible. I've got test pipes, running stock secondary cats and stock exhaust. using factory air intake. I've added a P3 gauge recently with an analog boost sensor.

1. Common bugs - not that I've detected. The car drives like OEM+ in most regards. At idle there is zero boost. At street or freeway cruising speeds under no acceleration, it runs around 0.5 PSI. Under moderate to moderate plus acceleration it runs 3.5 - 5.5 PSI. Wide open throttle I've had boost up to 7.5PSI.

I installed it myself and for the most part a competent wrench turner can pull this off. Before the installation I replaced the tension and deflection pulleys, removed my power pulley and went back to stock, replaced the spark plugs, and addressed the rod bearings. If I had to do it over I would have done throttle actuators as well but I had a time crunch. I had a buddy help me for the last 75% of the project and that extra set of hands made a big difference.

The kit itself had an issue with the alignment of the SC mounts to the holes in the supercharger; I've heard that report from myself and 2 others who've done recent installs. I guess you can call that a common bug. In my kit, the cobra clamps were not properly sourced (wrong number of certain sizes) and I had to make a run for screw hose clamps. Nothing too serious or unworkable. Apart from the prep work I described above, I took about 3 hours breaking the car down and getting everything exposed. Then I went on vacation and returned a week later ready to go. Up and in the garage at around 6am on a Sunday, and I had the car fired up by 9pm. Took about 2 hours to get everything back together the next morning.

I made two errors on the installation: I torqued the deflection pulley too far and that caused it to rub on the water pump pulley, slowing the deflection pulley down. That caused a speed mismatch between the accessory belt and the deflection pulley - the resulting friction melted the belt and caused accessory belt failure on the maiden drive. Thankfully I still had the original pulley and a spare accessory belt and was back on the road quickly. Recommend having two fresh belts for both positions and not throwing away parts. Problem #2 was that I became distracted by the SC mount/SC mounting hole misalignment issue and missed torquing the boots down. I had some power but not all of it and that ended up messing up the adaptations and my boost at high RPMs. Once the throttle boots were properly torqued and adaptations reset, the unit has run well. (I also somehow ran the battery down despite the car being on a trickle charger; that gave me some battery discharge errors to sort through but I recharged the battery and that's been fine since)

The kit on the heavier convertible is a really nice match. I have fresh Michelin Sport all season 4's on the car with the stock 19" wheels. At least with summer driving, I have zero need to go to wider tires. The car does a real nice job holding the power down to the pavement but I could definitely see the reports from others in the lighter e90/e92 of needing more tire on the ground to prevent spinning. The stock DCT e93 is rated at 0-60 in 4.7 seconds. I've clocked the harrop s/c'd e93 DCT with test pipes at 4.0 and 4.1 seconds. I might be able to pull off a 3.9 in the proper conditions. So essentially this kit makes the convertible about as fast or a touch faster than the stock e92, and the same 0-60 of a 2021 porsche 911 coupe. That's quite an accomplishment for a platform that is 13 years old.

Much like the stock S65, the kit really shines on the freeway with freeway speed acceleration and maneuvering. I agree with others that the car drives like a sport bike on the freeway and you have to be extra alert as other drivers won't recognize how quickly you can move around them. Just this morning I had a minivan aggressively on my tail at a freeway interchange. I'm like, really? I dropped the DCT down into 4th and 3 seconds later the guy wasn't even visible in my rearview mirror any longer and the speedometer showed 115. Of course, this was in Mexico.

Any regrets? I'm still appreciating the kit for what it is and being my first supercharger, it's hard for me to say how good this is compared to a centrifugal blower in terms of daily driver drivability. I was expecting a bigger difference in the torque-feel of the car at lower speeds, but I think the 0-60 says it all. The price is a little eye watering and depending on what else you will do to the car as a result, like the list above, plus or minus wider tires in a coupe or sedan, it does add up. Part of me has toyed with the idea that my money would have been better spent on an exhaust upgrade and a carbon fiber plenum - but that's with hindsight and acknowledging that whatever power/speed I end up with I'll adjust to and later want more. Such is the pain of human existence. I would say that the only real regret at this point is the loss of the induction note I had with an aFe conical filter air intake. Back in the factory air box plus the whine of the SC - that to me is a step backward but to each his own. I get feedback from others that they love the whine. Also just a note that mileage has dropped off about 30% (18-19 mpg summer to 14-16mpg SC'd), so it does make a vulnerability of the platform a little more ouchy but I just try not to think about it. All of this said, I'm in no way considering going back to stock and selling the unit. so you can't have it!!! Cheers, everyone.

Excellent review! And I would agree with your assessment of the system as well!

I also had a misalignment of the mounting holes, and after fighting with things for an hour or so I made ovals out of the 2 holes on the passenger side. The drivers side lined up very close, but the others were off by about 2mm. This was rather disappointing for a system that costs over 5 figures but at that point I was not about to box it back up and return it.

Honestly, I am still a little disappointed in the performance as a whole. Not a fault of the system itself however. There was a shortage of injectors at the time and so I had to go with a non-standard set. As a result I think I am going to have to get some fine tuning done before I will be able to realize the full potential of the system. Right now I have some stumbling at times and in certain throttle positions. I have not had time to get a dyno session to get some data back to Mike, but it is clear I am going to have to.

[drwankel]

Originally Posted by tbuck

Right now I have some stumbling at times and in certain throttle positions. I have not had time to get a dyno session to get some data back to Mike, but it is clear I am going to have to.

Wouldn't happen to be around 3500RPM would it?

[tbuck]

Originally Posted by drwankel

Wouldn't happen to be around 3500RPM would it?

No, generally middle RPM's are good. At WOT it will stutter right after a gear change. Was thinking maybe MDM was doing that originally, but with everything off it is still doing it. Off the line if I give it WOT it will also stumble a little, however if I roll into it there is no such issue. The exhaust tips get black very quickly so am thinking we are running rich. I am sure Mike will be able to get it sorted once I can get him some data from a dyno.

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

Congratulations about your new infant. I understand about the need to tip-toe.. Typically it doesn't last too long. The tip-toeing I mean..

Installed the racing plugs, fresh 300V oil, and a quick drive to the dyno for NASA. Car drives great! Honestly I don't notice any improvement / difference from the previous plugs. First dyno pull was very odd as it dipped high in the RPM band. The car figured itself out.

Consecutive pulls saw material increases ending at 539/420 before I called it as I don't need anything higher. Already in TT1 with those numbers…

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by DRLane

Installed the racing plugs, fresh 300V oil, and a quick drive to the dyno for NASA. Car drives great! Honestly I don't notice any improvement / difference from the previous plugs. First dyno pull was very odd as it dipped high in the RPM band. The car figured itself out.

Consecutive pulls saw material increases ending at 539/420 before I called it as I don't need anything higher. Already in TT1 with those numbers…

Good numbers IMO for the Harrop SC - especially the 5K torque numbers. Glad all is well. I think you're going to luv those plugs and their long service interval. Thanks for the update.

[MPACT]

Originally Posted by DRLane

Installed the racing plugs, fresh 300V oil, and a quick drive to the dyno for NASA. Car drives great! Honestly I don't notice any improvement / difference from the previous plugs. First dyno pull was very odd as it dipped high in the RPM band. The car figured itself out.

Consecutive pulls saw material increases ending at 539/420 before I called it as I don't need anything higher. Already in TT1 with those numbers…

Thanks for sharing! That is really strong for STG1, DRLane what are your mods? I just installed my Harrop and after having an ESS625 that put down, 533rwhp, I know my kit is quite a bit shy of that power level.

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by MPACT

Thanks for sharing! That is really strong for STG1, DRLane what are your mods? I just installed my Harrop and after having an ESS625 that put down, 533rwhp, I know my kit is quite a bit shy of that power level.

That is a good question, but whatever his mods are they seem to let the Harrop 'breathe". I hope DRLane will chime in with his mods list and let us know the secret sauce applied to get those numbers. I'm guessing catless (or very high flow cats), maybe new headers, high flow air filter, a dash of E85 or at least 93 E10, BPM ECU Stage 2 flash (for Harrop?), NGK Racing plugs (one step cooler), higher flow back box mufflers.. Am I close..?

[drwankel]

Thanks for confirming the plugs work well!

[tbuck]

I think he has said he is running Stage 2 setup.

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by tbuck

I think he has said he is running Stage 2 setup.

Sorry guys this is a unique setup. Not quite stg 2 but more boost than stg 1 to account for high altitude in CO. Running about 8-8.5 lbs.